Trainer Master, sort of.

[pd1]

I didn't locate any plans, and I decided to start building from memory.
I was tempted to buy a kit, but I had all the ribs, and I was going to change the fuse structure anyway, so it's head down and plow ahead.

Got the wing done, only changes from original is I used 1/16 sheet instead of 3/32 sheet on wings.
Oh, and I installed a dowell for wing hold down, and filled the rear for bolt holes.

Started plans of fuse, from memory, had a couple of former halves just laying around.

Made the box locs and dry fit the formers, waiting for glue to dry for the rear fuse sides to box locs now. I'm using 3/16 for the boxes instead of the 3/8. I'm also using 3/32 for the sides instead of 1/8.

The plane is built like a tank anyway.

This plane will vary from the original so it won't be truly "vintage", but some of the parts are 35 to 40 years old, that's got to count for something.

If anyone wants to post pictures of your Trainermasters, please post them here.

[pd1]

Not that anyone is reading this stuff, but here's a few more pictures.

I was missing one former and I had to plot one out for the rear of the plane.

Now I remember why I don't like lofting stringer locations.

Motor mount drilled for E-Flite 25. Motor was looking for a home.

The wing has a couple of coats of dope, and is ready for silk.

This time I'm going to remove the plans before I cover the wing.

[pd1]

The wing is now mounted, nose gear mount is also in.
Finished the nose sheeting, still have to cut out the cockpits.

I'm going to add blocks to the nose to fair the fuselage to a spinner.
Funny thing is, I don't like carving and sanding.

In the bottom shot of the fuselage, the fuselage looks bowed.
It's not, it's just something the camera angle did.

If anyone knows where I can buy a canopy please let me know.

Since I'm not using original plans, and my plane may vary in dimensions,
I should probably should change the name, something similar but different.

[pd1]

Acouple of shots of the nose shaped, and on the gear.

[smokejohnson]

Great work pd1, I'm not familiar with the plane you are building but you have to love a balsa build. It kind of has an Astro Hog look...but not really I guess. What is the wingspan and estimated AUW? What are you going to power it with?

[pd1]

SJ, Here's a couple of shots of two of the Trainermasters I had.
Old ones about 5 pounds.
The one for the record was 4.25 pounds.
With a .60 on it.

This one will be powered by an E-Flite 25
Wingspan 54 inches, estimated weight 3 pounds.

Right now the fuse weighs 7.5 ounces without gear and the wing is 10.5 ounces.
Wing, fuse, gear, wheels, and motor weight 1 pound 12 ounces.

I do like balsa, but balsa doesn't seem to like me.
I'm developing a sensitivity to balsa dust, again.

This will most likely be my last balsa build for a few weeks.

Every five or six planes this happens to me.
Time to build my GWS kits.

[smokejohnson]

Sweet. Looking forward to seeing this one come together. What do you use for covering?

The last plane I covered was a Four Star 60 and I used Monokote. Worked great and came out nice but it's to heavy to use on the small electric I'm building now.

[pd1]

Monocote is my last coice for covering.
I like Ultra cote and Microlite.

My last plane the Mini Taurus was Ultracote.

The Sidewinder delta before that was pieces of Monocote that were left overs.
It reminded me why I like the other coverings.
Sorry for the rant.

I'm going to cover this one with silk and dope.

[smokejohnson]

Excellent choice, I don't know why I assumed iron on.

[pd1]

Excellent choice, I don't know why I assumed iron on.

SJ, I didn't see any assumptions in your question.

I saw a perfectly valid question, I just ranted on about Money cote.
Sometimes I do that, it's uncontrollable.
Old age you know.

My airplanes have been covered with plastic film lately.
My old glow planes didn't last that long, it seemed the more you flew the faster they got oil soaked.

Since the electric last so much longer, and never get oil soaked, I think I'd like to go back to silk and dope for finishes.
I think the electrics are worth the extra effort.
Well, some of them anyway.

I found a place that has good prices for silk, but butyrate dope is another matter.
I just ordered a 5 gal can of butyrate, $156.
$87 for shipping.

