Need advice on beginner plane

[Frank Voikel]

Hello.
As you can tell, this is my first post on Wattflyer. I've been hanging around and reading threads here for several weeks now so I know how it works.

I am almost completely new to RC flight. A year or two ago, I got a Hobbyzone Firebird Commander. After sucessfully crashing it 3 times on the first battery (I had no one to help me), it was given a special place on a dusty shelf. However, about two months ago I decided to take it out again. I had much better luck and it felt good to fly. I charged it up again and flew again. I rediscovered flight. But keep in mind, I'm still a beginner. I underestimated the wind my fifth time out and foolishly launched the plane downwind. After about a minute of good flying, it started to get blown out of sight. I lost it over a treeline and haven't found it yet despite over seven hours of searching. I'm looking for some sort of plane as a replacement for it.

These are the requirements for the plane:
Must be inexpensive... I am in school and will be paying for this plane off of lawnmowing money. I'm trying to stick in the less than $175 range.
It also has to be fairly easy to fly. Even though I have had some flight experience, it's not enough.
It can't be ARF or scratchbuilt. I don't have the time or resources to do any of that.
Aaannndd...
It needs to be good enough to withstand a few crashes.

Finally, I want it to be able to take me up to the F-27B Stryker. Ailerons wouldn't be necessary, but would be nice to have.

For those EasyStar fanatics out there, I've heard that it's a good plane but I just don't like the look of it. Sorry.

And sorry about the length of my rambling post.

[HoaRC]

I'm sort of a poor college student. These 2 airplanes were the first in my fleet; had lots of pleasant worry-free flights. Both are 2-channel (left/right turn and throttle; no rudder, no elevator, no aileron)

Large plane: Used Firebird Outlaw for $10-25 on ebay. There a tons of non-flying model, raidentech junk, useless old radio gear on ebay. But if you search for Firebird Outlaw you will find a n awesome 2-channel plane. The only Firebird model that works (Scout, Commender, etc don't work). I got the Outlaw for $10 on ebay and found it to be a stable, reliable flyer (in 5mph wind) Also realistic contro and unbreakable plastic. The wing, tail and battery are $10 on ebay or $15 in a hobby shop. I got 3 at a HobbyTown and on Ebay for the extra flight time, same battery as Firebird Scout. Just a little too big to fly on a soccer field with people around, but if you crash into people, the propellers face backwards probably and won't siriously cut and injure them. Just a little to get you sued.. :) Flies away on its own (like any 2 channel plane) in 7mph+ wind even with the throttle off.

Firebird Outlaw Coolest Video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZduOTvpmV4s)

Promotional Video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNG9qFSfHGc)

Small: Aero Ace (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNfY250_F-E) I got one for $40 on ebay. Just reinforce the tail and add a pennyweight to the nose.

SPEND ALL YOUR LAWNMOWING MONEY AND HAVE FUN!

Well, as far as I know, there are good RTF 3-4 channel airplanes for just $25-75 more than your budget. Or you could go with a used model on ebay. This fall, I saw a working Riot 3D with everything but the lipo charger go for 120 on ebay. Maybe you can find a good deal like that?

[Frank Voikel]

Those seem a bit too cheapo.
I looked at the Outlaw when I was trying to find a plane two years ago. It would grow with me for a few weeks, then I would be forced to spend more money to get a better plane. I'd prefer to get a more expensive plane in the first place rather than taking all of those little steps.
I believe my situation is kinda similar to that of Aircruiser (just a little bit north of me) except for that he isn't a complete beginner.

[AEAJR]

Hello.
As you can tell, this is my first post on Wattflyer. I've been hanging around and reading threads here for several weeks now so I know how it works.

I am almost completely new to RC flight. A year or two ago, I got a Hobbyzone Firebird Commander. After sucessfully crashing it 3 times on the first battery (I had no one to help me), it was given a special place on a dusty shelf. However, about two months ago I decided to take it out again. I had much better luck and it felt good to fly. I charged it up again and flew again. I rediscovered flight. But keep in mind, I'm still a beginner. I underestimated the wind my fifth time out and foolishly launched the plane downwind. After about a minute of good flying, it started to get blown out of sight. I lost it over a treeline and haven't found it yet despite over seven hours of searching. I'm looking for some sort of plane as a replacement for it.

