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rea59
07-22-2007, 05:55 PM
While on a recent visit to my Dad's farm in Missouri I found this old P-40 Warhawk hanging from the ceiling of a storage room. My Dad built this back in 1972. The engine is a FOX, don't know what size it is. All the electronics will have to be replaced. He used a Royce transmitter back then. Very high end at that time.

Here's some pic's. I didn't even clean the dust off so you see it as I found it.

Should I convert it or restore it? I don't know. Right now my energies and money go into the F4U build.

rea59
07-22-2007, 05:56 PM
Additional pic's

firemanbill
07-22-2007, 06:43 PM
Wow Ray that is Cool with a capital C!

If I were you I think I'd have to restore it. Too much nostalgia in that one to cange it. If you want to fly a lekkie P-40 there are plenty of choces out there for that.

This bird has history and should stay that way.

rea59
07-22-2007, 06:49 PM
Wow Ray that is Cool with a capital C!

If I were you I think I'd have to restore it. Too much nostalgia in that one to cange it. If you want to fly a lekkie P-40 there are plenty of choces out there for that.

This bird has history and should stay that way.


I tend to agree with you (as does my daughter) but the problem is it has never flown. Note the how the cowl dosent have any cut out for a muffler. (my dad never got around to cutting up his build job to make the glow functional). I was thinking I could make it electric and there by keep the outside looking the same. I'd have to find a canopy though.

rea59
07-22-2007, 06:52 PM
She also says clean it up, hang it up and dont fly it.

That is an option.:sad:

Grasshopper
07-22-2007, 06:53 PM
Pretty cool Ray. I think I would put it aside and restore it for display later. Is it all sheeted or skinned? I have an old PT-19 Trainer Rubber powered kit that my Dad and I built together 33 years ago. I stripped it and rebuilt it for display last year. Here's a couple of pictures. I still need to make the wind shields for it.

rea59
07-22-2007, 06:59 PM
Looks like your Restoration was a lot more extensive than mine. (BTW very good looking).

The fuse and wings are all balsa sheeted. the tail feathers are cloth covered in dope.

firemanbill
07-22-2007, 07:00 PM
She also says clean it up, hang it up and dont fly it.

That is an option.:sad:


That's a good option as well. It would look awfully cool on display... Then again it would beg to be flown!

rea59
07-22-2007, 07:03 PM
Then again it would beg to be flown!

There's the rub.:Q

I'd hate to wreck it though. Theres a lot of sentimental value in it.:<

smokejohnson
07-22-2007, 07:15 PM
Very nice Ray, what a find!! Just to throw my 2 cents out there if you can get the Fox motor to run I would try to finish it and fly it 1 time. Then hang it in the shop for inspiration.

gfdengine204
07-22-2007, 07:28 PM
Ray,

What would Dad want? That should play into your decision as well. If he REALLY wanted it flown, then fly it. If you can convert it, well, that's fine. But remember, you have to decide what the right thing is. We can all offer opinion, but you have to make the final decision.

There is no shame in restoring it for display purposes. None at all.

James puts it well; hang it for inspiration. :)

Not that it is a plane, but I have the shirt that I wore to my dad's funeral. It was his. I never have worn it since, but I just can't get myself to part with it either. I know it ain't the same, but.....

aviatordave
07-22-2007, 07:28 PM
Ray,

Same problem I had not to long ago...my Dad had a plane from the vintage years. He wants me to make it flyable again but I'd just like to hang on to it as something we did from years back.

But if you do decide to convert it you have to factor in the weight...generally planes from way back when were built heavier because they didnt have the lighter stronger materials we have now. And from sitting (possibly outside in a garage) in the MO heat in the summer to the MO cold in the winter tends to make things warp abit, so do a check and see that its straight. You'll need to know the weight and wing loading to help find a motor, the plane is quite sleek so I assume it will be a fast plane.

let us know what you think.....my choice would be to restore it and use it as a trophey

rea59
07-22-2007, 07:42 PM
Thanks guys!

Kev, Dad says fly it.

Dave, Your right about the storage, This thing has been move from farm to farm. The weight is a little heavy though. Closer examination of it shows it would take a bit to convert.

I'm leaning heavily on the restore and display side. It would make a great conversation piece in my flock of birds at an event.

Tinman
07-22-2007, 07:44 PM
I would restore it buddy! Keep it as is. Thats a great find!

rea59
07-22-2007, 07:56 PM
Ray,

What would Dad want? That should play into your decision as well. If he REALLY wanted it flown, then fly it. If you can convert it, well, that's fine. ....


Believe it or not my Dad was actually going to use this as a trainer.::o:<:ws: This was his first "RC" before that he was flying the control line planes. The last being a twin engine P38 (crashed it on the second flight when it ran out of fuel).::o

FlyingMonkey
07-22-2007, 08:38 PM
If it were me....