[pd1]

Checked the decalage and glued the tail on.
Going to try and get a canopy tomorrow so I can cut the cockpit holes out.
Have to make the control surfaces next.

[pd1]

Ok, the structure is finished, and I made the control surfaces.

Couldn't get a Trainermaster canopy, but I found an Aeromaster canopy I can cut down if I want.

I ordered a canopy for a Great Planes Sportster, maybe that will fit and look good?

Structure weight,fuse, tail, wing, gear, wheels and motor and prop.

2 pounds 2 ounces.

Now to start the covering.

[Cowboy]

pd1
Great looking plane and good job on the whole thread. What is the specific reason for not liking monokote?

[pd1]

pd1
Great looking plane and good job on the whole thread. What is the specific reason for not liking monokote?

Thanks, cowboy.

Mono cote works at a higher temperature than the other coverings, I burn my fingers stretching it around wingtips and the nose of planes.

Ultra cote seals at a lower temperature and seems to shrink a little more, so a wingtip only needs gentle stretching and edge sealing.
Then hit it with a heat gun and it shrinks, and my fingers aren't there.

It's also a little easier to match the colors of Ultracoat.
Here's a shot of another of my planes.
The red on the cheek cowls is Ultracoat spray, it matches the red Ultra coat covering pretty good,

Paul

[Cowboy]

Ok, thanks.
I just haven't tried that many differant brands
and I am always open to better products and
new ways of doing things. Thanks for the answer.

[smokejohnson]

It's looking good Paul. Have you ever made your own cowl? I'm trying to figure out what I want to do on the cowl of my Wasp (http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20662). If I would have had the foresight I think I would have ran my sides further forward like on your TM.

[pd1]

SJ, Yes I've made a few cowls. I just looked at your thread.
I apologize, I haven't been looking at most of the sites.

I'm not familiar with the Wasp, what type of cowl do you want to make?

You can always add 1/4 balsa sheet to the sides and bottom then round it off.

Or do you want to go fancier?

I saw a post, and tried this myself.
It works.

If you make a plug in the shape of the nose.
You can use balsa or pine.

Then put a plastic drinking cup over the plug and heat the cup with a heat gun.
The plastic cup will melt and take the shape of the plug.

Another way is to shape a plug using foam and layer light weight cloth over the plug and coat it with epoxy.

When hard, melt the foam out with thinner or some other solvent.

If you decide to try either of these ,I can supply you with more details.

By the way your build looks very nice, I'll have to investigate a little more.

It's nice to see others building with balsa.
I like foam, just not for everything.

Paul

[smokejohnson]

Thanks Paul, good info. I think I may try the fiberglass cowl. The plans call for drilling a hole through a balsa block and mounting a speed 400 with shims and carving the block to shape. I don't mind using an inrunner to do that method but I don't want heat issues. I think I would feel more comfortable with an open cowl and air flowing around my motor.

[pd1]

Let me know if you need anything.
Paul

[Franny]

Hi pd1,

Great looking airplane! I recognize that little red an white job ;)

Boy you do nice work! and from memory... Looks like it will be a great flyer too. Thanks for sharing!

Franny

[pd1]

Hi pd1,

Great looking airplane! I recognize that little red an white job ;)

Boy you do nice work! and from memory... Looks like it will be a great flyer too. Thanks for sharing!

Franny

Franny, Did you get your red and yellow one flying yet?

What were your power problems?

Paul

[Franny]

Hi Paul, I sent you a PM so as to not hijack your thread...

What color scheme are you thinking of?

Franny

[pd1]

Hi Franny, I love off topic subjects.

I started covering with silk.

Here's the sequence.

1. The balsa has to have a couple of coats of dope first.
To seal the pores.
The silk won't "catch and run" as easily.
Also acts as adhesive when you apply the silk.

2. Silk has a grain to the weave,you want to align the grain lengthwise on the wing.
If you don't the silk will pull in between the ribs and look a little "funny".

3.The silk is cut to the approximate shape, leaving a small overhang.

