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Bill G
09-23-2007, 07:38 AM
Smokin Beaver (Phil) did one of these 200% jobs a while back using the little Guillows Stuka plan, and I've wanted to do one from even before then. I had done 2 enlarged Guillows scratchbuilds, and always wanted to do the Stuka.

This plane is 33.5" span, which is basically a 200% version of the 16" version's plan. Since the plane will be sheeted, it doesn't need the excessive sparring of the larger Guillows Stuka kit that is offered. The larger Guillows kit is basically the same size as what I'm building now.

I could have just bought the larger Guillows Stuka, as it would have been nice to get the cowl and wheel pants, but I'm not really missing the wood, and I really don't want to build the plane exactly the way they do either. This build has stronger construction, less taper on the wing tips, and a semi-symmetrical airfoil versus the Guillows flat bottom airfoil. It would have been so much kit bashing to get to where I want, that its better to just start from scratch.

The way Guillows builds the gull wing leaves some things to be desired.:D I used ply for the center section gull formers, versus weak balsa, or that rubbery nylon stuff that Guillows uses. The panels have a 1/4" square stock main spar, instead of depending on thinner stringers for strength. I added gusseting across these 1/4" spar joints at the gull section, since these joints really need to be reinforced. CF tape and CA was also used at a number of joints. The wing LE is made from 2 layers of 1/8" balsa laminated together, with a CF spar in the middle. I've done this before, and it makes a strong LE. The added thickness also allows for shaping a nice LE, when making a semi-symmetrical wing, versus the good ol' flat bottom Guillows.:eek:

Built the tail feathers just to get them out of the way, since it takes forever to build decent tail feathers. The flat panel approach is quick, but just doesn't have the look. I put the sparring at the panel line locations, so that it will hopefully simulate the panel lines, when the iron-on covering is applied.

max2112
09-23-2007, 09:44 AM
Good looking bones, you goth there, Bill G!!

I'll be following this one for sure. Did you enlarge the plans yourself?

John

pd1
09-23-2007, 10:56 AM
Bill, Do you want the cowl and canopy from the larger Guillows kit?
I might even have the wheel pants too.
I'll look.

Paul

FlyingMonkey
09-23-2007, 12:27 PM
Is the seabee done yet?

You're not allowed new projects until you finish your last one...

:D

Bill G
09-23-2007, 06:46 PM
Bill, Do you want the cowl and canopy from the larger Guillows kit?
I might even have the wheel pants too.
I'll look.

Paul
YOU BETTER BELIEVE IT!:D

Flying Monkey,

I just built the Flitzer too, and the FlyZone Mosquito conversion.:D
I regularly jump around on projects. My PBY (seaplanes are work) got put off a bit too, during its build.

The Seabee could be finished quickly, and I need to start throwing a little time into it here and there. Basically needs the top wing covered, and a bunch of little rigging details. Those little details take forever though.:eek: I'll get back on it, since I really shouldn't let the thread drop like a brick. I guess part of it was that I lost motivation of getting it going this past summer, so it slowed me down.

Max
Thanks for the comments.
I scanned the 11x17 plan into the computer, and enlarged it. The difficulty is that my different photo editors don't seem to scale properly, so I simply print one page of the enlarged plan, and compare a feature on it to the original, until I get the scale I want. You don't want to print 16 pages at each shot, until you get it right.:eek:
It is a bit of work trimming all the sheets and taping them together, but the copy center would be too easy.:D

Stuka
Finished the wing frame. The wing is the reason why this plane is not built that often.:eek: Still work to go, as I have most of the sheeting cut out. Shaping the LE took a good while too. Big difference between a real airfoil, and just going with the good ol' flat bottom Guillows wing.

pd1
09-23-2007, 07:21 PM
Bill, I have located the cowl, and canopy for the Stuka.

I don't have the wheel pants. I have a friend that's a kit collector that I have to see tomorrow. If he has a set I'll get them for you.

The only thing now is I need a package to ship them in.

Paul

FlyingMonkey
09-23-2007, 08:25 PM
Flying Monkey,

I just built the Flitzer too, and the FlyZone Mosquito conversion.:D
I regularly jump around on projects. My PBY (seaplanes are work) got put off a bit too, during its build.

Yes yes, I know, i follow all off your projects I find...

The Seabee could be finished quickly, and I need to start throwing a little time into it here and there. Basically needs the top wing covered, and a bunch of little rigging details. Those little details take forever though.:eek: I'll get back on it, since I really shouldn't let the thread drop like a brick. I guess part of it was that I lost motivation of getting it going this past summer, so it slowed me down.