These are the requirements for the plane:
Must be inexpensive... I am in junior high and will be paying for this plane off of lawnmowing money. I'm trying to stick in the less than $175 range.
It also has to be fairly easy to fly. Even though I have had some flight experience, it's not enough.
It can't be ARF or scratchbuilt. I don't have the time or resources to do any of that.
Aaannndd...
It needs to be good enough to withstand a few crashes.

Finally, I want it to be able to take me up to the F-27B Stryker. Ailerons wouldn't be necessary, but would be nice to have.

For those EasyStar fanatics out there, I've heard that it's a good plane but I just don't like the look of it. Sorry.

And sorry about the length of my rambling post.

Congratulations on your success with your Commander, right up till the wind took it. Don't feel bad, that can easily happen with two channel planes.

Here are some suggestions in the order of recommendation. I understand the Easy Star is out, but it is a great first 3 channel plane.

Make sure you read this before your first flight:

Six Keys to Success for new e-flyers
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=355208 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=355208)

HobbyZone Super Cub - $159
This is the only semi-scale plane on my list. It takes the same Xport accessories as other HobbyZone and ParkZone planes so you can drop bombs, parachutes and attach other accessories to extend your fun. It has a steerable tail wheel so
you can effectively taxi the plane. Great for ROG launches.
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=HBZ7100 (http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=HBZ7100)
Photos and Videos
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/ProductGallery.aspx?ProdID=HBZ7100 (http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/ProductGallery.aspx?ProdID=HBZ7100)
Other Excellent Video - Hi res for high speed connect users
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=567625#post6040744 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=567625#post6040744)
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showatt.php?attachmentid=1051938 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showatt.php?attachmentid=1051938)
manual
http://www.horizonhobby.com/ProdInfo/Files/HBZSuperCubManualCropped.pdf (http://www.horizonhobby.com/ProdInfo/Files/HBZSuperCubManualCropped.pdf)
Discussions on the Forums
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12218 (http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12218)
http://forums.radiocontrolzone.com/showthread.php?p=2130521#post2130521 (http://forums.radiocontrolzone.com/showthread.php?p=2130521#post2130521)
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=593044#post6385310 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=593044#post6385310)
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=550899 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=550899)


T-Hawk - RTF - Excellent Value - $160-170
This company is really putting together some outstanding
packages. I have flown the T-Hawk. Excellent first plane.
Get the Extreme value package. It comes with an extra wing,
tail and battery. This plane stands up to hard landings
Can be flown on 27 MHz or 72 MHz
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawk3chrtf.html (http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawk3chrtf.html)
T-Hawk - Without Radio - add your radio and receiver
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/wittran.html (http://www.readytoflyfun.com/wittran.html)
T-Hawk Buddy Box 72 MHz trainer system - $279
This is really unique!
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/t72rtfpatrpa.html (http://www.readytoflyfun.com/t72rtfpatrpa.html)
T-Hawk Discussion Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=243202&highlight=THawk (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=243202&highlight=THawk)
Videos
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawkvideos.html (http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawkvideos.html)


Aerobird Challenger - RTF Electric - $110 -
I started on an Aerobird RTF. I have hundreds of flights on
my Aerobirds. I also thermal and slope soar this plane.
Flies well and stands up to hard
landings. Their add on fun accessories for night flying,
air to air combat and drop module add to the fun! The
combat module makes a great lost
plane locator, even if you don't plan to fly combat. Great
keep in the car plane - take off the wing and it goes back
in the box fully assembled. Most can't do that!
http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_planes_hobbyzone_aerobird_challenger.htm (http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_planes_hobbyzone_aerobird_challenger.htm)
Review
http://www.hobbyzonesports.com/Discover/Articles.aspx?ArticleID=1289#Page01 (http://www.hobbyzonesports.com/Discover/Articles.aspx?ArticleID=1289#Page01)
Discussion Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=147621 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=147621)
Video
http://www.parkflyers.com/html/aerobird_video.html (http://www.parkflyers.com/html/aerobird_video.html)
http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_videos/aerobird_challenger_loops.wmv (http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_videos/aerobird_challenger_loops.wmv)


One of these will get you flying!