4. The silk is placed over the area to be covered.

5. The silk is then sprayed with water, I use a small atomizer.
Get the silk completely soaked.

6. Gently pull the wrinkles out, use both hands on either side and pull apart.
Try not to distort the weave.

7. When the wrinkles are out, and the silk is taut dope around the edges to adhere the silk to the wing.

8. When doping let some of the dope coat the edges to be cut off.
When the dope has dried, the silk will cut easier and cleaner where the dope has hardened.

9. Only dope enough to adhere the silk, as the dope drys, it will "blush" or turn white.
This is from humidity, from the water you sprayed.
Later thinned coats will get rid of the "blush".

10. When the water has dried, trim the edges and coat the edges with dope to hold them down.

11. After it has completely dried, use some VERY thin dope, about 80 to 90 per cent thinned, to fill the weave.

12. I like to do all the ribs and structure and let it dry, before trying the open areas

13, The dope that is so thinned will drip through and puddle on the other side, but it is mostly thinner, it will evaporate.
You can reduce drip through by holding the surface vertical and not using excessive amounts of dope.
It usually takes 4 or 5 coats to seal the open areas.

14. Once the open areas are sealed you can go back to less thinned dope.

15. After the covered section starts to shine, wet or dry sand with 300 to 400 grit paper, then coat and sand alternately until you have the finish you desire.

[smokejohnson]

So I am trying to remember I don't think I have ever seen a silk and dope model in person. I am going to assume that it is light as paper right? I think I may try this on my wasp. How durable is it? Looks great.

[Franny]

Hi Paul,

That is a great set of instructions! I used to use silkspan on my CL models growing up. When I started on the larger RC airplanes, I switched over to Monokote, but I think the silkspan was actually easier even if it did take a bit longer. What with birds in the house, I am pretty relegated to iron-ons but I was thinking I might try it in the DVIII - I will have to paint that sheeted wing anyway. I have been using Ultracote lately and find it to be fabulous! Goes on like "butta". I used fabric coverite on my Taube and that rocks too. Really nice. Then I had to do some repairs on the Falcon which was Monokoted 20 years ago and remembered just how difficult that stuff is to work with. If it wasn't for the color match I would have used something else. It is amazing how many different materials we have to choose from and how different they are.

How do you think your final weight compares to something like Ora/Ultracote?

Franny

[pd1]

Japanese tissue is the lightest covering, also the least resistant to punctures.

Silkspan, is another paper product, much heavier that tissue and much stronger.
But not as strong as Monokote.
Over time it will split on it's own.

Silk, is a cloth that is woven and very light.
Silk is the easiest to cover with, it does compound curves very easily.
It is much stronger than the paper products and Monokote.
It just takes more time to do, and yes, the dope stinks up the house.

Nylon, back in the late 50's and early 60's controlline combat was popular, a lot of us started useing nylon because it was cheaper.

Nylon has a coarser grain which was harder to fill, but once done it was indestructable.
Really.

When you crashed, the airplane looked completely intact, what you had was a perfect bag for carrying all the pieces.
Balsa wasn't indestructable.

Sometimes to speed the grain filling process, we would cover the nylon with silkspan.
Nylon curtains were readily available and were cheap, we had many choices for covering.
This was cheap and fast, but we didn't care about weight.

A silk finish with colored silk and clear dope only I think is lighter than most of the plastic films.

Filling the grain untill very smooth and using color can add a fair amount of weight.

I've found if your going for a finish that rivals the plastic film.
You have to completely fill the grain of the wood, before covering.

You can cover a ball with silk.

With a large enough piece of silk I can cover a wing with one piece and have only one seam. It's that flexable.

[Franny]

Hi Paul,

Hey look what I found => http://www.earlyrcmodels.com/ For those of us who like a good kit. I thought you might get a kick out of it.

Franny

[smokejohnson]

Hi Paul, I just wanted to say thanks for breaking that down on the covering material. I may try silk on my Wasp.

How's the TM coming along? Anymore pics?

[smokejohnson]

Franny that's a great link. Nice find.

[pd1]

I just got back from picking a plane up in Atlanta.

Franny, I just found out about them a short time ago myself.
I spoke with the owner of Early RC Models, and his wife, both very nice people.
I ordered a canopy from them.