I would clean it, restore it, put it in a glass case. With the covers off, so you can see what those "old" glow planes looked like back when. It can be a family heirloom.

Craft places like Hobby Lobby, sell ready made wood based glass display cases.

brnyrbbl
07-22-2007, 09:51 PM
Ok, I will comment on this for you Rea :) If it were me, I would ask my Dad (which you already have) what he wants. I would restore it and give it back to him as a Fathers Day gift. Take plenty of pictures along the way so you can see the before and after. I would invite him to the field and have HIM fly it again taking pictures or even better, video. Then you will have something to look at and cherish more than any static model. The memories would be priceless!

Twizter68
07-22-2007, 11:56 PM
Restore it to like new condition, clean up the transmitter, and mount them both in a display case and give it to your Dad. That would be the best Father's Day present you could get him!

Saucerguy2
07-23-2007, 12:22 AM
If you can find the original plans/kit, I'd build that for eflight and go take it out with him and leave the original one in tact. As stated before, there are too many variables with something stored like this for so long. I'd leave it as stock and untouched as possible, just clean it up, there is alot to be said towards looking back at what was done in it's original context.

airmail wf
07-23-2007, 02:06 AM
My vote; Leave it as is, clean it up, make it a display piece. Find a nice place to show it off. Planes like this that have been laying around for sometime do not fair well in the smallest of crashes. The balsa can dry out and the glue joints become brittle. I was given a large J-3 that was never covered (laying around maybe 30 years) my first thought was to cover it and fly it till I started checking the glue joints. It now looks very nice on my wall in the game room still in bare bones. If your dad wants to see a P-40 fly build a new one. Keep this one for posterity. Just my 2 cents.

FlyingMonkey
07-23-2007, 02:19 AM
that's a great point. that deserves some rep....

Rabbitcreekok
07-23-2007, 04:14 AM
Ray, I fall into the keep it and don't fly it opinion. I don't think it would fare well either as a glow powered model due to the age of the glue and it would probably be way too heavy for electric.

I would give anything if I had a model my dad built. I have a photo of one he built in 1935. Control line with a pusher and a tractor motor. That is all I have.

You can find a canopy to fit the P-40 from one of the current manufacturers or you can vacuum form one fairly easily. A good skill to learn for future use.

I think I would freshen it up and follow Twizlers and Airmails suggestions of a display case with the transmitter.

Just my humble opinion.

pd1
07-24-2007, 05:55 PM
Ray, Just my .02 cents. The plane is not replaceable.
I wouldn't fly it, I'd feel awfully bad if I wrecked it.

It looks like it might be an old TopFlight P-40, the early one.

If it is, and he built it according to the plans, then it might fly very weird.
I had one of those and weird is the only word that comes to mind.

Good luck with your decision.
Paul

alienx
07-24-2007, 06:41 PM
Man, I must be the dissenting opinon. I see a beautiful plane like that as a wild animal, like a Lion. It wasn't meant to be displayed in a zoo. Let it run wild!! And enjoy it for what it is. The plane will thank you.:)

FlyingMonkey
07-24-2007, 06:55 PM
yeah, but, it's a lion that has been in a zoo for years, grown old and decrepit there.

now, put that same lion in the wild, what happens :D

alienx
07-24-2007, 07:02 PM
yeah, but, it's a lion that has been in a zoo for years, grown old and decrepit there.

now, put that same lion in the wild, what happens :D
The heart of a lion beats true ...


Lots of ways to go through life. I'm just going on record for the way I would do it.:)

airmail wf
07-25-2007, 01:30 AM
yeah, but, it's a lion that has been in a zoo for years, grown old and decrepit there.

now, put that same lion in the wild, what happens :D

It drops dead trying to catch that young wildebeast.:red:::o;-):ws: Hey if you can't run with the big dogs stay on the porch.:silly::)

Saucerguy2
07-25-2007, 02:05 AM
At one of my LHS's, they have a few antique/vintage planes and radios in a display case, it's really cool to take a peek into the past seeing those there. You also might want to keep in mind, your's is now worth a great deal to a collector, it's value increases the longer you hang onto it unmolested. I wish it still had it's original canopy, that's the only missing piece, you can bash one out from foam or balsa, just be sure to not permanently mount it, chances are someone just might have an original for it, and technically, a plug can be made from the original which would be used for vaccume forming a replacement as well.