[Frank Voikel]

I knew you'd respond, Ed. Thanks! Currently, I'm kinda leaning towards the Challenger (or the Aerobird 3 when that comes out). I know that some folks have a pessimistic attitude toward the HZ birds, but I was happy with my Commander. That thing was practically unbreakable. It survived a stall-induced nosedive at WOT from 50', two seperate falls from trees, several hard noseovers, and one strange incident where I was doing an overhead flyby (a no-no for beginner pilots). As I turned around to see where it was going, I realized there was a pine tree obstructing my path. I turned, but a branch clipped the wingtip. The plane rotated several times around before landing perfectly upright on the ground.
Besides the stories of boom breaks, I have heard good things about the HZ planes.

[spitace]

I can put in a word for the T-Hawk, i have one, it is my first and only plane, but it flies like a charm, and its great for a complete beginner.
the only downside i found was the instruction manual, it left a lot to be desired, luckily i learnt on buddy box, but i bought a Aussie version, so yours may be different.

Hope this helps,
Spit

[Tinman]

Welcome to Wattflyer Frank.

I'm putting a good word in for the HobbyZone Super Cub. It was my first plane and I love it. I really like the scale appearance of it. It has plenty of power and is easy to control. Also if you order it here

http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_planes_hobbyzone_super_cub.htm

you get free shipping, no tax, and a extra battery. This is where I got mine from.

When I first put the cub together I thought it was a little flimsy being made of foam. However after a few flights and not so pretty landings you'll realize that the plane is extremely durable.. I hit a flag pole the other day and snapped the wing in half. A little gorilla glue and packing tape and its like brand new.

Thats my 2 cents :) Happy flying

[Leo L]

Frank,

Welcome to R/C flying.

Ed gave you a terrific list of planes. From my experience in working with beginner flyers, I would recommend the SuperCub. Its a terrific plane that is easy to fly, is very damage resistant, yet has good performance that will keep you interested for some time to come.

However, since you were happy with your Commander, the Aerobird Challenger is a good selection as well. I started flying 2 years ago with the Firebird Commander. After a good learning curve, including learning how to retrieve a plane from a tree (several times), searching for a plane trough marsh (also several times), I finally beat it to death and moved on to the Aerobird Challenger. It was a very easy step from the Commander and the Aerobird can be flown almost entirely without using the elevator, while you are getting used to it. You can take off and let it climb to altitude just using 2-channels like the Commander. Then, when at good flying altitude, experiment with the elevator controls. Finally, when time to land, use 2-channel control again. My Aerobird has been through a lot, and its mostly retired now, only seeing action in the winterr when I fly it with skis that I made for it.

If you decide on the Aerobird, you will be happy with your decission. However, if I was starting all over again, I would go for the SuperCub!

[Frank Voikel]

Thanks for your input, everybody! I definitely need some more research and input before I spring for any one plane. If you own a plane from Ed Anderson's list, it'd be nice if you could put down some positives and negatives to help me make a decision. Thanks!

[Balil]

im going to say this 1 time and one time only, if you want the stryker, GET THE STRYKER! i bought the brushless stryker a week ago, i have minimal aileron experience and i had never flown a delta wing. opened the box, charged the battery, threw it in the air and WHAM im flying a wing, remember altitude and airspeed is what is going to keep your plane alive, fly it high and fly it fast. start out with large circles around the field, always keeping the plane infront of you. as you get confident with the large circles *this will take time* then attempt areobatics. as for landing, the glide rate of the stryker is very gentle, cut the throttle, add a little up elevator, and let her float down, apply full up elevator just before touch down to flare the plane for a nice easy landing. the stryker is a blast to fly and honestly it is the best $250 i have ever spent since ive been flying rc. the sun is up, batteries are charged, i'll catch you guys in the sky..