Franny, you should look into building one of these.

Smoke, I found a good place to get silk. About $2.50 a yard.
And it works well.

Update: The Trainermaster is all covered and the clear is on.
The fuselage has a coat of yellow on it.

If I get some time I hope to finish the yellow tomorrow.
I also try to post pictures tomorrow.

I ran into a few problems with the covering, I'll fill everyone in tomorrow.

[Franny]

Thanks Paul and SJ...

You are right Paul... It looks like a great model! I'll try to get one into the rotation soon. I am still working on my Stearman from AerodromeRC. I have the wings done and the tail feathers. The fuse is next. I took a little break to repair my Gentle Lady that went straight in from about 200' last weekend due to a Spektrum AR6100 receiver re-boot. It wasn't the RX's fault... The ESC's on-board BEC just isn't up to the challenge on three cells if you use the new computerized receivers. When they reboot due to a voltage drop, it can take several seconds. It is amazing just how fast one of these airplanes can come out of the sky... Anyway, the damage was amazingly minimal - just the horizontal stab which caught a tree branch. That was it! The wing and fuse were completely undamaged. Oh, that and I added a set of floats to my Little Gasser. They really are cute as a button. We are heading to Seattle to spend a week on a smaller lake. Should be big fun! Anyway... I'll get back to the Stearman this week.

Looking forward to seeing more build photos!

Franny

[pd1]

Trainermaster update. I think the yellow is finished.
I won't know until I sand it. If I break through, then one more coat.
I have to find some red that's compatible with Randolph butyrate dopes.

I think Sig brand is, if so I'll pick up some tomorrow, or Tuesday.

The covering fiasco. Sometimes things don't go quite as planned.

I ordered some colored silk with the white silk. The colored silk was a little different than the white, the colored were actually scarves.

To do a test, I covered the wing with red and the fuselage with yellow.

It went on fine. When I went to open a newer can of butyrate I found the stuff had gone bad. The can wasn't sealed properly and there was moisture in it.

I went to a somewhat close by airport, to buy some more, the man said he had 3 quarts still in a can and I could "have it" for $30.

When I got there, the can had no markings on it, and it was a little more than half full.
2 quarts for $30.

When I applied the dope it felt strange, I chalked it up to faulty memory.

It's not that unusual for silk to relax when doped, it can loosen a little while the dope is wet.

This drooped, a lot. Then it didn't re tighten. The surface was hard and wrinkled after 4 coats.

The dope he sold me was non Tautening dope. It will never shrink.

The cover over wood surfaces was OK but all the open area had to go.

I even tried washing the dope off with thinner so I could save the recover.
No luck.

I recovered the open areas and my new 5 gal can arrived and back in business.

On the bright side I found the white 5mm covering is far superior to the 8mm scarves. At least as far as working with the material.

So now the plane is all yellow, tomorrow I'll know if it needs another coat or not and then it's trim colors and done.

Yellow was picked because a friend of mine gave me all his old butyrate.
Two gallons of yellow.
Guess what color the next few will be.

[pd1]

When I sanded it I had to add one more coat of yellow.

Fuse colors are done, wing colors are started.

Yellow fuse with red wing: just been sanded.
The white color on the wing is sanded dope.

Motor installation close up.

Aeromaster canopy on just to check for looks.

Bottom of wing, checker pattern started.
If I had remembered how much of a pain it was I wouldn't have done it.

[Grasshopper]

Looks great Paul! Even though it's a lot of trouble, it will sure show up in the air.

[CHELLIE]

Wow :ws: what a Sweet looking Build, Very Very Nice :ws: keep up the good Work, Chellie

[pd1]

Here it is all painted, just need the decals to finish.

[Franny]

That's Awesome Paul! Thanks for the picture on the check masking. I've always wondered how to do that... What tape do you use? I find that the Blue tape tends to bleed under a bit, but I'm always afraid the regular will pull up the paint... I just painted some float for my Gasser and there was a small bit of bleeding. I like your color scheme! Almost a little AT6-ish. Let us know how that E-Flight 25 pulls that around. I'm really looking for something that size. I find the Power 46 motors to be strong, but pretty heavy. Mostly torque so they need a big, bitey prop.