No excuses! Back to work, or no ice cream for you!

Bill G
09-24-2007, 09:03 AM
Bill, I have located the cowl, and canopy for the Stuka.

I don't have the wheel pants. I have a friend that's a kit collector that I have to see tomorrow. If he has a set I'll get them for you.

The only thing now is I need a package to ship them in.

Paul
The cowl and the canopy would be great. I made a set of pants, that aren't perfect, but will do. Canopys can be made, but the cowl would ve a godsend.

I'l be glad to kick back some shipping too.
I donate a bunch of stuff too, so its much appreciated to be on the receiving end for once. I actually have some servo arms in an envelope on my dash, that I need to mail out to an other flyer tomorrow.

Thanks, Bill

Bill G
09-25-2007, 10:39 PM
Paul, since I can't put a pic in a PM, here'w the motor I'd like to give you for the Stuka parts: (pic below)
http://www.bphobbies.com/view.asp?id=V219349&pid=U024121

Gotta load some new pics soon. Moving right along. Setup Sullivan Gold Cable for the ailerons, and mounted the HS55 servo. Used some GWS mounts (the style for single main bent wire legs as on a Cub) for the landing gear, and played around with an idea:
I can insert the gear wire bent into an upside-down "U" shape, and it can be made to pop out if the gear legs hit anything, if its bent proplerly to give it just the correct amount of holding ability. I like this idea, as to not damage the wing on an impact.

Now to decide if I want to add flaps and/or dive brakes. I usually try to stay conservative when it comes to adding "goodies" since they weigh. I've also never used flaps, and seen a few videos where they drove planes into the ground.:eek:

pd1
09-25-2007, 11:15 PM
Thanks for the offer Bill. But not necessary.
Paul

Saucerguy2
09-26-2007, 01:46 AM
I did their 34" kit a little while back, didn't get much airtime with it before it basically fell apart upon impact with the ground, the original stock was really only meant for freeflight. I could tell the wing structure was struggling with the added weight for the gear. I also hear you on the rubbery nylon stock, that stuff is not very strong at all, I've used it for control arm stock in the past and it failed on most counts. I'll drag out the plans and build another soon enough. Your's is looking really good.

Bill G
09-26-2007, 03:09 AM
I did their 34" kit a little while back, didn't get much airtime with it before it basically fell apart upon impact with the ground, the original stock was really only meant for freeflight. I could tell the wing structure was struggling with the added weight for the gear. I also hear you on the rubbery nylon stock, that stuff is not very strong at all, I've used it for control arm stock in the past and it failed on most counts. I'll drag out the plans and build another soon enough. Your's is looking really good.
That's basically the reason I started from scratch on this one, insead of bashing the kit. The idea of a gull-wing like the Stuka, built to Guillow's standards didn't impress me as being abuse worthy at all. I'm a realist. Planes have to be able to at minimum survive a rough flip-over landing.
Instead of 6 million:D stringers, I have a 1/4" main stringer in the bottom of the wing. Same goes for the fuse when sheeting: It dosen't need 10 million thin stringers.

I remember your Stuka Shark. It was definitely unique.:D

Saucerguy2
09-26-2007, 03:28 AM
Thanks for the compliment.

Perhaps these shots will help further inspire you.

Bill G
09-26-2007, 07:38 AM
SG, the front view is the best one. Its alive.:D

Took this from my last post now that I have a pic, to save typing::D
Setup Sullivan Gold Cable for the ailerons, and mounted the HS55 servo. Used some GWS mounts (the style for single main bent wire legs as on a Cub) for the landing gear, and played around with an idea:
I can insert the gear wire bent into an upside-down "U" shape, and it can be made to pop out if the gear legs hit anything, if its bent proplerly to give it just the correct amount of holding ability. I like this idea, as to not damage the wing on an impact.

I've had afterthoughts on a number of sheeting jobs, where there are areas that could use a little more support. On this plane's wing, the bottom is not to be dead flat, but a bit curved. I noticed it was dipping in a bit between formers, so I made several cross direction spars with a slight curvature sanded onto them, to push the sheeting out to shape. Also eliminates the largest unsupported areas of sheeting in the wings.