[CitaFly]

Here's a detailed review of the Super Cub:

http://www.ampaviators.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=25&Itemid=28

Look at the video at the end of the article - it shows how tough the SC is - other articles show how the SC can be upgraded as your skills increase. An excellent trainer for about $150.

[darylm44]

I have learned by myself on a Wing Dragon. It is a good plane, easy to fly, tuff to hurt, easy to fix, and upgradeable with a new wing to 4 channels when you are ready.

It certainly is not the only good trainer but it has worked well for me and sells for less than $90.00 ready to fly with Tx.

[Tinman]

The only real negative I have about the Super Cub is it's speed....

I didn't know it was so fast... (well its not fast but the first few times I thought it was screaming)

Just make sure you power back a little if you get it.

A big positive is the steerable tail wheel. Its good practice to taxi the little plane around before you fly it. (fun too) Plus its a good way to break the motor in and get use to the plane coming toward you (reverse controls)

:) Whatever you decide there will be lots of help here

[Frank Voikel]

In under one day, I've been swamped with helpful responses from 8 different people. Thanks! I just have to figure out what it will come down to- price, preformance, a good compromise, etc...
More opinions would help!

[JoeBruce]

I went with the Aerobird Challenger and haven't been sorry. It has taken a lot of abuse, including a half-throttle, straight down dive from 50' (and the minimal damage from that was easy to fix). I won't say its indestructible, but it really takes a beating, that's for sure!

My only regret is not having enough time to fly it much! :(

[Frank Voikel]

Okay... I think I got this. In order for me to have enough experience to not continually crash the Stryker, it's going to be a 3-step progression (unless someone suggests otherwise). The first plane will be one of the three Ed listed, followed by an intermediate plane of which I don't know the model yet (but hopefully one with ailerons) and then the Stryker.
Any:
A) ideas on whether or not this is a good idea
B) suggestions for the intermediate plane
C) recommendations for the beginner plane out of the three that Ed Anderson suggested

I'm kinda leaning towards the Super Cub, as it has the controllable tail wheel (and I have a paved area in which to take off and land)...

[AEAJR]

There is a good chance you will be able to go from the first plane directly to the Stryker, but your plan is still a good one.

[CitaFly]

I agree with Ed - a good plan and depending on how you progress, your second plane could be the Stryker. Fly the Super Cub for at least 50 flights and by that time you should be comfortable with loops, stalls, making it do what you want and landing the plane where you want.

Most important, you should have internalized how to control the plane when it's coming towards you and going away from you without thinking about it.

Then you're ready.

[Tinman]

Okay... I think I got this. In order for me to have enough experience to not continually crash the Stryker, it's going to be a 3-step progression (unless someone suggests otherwise). The first plane will be one of the three Ed listed, followed by an intermediate plane of which I don't know the model yet (but hopefully one with ailerons) and then the Stryker.
Any:
A) ideas on whether or not this is a good idea
B) suggestions for the intermediate plane
C) recommendations for the beginner plane out of the three that Ed Anderson suggested

I'm kinda leaning towards the Super Cub, as it has the controllable tail wheel (and I have a paved area in which to take off and land)...

Hi Farnk! I think if you go with the Super Cub (I have it and like it) and fly it all the time. Get comfortable flying it really slow, really fast, do spins loops etc you should be fin flying a stryker. Just log a lot of flights with the cub :)

[AEAJR]

I recommend the Super Cub for self trainers for a lot of reasons.

It takes off well from the ground or from a hand launch

It is large enough that you can see it easily eve at some distance

The foam is very tough and is easy to fix.

It has a pleasing appearence in the air so you can be happy to show it to people.

It has plenty of power to climb but you can cut way way back to fly slowly.

Handles wind pretty well with an experienced pilot at the sticks.

Takes the X port fun modules. Try dropping bombs and streamers. Great for precision practice.

Positive reports outnumber negative reports 100 to one.

You will love it!

[CitaFly]

Ed - that's a very nice summary!