Can't wait to hear the flight report!

Franny

[pd1]

Thanks Franny,
I'm curious myself on how the E-Flite 25 will work.
If it doesn't pull enough, I'll build another one, lighter.

If you want to build one of these, I can make you a copy of my plans and I have another set of ribs you can have.

Tape, I used the green fineline tape from the automotive paint supply store.
There is no bleeding under.

But, the dope doesn't stick to the tape, it leaves a fine paint skin on top of the tape.
I find that if I drag the edge of a razor blade over the top, the paint peels off easily.
Then I remove the tape.

[Grasshopper]

Man, that thing came out really sharp Paul. Good job! I'm sure it will fly every bit as good as it looks.

[pd1]

Finally ready for flight.

Three planes designed in the 60's.
Taurus
Sidewinder
Trainermaster

[pd1]

My dad came over with some early pictures.
Here's a few of Trainermasters of old.

The silver one was painted in Metalflake, with the trim colors with dyed dope. It weighed a ton, and flew like it.

The one climbing out is the early one that I posted Black and white.
Didn't know a colored picture existed.

The yellow one on floats was at Dahlgreen VA. at the world speed trials.
Landing after setting a new record.

[smokejohnson]

Nice pics pd.

[pd1]

Thanks SJ, My dad brought over a pile of them today.

[pd1]

It flew.
Here's some pictures

[ragbag]

I didn't locate any plans, and I decided to start building from memory.
I was tempted to buy a kit, but I had all the ribs, and I was going to change the fuse structure anyway, so it's head down and plow ahead.

Got the wing done, only changes from original is I used 1/16 sheet instead of 3/32 sheet on wings.
Oh, and I installed a dowell for wing hold down, and filled the rear for bolt holes.

Started plans of fuse, from memory, had a couple of former halves just laying around.

Made the box locs and dry fit the formers, waiting for glue to dry for the rear fuse sides to box locs now. I'm using 3/16 for the boxes instead of the 3/8. I'm also using 3/32 for the sides instead of 1/8.

The plane is built like a tank anyway.

This plane will vary from the original so it won't be truly "vintage", but some of the parts are 35 to 40 years old, that's got to count for something.

If anyone wants to post pictures of your Trainermasters, please post them here.

Kind of glad you didn't make me an offer for the Trainermaster kit. I Ebayed it and they went wild. Ended up $170 with shippng when it was all over.
I was hoping to get some of my money back, not make some.
Following your thread, very interesting.:)

.................................................. ............................................

[pd1]

Kind of glad you didn't make me an offer for the Trainermaster kit. I Ebayed it and they went wild. Ended up $170 with shippng when it was all over.
I was hoping to get some of my money back, not make some.
Following your thread, very interesting.:)

.................................................. ............................................
Glad you made out OK.

Mine flys really well. Someday I hope to compare it to a stock Trainermaster for fuselage lengths.
Prop to leading edge of wing and prop to rudder hinge line.

[alienx]

Holy cow ...I just saw this thread. Makes me want to build a plane!!! Great craftsmanship Paul!!! She's a beauty.

[ragbag]

Holy cow ...I just saw this thread. Makes me want to build a plane!!! Great craftsmanship Paul!!! She's a beauty.

If you doubt your skills would stand up to Paul's, then look at the Tranermaster kit. One of the best I've had, I just just have too many, so parted with mine.:)

Paul's does look good.


.................................................. .................................................. ...

[ELECTRICTIGER]

wish id known--I have a set of plans for both the Trainer master & sport master. -just fuselage but complete.:rolleyes:

[pd1]

ELECTRICTIGER, Do you also have the planes?
If so how do you like them?

I've been getting some flights on my Trainermaster.
With the E-Flite 25 I have more power than I ever did with a .40.

I sent you a PM.