FlyingMonkey
07-25-2007, 04:27 AM
It drops dead trying to catch that young wildebeast.:red:::o;-):ws: Hey if you can't run with the big dogs stay on the porch.:silly::)



thanks, I would give you some rep, for agreeing with me, but I seem to be rep'ed out

airmail wf
07-25-2007, 05:08 AM
thanks, I would give you some rep, for agreeing with me, but I seem to be rep'ed out

DARN!!!

rea59
07-25-2007, 04:09 PM
I like Ailenx's point of view and if I had picked this up at a yard sale putting it up in the air or even crashing it on the first flight wouldn't bother me. As it is the sentimental attachment to the plane will keep me from flying it. My plan therefore is to restore and display it.

Airmail/FM Your are absolutly correct about the Lion however this is a plane and as such not only wants to but needs to fly.

That said what are my options in being able to restore this? Does anyone know of any canopy's around that would fit this? This is balsa covered in silk and painted with "dope"; So how do I clean it?

BTW I appreciate all the responses to this thread. It goes to show how much Wattflyers are passionate about model aircraft, even the old slimmers.

FlyingMonkey
07-25-2007, 04:27 PM
BTW I appreciate all the responses to this thread. It goes to show how much Wattflyers are passionate about model aircraft, even the old slimmers.

Ohhh, heck, I missed that point. It's a SLIMER! Fly it, crash it, go electric! :D ;)

pd1
07-25-2007, 04:44 PM
Ray,
Since you decided to restore and fly, check your pictures against this plane.

This is a TopFlight one I did in the mid 70's.
If you think it's the same I'll dig out some more info for you.

Paul

rea59
07-25-2007, 04:49 PM
Ray,
Since you decided to restore and fly, check your pictures against this plane.

This is a TopFlight one I did in the mid 70's.
If you think it's the same I'll dig out some more info for you.

Paul

Looks close. Wingspan is 50.5" Length is 37"

BTW it's Restore and display.

firemanbill
07-25-2007, 04:57 PM
Good choice Ray!:ws:

airmail wf
07-25-2007, 05:00 PM
Good choice Ray!:ws:

I agree.:ws:

pd1
07-25-2007, 05:00 PM
Looks close. Wingspan is 50.5" Length is 37"

BTW it's Restore and display.

Good choice, now I can say it ,
it flys like crap.

The plane would tumble if you gave it too much up elevator, at any speed.
It was so bad TopFlight took it off the market and made a new improved one.

gfdengine204
07-25-2007, 05:21 PM
I like Ailenx's point of view and if I had picked this up at a yard sale putting it up in the air or even crashing it on the first flight wouldn't bother me. As it is the sentimental attachment to the plane will keep me from flying it. My plan therefore is to restore and display it.

Airmail/FM Your are absolutly correct about the Lion however this is a plane and as such not only wants to but needs to fly.

That said what are my options in being able to restore this? Does anyone know of any canopy's around that would fit this? This is balsa covered in silk and painted with "dope"; So how do I clean it?

BTW I appreciate all the responses to this thread. It goes to show how much Wattflyers are passionate about model aircraft, even the old slimmers.

Ohhh, heck, I missed that point. It's a SLIMER! Fly it, crash it, go electric! :D ;)


Monkey, he said "slimmer" not "slimer".....maybe his aircraft promote weight loss? :Q

rea59
07-25-2007, 05:37 PM
Monkey, he said "slimmer" not "slimer".....maybe his aircraft promote weight loss? :Q

It is a pretty slim plane....or is that slime plane....no no thin....no wait I'll get it.....it's heavy so it must be slime:Q:Q

pd1
07-25-2007, 07:02 PM
Ray, ask your dad what brand dope he used.

If it wasn't Aerogloss you could re dope the plane with almost any other brand.
Brodak makes a dope rejuvenator to restore old dope finishes.

A little clear and color and it will look as good as new.

ElectricFlyGuy
07-25-2007, 11:51 PM
Very nice plane. I would say, since it isn't cut out for the muffler, go electric if it isn't that much of a hassle. The radio......... is it compatible with both options? Can you turn the fox over or has it seized up? Why does it need to be re-wired? I would say, do what ever is easier for you to do. If will be a sharp plane to fly, what ever way you those. Personally, I would go electric. Thanx, for sharing, scott TheTagMaster :D

gfdengine204
07-26-2007, 02:05 AM
Very nice plane. I would say, since it isn't cut out for the muffler, go electric if it isn't that much of a hassle. The radio......... is it compatible with both options? Can you turn the fox over or has it seized up? Why does it need to be re-wired? I would say, do what ever is easier for you to do. If will be a sharp plane to fly, what ever way you those. Personally, I would go electric. Thanx, for sharing, scott TheTagMaster :D

Wow, Scott...you ARE alive! Hiya buddy!

aviatordave
08-20-2007, 03:38 AM
So what happened with the plane?

rea59
08-20-2007, 02:36 PM
It's still "Hanging around" ....I have others to work on (and Fly) before I get to it.

It will be restored.....Still looking for a canopy....May vac form my own.