[Frank Voikel]

Okay. I've revised my plan.
Due to several people suggesting it, I'll go to a two-step system.
If I get good enough at the Super Cub, I might do several things to help me stretch it as far as it can go. If any of these are bad ideas, let me know.
o Upgrade to a bigger battery (maybe a lipo which could be transferred to the Stryker) and all that this entails (the charger, the ESC, the better prop)
o Do the aileron mod
o Add the GWS floats to make it a floatplane for our boating trips

When I order it, should I get a couple of extra GWS props (maybe the 11x8 or the 10x6) in case of crashes? Or maybe other little repair items?
My parents are going to get really annoyed if I near-continuously ask them to drive me to the LHS for repair parts. I'd prefer to get them now.
Tipoff to CitaFly's site (http://www.ampaviators.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=38&Itemid=28) for the prop information :cool:

[TexasRCFlyer]

Okay. I've revised my plan.
Due to several people suggesting it, I'll go to a two-step system.
If I get good enough at the Super Cub, I might do several things to help me stretch it as far as it can go. If any of these are bad ideas, let me know.
o Upgrade to a bigger battery (maybe a lipo which could be transferred to the Stryker) and all that this entails (the charger, the ESC, the better prop)
o Do the aileron mod
o Add the GWS floats to make it a floatplane for our boating trips

When I order it, should I get a couple of extra GWS props (maybe the 11x8 or the 10x6) in case of crashes? Or maybe other little repair items?
My parents are going to get really annoyed if I near-continuously ask them to drive me to the LHS for repair parts. I'd prefer to get them now.
Tipoff to CitaFly's site (http://www.ampaviators.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=38&Itemid=28) for the prop information :cool:

Ok heres my two cents. The lipo for the SuperCub will most likely not work (at least not a long flight) in the stryker.

For your first plane, I would go with the Super Cub. I have not been happy with the whole aerobird line. I dont think they have near enough power to pull you out of a problem and the control surfaces are way to small. They basically teach you full control stick input everyway. The Super Cub has HUGE control surfaces and you can practice subtle movement on the sticks which is what you will have to do once you get into the ARF and larger type planes.

The aileron mod is a good idea
floats a good idea and always extra props, especially on non-pusher planes where the prop is in the front.

I dont know about the idea of going from a three channel straight to a stryker. But what I would do, the intermediate aileron trainer will cost at least between $150-200. Instead of buying that intermediate plane, I would get a simulator. G3 or FSOne. With sim time on ailerons and real time with a good 3channel like the Super Cub, I think you would be okay going straight to the Stryker plus the simulator will last your forever. That will come in handy on windy days and as you progress in the hobby.

[AEAJR]

Okay. I've revised my plan.
:cool:

Don't over plan this.

Get the Super Cub and just learn to fly it. Have fun and enjoy the plane. Get 1-2 extra battery packs and at least 2 props. Get HobbyZone props, not GWS. If you start changing the prop with different sizes you may burn out the ESC or the motor or both.

This is about flying, not about modifying the plane. The plane has plenty of power and handles well.

Six Keys to Success - Read and follow!
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18 (http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18)

If you are going to be your own instructor, then understand what an instructor would teach you.

Teaching Someone To Fly - Tools and Techniques
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5767 (http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5767)

Why Join a Club? - It is a real good idea.
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=232 (http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=232)

The Cub will thermal - give it a try
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195728 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195728)

Get tips from those who already have the plane
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10351 (http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10351)

After you are REALLY good with the Cub and can launch and land it properly EVERYTIME, when flying in calm, in wind and have total control in the air, you can work on aerobatics with it.

At that point you will likely be ready for the Stryker. I would say this is at least 100 flights, so better get started!

[Frank Voikel]

Quick question... I'm looking at different RC sites to try to determine where to get the Super Cub. I looked at Hobb-E-Mart, and they had a SC for $61 with one day left. Should I bid?

Also, there was an Aerobird Xtreme and an Aerobird Swift that were still at the starting price of $1 with two and one days left, respectively. I am capable of waiting for a plane, but it'd be awful nice to get the Xtreme or Swift for pennies plus shipping. I could work on one of those until I get the Super Cub. Good idea?