Paul

[ELECTRICTIGER]

I have flown several TM in the past-nice flyer.they flew very well as the name implies.rather versitile with engines that could power it . perhaps not true pattern material but just the ticket to move up to more responsive aircraft. currently I dont have one. I do have the H Ray & A Ray built & plans also. flew the A ray years ago & it was quite nice with OS .35 Max. the planes I have now are basicly for VRCS type flying.Andrews were rather unique at the time.

[ELECTRICTIGER]

ok paul sorry I sent the dimentions on the wrong email. ill try to ge t themto you or you can e mail me & ill fwd them.

[ELECTRICTIGER]

looks like i sent info to the wrong site. it was very late.the web master had it.if you cant get it from him i supose i could re do it-it was a complete breakdown. yes i could sell the SPORTMASTER fuse plans .copies of the Trainermaster are also possible. plans are tad shop worn but very usable.:o
dementions in inches
prop drivewasher to LE= 8 3/4 (engine sticks out some)
front of wood engine bearers to LE= 8 1/2
depth fuse at LE incl. bottom sheet = 5 1/4
depth fuse at aft end to bottom of stab= 2
depth fuse at TE= 6 ( wing te hangs down somewhat)
firewall to LE= 5 1/2
fwd turtle deck upward taper to canopy= 1/2
TE wing (not aileron) to elevator hinge= 20 1/2
TE wing to stab LE at fuse= 15 1/4
elevator hinge line to fuse aft end = 3/4
stab cord at tip=3 1/4
rudder cord at bottom=3

[pd1]

looks like i sent info to the wrong site. it was very late.the web master had it.if you cant get it from him i supose i could re do it-it was a complete breakdown. yes i could sell the SPORTMASTER fuse plans .copies of the Trainermaster are also possible. plans are tad shop worn but very usable.:o
dementions in inches
prop drivewasher to LE= 8 3/4 (engine sticks out some)
front of wood engine bearers to LE= 8 1/2
depth fuse at LE incl. bottom sheet = 5 1/4
depth fuse at aft end to bottom of stab= 2
depth fuse at TE= 6 ( wing te hangs down somewhat)
firewall to LE= 5 1/2
fwd turtle deck upward taper to canopy= 1/2
TE wing (not aileron) to elevator hinge= 20 1/2
TE wing to stab LE at fuse= 15 1/4
elevator hinge line to fuse aft end = 3/4
stab cord at tip=3 1/4
rudder cord at bottom=3

Thanks, that's what I needed and more than I expected.

Paul

[ELECTRICTIGER]

by the way pd1 , you can buy jersey brown gloves with dotted grips for about a dollar. the work very well to pull plastic covering around wing tips etc.

[RogerQ]

I read this whole thread: couldn't find where you got silk for 2.50 a yard. Care to share with us? I hope so. Thai Silk has some that price, and I wonder if it is the same stuff. It is white, not colored. Thanks Roger Q.

[Airhead]

by the way pd1 , you can buy jersey brown gloves with dotted grips for about a dollar. the work very well to pull plastic covering around wing tips etc.
Good idea Tiger. :) Thanks..

[pd1]

Sorry Guys, an oversight.
Here's the thread I did on silk prices.

http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19744

Paul

[RogerQ]

Paul: a friend and I have been looking at Thai Silk and thinking it looked good, but got burned the last time we ordered some from that outfit: the silk we ordered had so much starch in it we never did get it to work. We are going to order the same stuff 021F. It sure looks great. Thanks for the backup info about how it works. And the price sure is right, beats 12.50 elsewhere.
Roger Q.

[pd1]

RogerQ, I did notice differences between the colored silk and the white silk.
The white works great.
I also used it with MinWax on a foam plane,
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22327

I saw a special on TV about dyeing silk.To make the colors fast you had to have the water at a constant boil.
I'm going to try this.
If anyone has any ideas or experience coloring modern silk please post.

Paul

[TLyttle]

I always get strange looks when I look around fabric and dress shops. My favourites are the shops that sell skirts from the Philipines or Malaysia; keep an eye on the labels: I scored the most beautiful skirt, pure silk, for ~$8, enough to cover the wings & tail on a Telemaster (it was a telemaster, who cares??); good deal!