I have a few hundred bucks saved up, so I can afford to do it. It's just that I'm a penny-pinching miser. If I come across something pricey that I like, I'll save up the money to buy it (plus some) even if I already have the money to buy five of said item.

[Balil]

all 3 of said planes will teach you to fly, i would imagine that the swift will be more challenging to fly because of it having ailerons, but on the flipside learning with ailerons instead of a rudder will be more usefull in later models because its the main way of yawing (turning) the plane.

[constantCrash]

I've never bought from them, but www.HobbyZone.com has a deal where you buy the cub for regular price and get a free extra battery.

I love my cub.

[Tinman]

I've never bought from them, but www.HobbyZone.com (http://www.HobbyZone.com) has a deal where you buy the cub for regular price and get a free extra battery.

I love my cub.

Yep thats a great deal, it;s where I got mine.....no tax.....no shiping and a free extra battery.

I think its the best deal you'll find. Unless you pick up a used one. (you might not know what your getting)

[AEAJR]

all 3 of said planes will teach you to fly, i wouldimagine that the swift will be more challenging to fly because of ithaving ailerons, but on the flipside learning with ailerons instead ofa rudder will be more usefull in later models because its the main wayof yawing (turning) the plane.

This is not correct. For those who want to learn a little more about how a plane is controlled read on. Everyone else skip this post.

There are three axis of control :

Pitch - this changes the angle of attack, AOA, of the wing. You can think of pitch as up and down but it is really an AOA control. By changing the AOA we change the lift characteristic of the wing.

Roll - This control rotates the wings about the axis of the fuselage. We also call this "banking" the plane. Roll is the primary method used for turning your plane. By redirecting the lift of the wings in the direction you want to turn,the lift force will take the plane in that direction. We often add "up"once we have rolled which increases the angle ofattack of the wings to increase the lift generated by the wing in the direction we want to go. As "up" is normally into the turn when we are rolled, up will increase the rate of the turn. This is some times called bank and pull or bank and crank turning.

Yaw - the rotation of the plane around a point near the Center of Gravity of the plane, as if it were hanging from a string at that point. This would move the tail/nose left and right along a flat plane.Yaw alone will cause a flat winged plane to skid along in the direction it was traveling until the drag of the fin and fuselage push it over . This is not a primary turning method.

Yaw control is useful for "crabbing" into the wind on landing approach or keeping the nose up in a knife edge, as well as other things.

Dihedral or polyhedral - This is the up sweep of the wing seen in some planes. In rudder only planes this is necessary so that the rudder, incombination with the wing dihedral can bank the plane. As we yaw the plane, using the rudder, we present one uplifted wing tip to the oncoming air stream, which increases the lift on that tip while decreasing the lift on the opposite wing. This causes the wings to roll which will result in a turn. Again we can increase the AOA, add "up", to increase the rate of turn. When we remove the yaw force,straighten the rudder,the dihedral in the wings will tend to return the plane tolevel flight. That is why beginner planes, whether they have ailerons or not, tend to have significant dihedral in the wings, it makes them more self correcting.

Many plane with ailerons also have dihedral in the wings but here it is primarily for stability as the ailerons will be used most of the time to roll the plane.


Pitch is controlled by motor speed, elevator, canard, elevons, or a combination depending on the design of the plane.

Roll, your primary turning control, is handled by the ailerons,wingerons, elevons or, nn planes without ailerons, roll is produced by combination of rudder and wing dihedral. Roll is always your primary turning control.

On planes that have ailerons and a rudder, yaw is a secondary turning assist to provide smoother turns and more efficient turns in combination with the ailerons.

Yaw control, via the rudder is very important in many acrobatic moves.The yaw control is also your primary directional control on the ground.This is done with the rudder or a combination of rudder and aturnable ground wheel. In many cases the ground wheel is attached to the rudder itself.

So, pitch, roll and yaw are your control axis. They can be controlled by a variety of methods depending on the design of the aircraft. Certainly helicopters also have these control axis but they use different methods than fixed wing aircraft.

If we add the speed control, we can relate this to the control sticks using Mode 2 layout, which is the standard in North America.