[ELECTRICTIGER]

im curious as to why you bother with silk anymore.i have some used planes i bought that had it . it did not age too well & became brittle but it, like any fabric, protected the airframe well.seems to me this is like our full size light planes that used to use cotton. modern materials (ceconite) hold up much longer. when you recover these things you dont want to have to redo every 5-6 years!

????

[pd1]

If you store the plane in direct sunlight, I believe it's the UV rays that hurt the fabric.
My planes are not in direct sunlight when I store them.
I have had some last over 20 years with the silk and dope.

That said, silk and dope is not the end all, I like other coverings as well.

I just liked the look of a doped airplane, and I hadn't done one in a number of years. So this was the first in quite a while.

I didn't find it harder to do than plastic, just smells a lot more.

Paul

[ELECTRICTIGER]

no question ultraviolet rays deteriorate the stuff. thats why best full scale practice requires a coat of silver first. if stored inside cotton will last but not nearly as long as the ceconite.we have a plane now in our museum covered with cotton for 40 years prior to our aquiring it. the tail was exposed to sun in the restaurant where it hung from the ceiling. although the dope looked flawless, the fabric tore at the least push. the rest of the fabric seems ok for now. To me some of the other coverings come pretty close to the look of silk.i have some coverite lite that looks a lot like silkspan-much stronger.also no name similar product on another bird.Didnt SIG market a iron on silk sub at one time? i know a good dope job does look nice, just sometimes hard to get if you dont have a humidity free shop.

[pd1]

Electrictiger, I enjoy covering with silk.
I covered the wings of a full sized Cessna 140 a few years back.
Used the Superflite system. That stuff was amazing, no filler, just two coats of primer and two coats of color.
The UV protection was in the paint.

Looks beautiful, only drawback was the price was amazing too.

Paul

[ELECTRICTIGER]

Paul, whats the superflite system? does it use lacquer ? i am A&P but mostly heavy jet/turbo prop stuff. only worked with museum short time. we have JN4D ready to cover in spring & will assist.
one of our members flies a 140- metalized wings. some of the A&P's are talking him into trading off for the rag set of wings- lighter, hence more useful load. we also have a wrecked 140 with both sets, partial rebuilt from ground loop.

[pd1]

Here's a link to their home website.
http://www.superflite.com/catalog/product_detail.php/pid=115~subid=6/index.html

In a nutshell:

Paint adhesive on primed metal.
Lay cloth over metal.
Strike through cloth with mixture of MEK and adhesive, to bond cloth to metal.

Attach to ribs mechanically, add tapes as required.
Shrink cover with heat, two steps.

Apply two coats primer, spray.I wet sanded between coats.
Primer is poly urethane.mixed with catalyst.

Two coats of poly color.
Color and primer were sprayed with a high volume low pressure gun.
Done.

The Citabria is finished with this system from the factory.
Finish is a "wet" look finish.
Material is extremely easy to patch and repair.

Paul

[ELECTRICTIGER]

i see what you mean-WOW . :eek: of course, it should go a long way- hey this isnt IMRON , is it ? only poly u i have used is Formula U by PACTRA. worked quite well for me. long time to dry fuel proof. i recently refurbished a plastic C/L - painted it with some kind of enamel- it dried fast & its fuel proof-- and cheap. not many colors to choose. i guess i'll see what they want to do when comes time to cover the Monocoupe tail.

[pd1]

Electrictiger, No it's not Imron, it's quite a bit more flexible than Imron.

But do not try to spray this stuff without an outside air source pressure mask.

We sprayed at night and the next morning the place still had to be aired out.
Paul

[RogerQ]

ElectricTiger: I like to cover in Silk for two reasons: first of all it is a challenge and it turns out a beautiful plane if you take your time and do it right (correctly and carefully) and 2) as has been said, if you store it out of direct sunlight the silk will last for a long, long time. I acquired an old timer (Flying Quaker) from 1939 from a friend, and the silk is still strong, pliant and beautiful.
That said, I look like other coverings, Sig Coveral (which they claim is a light weight Seconite), ultracoat, and Nelson's lite plastic covering for those little, little planes. No matter the covering, I try to take my time and do a nice, clean colorful job. RogerQ