In Mode 2 we have pitch and roll on the right stick and speed and yaw on the left stick. What surfaces and devices those sticks control depends on the design of the aircraft. For example, sometimes rudder is on the right stick and sometimes it is on the left. Sometimes throttle is on the left stick as our speed control and sometimes, as in the case of gliders, we tend to put the flaps on the left stick as our speed control.

If you think in terms of pitch, roll, yaw and speed, your controls always make sense regardless of what type of aircraft you are flying.

[Frank Voikel]

Thanks for the directional terminology tips...

Looking around, the best deal I've found on a brand new SC is at Diversion Hobbies (.com). Free shipping, extra batt, no tax, and the Aerial Drop Module for the normal price.
Hobb-E-Mart sells brand new and used planes, all with some sort of defect. If Horizon can't sell it for some reason, it goes there (I think...). Defects range from scratches on the wing and cosmetic damage to dead servos, RXs and ESCs.

I'm considering buying from either of them.

[Tinman]

The Diversion Hobbies deal sounds really good.

[Frank Voikel]

Okay... After all of the helpful recommendations, hints, and tips I have received here, I'm now actively looking for a plane on ebay and elsewhere.
My battle plan follows:
o Get either the HZ Super Cub or the HZ Slo-V as a first plane
o Get one of the PZ warbirds as an introductory aileron plane.
o Get the Stryker (B because my parents are strongly against the C and its speed... I might have to upgrade it behind their backs...)

I'm going in!

[KEEBLE]

I Recently Saw A Piper Style Very Accuarately Plane In Red Or Blue, Suggested As A New Trainer Or Bebinner Ertf. It Had Low Wing To Fusealage Like Piper Or Bonanza Plane. I Think It Had Single Enigine And Made Of Foaam. Does Anyone Have Idea What I Viewed Or What Plane I Might Have Been Suggested To////

[SaucerGuy]

Get the fastest, least durable, most insane plane on the market and instead of taking it out of it's box, toss it instantly into the garbage can,........... he he

Keep your ears open as to what everybody is going to tell you to get, make your decisions based upon that before you spend the dough. This place, and other forums in general will help you make an educated decision purchase wise above and beyond any place else, believe me, I spent way too much on stuff I either couldn't handle, or didn't need, or worse, went completely obsolete.

The majority here usually has a well rounded, yet when it comes to specifics, knowledgable point of view since we've been in your shoes at one time and constantly compare it to what's on the market today, just some lose track of those memories some times, most do not.

You are in for alot of fun with this hobby, it's something you just have to fully experience that cannot be put into words.

[agin]

One of the things I have not seen here are component electronics as opposed to an all in 1 type set up. It is cheaper to replace a part than it is to replace the whole unit. You may also want to transfer some the parts to your next toy.

I also watch E-bay and there are some deals there. I am always going to add more dings so what does it matter if I start with a few. I got my son a new in the box T-Hawk for $72 on E-Bay.

Good Luck

Also one more plane I have heard is a good trainer is the BeginAir. It is 4 Channel.

[Frank Voikel]

Yeah, I'm going for the Super Cub.
I bid on one last night and got outbid by a buck. Soo close!

[Tinman]

You can't go wrong with the Super Cub, good choice!

[Frank Voikel]

Oh yeah!
I got it!
$91 plus $17.50 S&H, coming to a total of 108.50 for a nice Super Cub!

Should be here by next Friday, I'll maiden it and post a Super Cub Maiden thread here then.

[Tinman]

Wow thats a great deal!!

[mjohnston23]

Quick question. What's the difference between a slowflyer propeller and a regular propeller? I've tried both and haven't noticed a difference? Thanks.

[CitaFly]

Props explained here:

http://www.ampaviators.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=66&Itemid=27

You'll definitely see a difference using a wattmeter or measuring rpms.

[AEAJR]

CitaFly,

That is one fine article. Thanks for writing it and making it available.

[Frank Voikel]

That was just what I needed. I will be getting some replacement props for the Super Cub, and I needed to clarify which ones to get. That article was perfect.

Thanks!

[mjohnston23]

Thanks for that link. That makes all the difference in the world! WATTFLYER RULES!!