Saucerguy2
09-26-2007, 07:48 AM
I see you are using nylon cables on this one, looking back at the number of servo's I had to replace, I'm going to follow your lead on this one with my current build, makes things much easier and fluid, also adds a buffer during a crash to absorb some pressure upon impact the servo doesn't have to directly undergo.

Sheeting, expect to add some serious weight, the dipping was expected since you just scaled the stock plans up and didn't accomodate the adjustment. After adding the Ultracoat, most of that will be hardly noticable, well, unless you squeeze the fuse. At this stage of construction, perhaps it's time to add some supplimental former style add ons to rectify the current dilema., It's alot easier to do it now then after it's covered.

Bill G
09-28-2007, 08:12 AM
SG,
The Sullivan Gold cables are nice. They just require some meticulous setup work. Gotta have them exit at 90 degrees to the ailerons, or you get slop. Same goes for the servo attachment. Has to have just enough unsheathed cable length to operate smoothy, but not add slop. Alignment is critical there too. You want to have the cables aligned with the imaginary plane that is in the center of the servo arm's travel, to minimize "S" bending effect, which also adds friction where the cables enter the sheathing.

After doing enough of these, this one works well and is virtually slop free. The only slop is due to the cable actually kicking from one side to the other, inside the sheathing at the bends. Its not much either. Good point that the cables protect the servo by absorbing shock too.

Got the wings fully sheeted now, and just finished the wing saddle on the fuse. The plan did not have the fuse saddle parts, so I started by making cardboard templates, using the center airfoil pattern as a starting point. Trimmed the templates to fit as well as I could, and made the saddle parts from 1/32" ply, for strength. The parts were laminated with a layer of 1/16" balsa, to thicken them to fit the fuse former notches that were already cut, and also adds a bit of strength, now being 2-layer laminated parts.

Trial fitting the wing was almost perfect. I sanded a hair from one saddle, and added a strip to the other, to build it up a bit, and then sanded to shape. The initial wing-to-fuse fit was actually better than with some of the Guillows kits, where I actually had Guillows parts!:D

The bottom of the wing has GWS gear mounts. Wire will be bent into a "U" shape, which will insert into these mounts. The mounts are the style with a 1" long open channel. Bent to proper size, and setting up with the proper insertion depth, this gear wire will be able to break away from the wing under shock, versus causing damage. At least that's the plan.

Also fabicated a steerable tailwheel, which will be mounted and linked before sheeting. I've installed steerable tailwheels after sheeting too, but its a bit tougher that way.:eek:

Sorting through my sheet balsa, I have some very light 1/16" balsa which is actually just as light as the 1/32" that I have. The 1/32" is not extremely heavy balsa, its just that the 1/16" is very light. That said, the fuse will be sheeted with the 1/16" balsa, which will add some sanding latitude.

Saucerguy2
09-28-2007, 09:41 PM
Looking really good, that sheeting is going to help strengthen this up well. I'll hold off on the cables for the current build, I'm trying to keep it simple, but will keep them in mind for future ones.

Bill G
09-29-2007, 03:53 AM
Looking really good, that sheeting is going to help strengthen this up well. I'll hold off on the cables for the current build, I'm trying to keep it simple, but will keep them in mind for future ones.
The sheeting along with iron-on covering really makes these planes strong.
If you look carefully, there is a lot of CF tape applied with CA also. There will be a few light CF spars ran along the front portion of the fuse too. If you reinforce these planes lengthwise, then they just expode outward, wherever the grain strenth is in the wrong direction.:eek: Gotta reinforce the formers in the weak, cross-grain direction too. With CF reinforcements applied properly, these planes can be some of the toughest, and it doesn't add much weight either.

Found some building cradles
Also ran across a nice find today. I dug up some large boxes in the basement, for hauling brush to the public brush dump. Inside some Dell boxes were these perfect EPP fuse cradles. I found 2 of them. I'll keep 1 for the build table, and another in the car for flying. It will make it much easier to install batts in the field.


Tailwheel/rudder linkage
Connected a short pushrod for the rudder to the tailwheel pushrod. The connection was made by overlapping the two pushrods inside aluminum tubing, and crushing the tubing with pliers after sliding the tubing across the two pushods, while applying CA. No need to have two separate pushrods all the way to the servo. I did verify that both linkage connections will turn the plane in the same direction too.:D I may attach an EZ link to the rudder horn for fine adjustment, although its not that critical as long as the tailwheel and rudder are both setup in reasonable alignment with each other.

Saucerguy2
09-29-2007, 04:55 AM
I also found that adding a horizontal length of balsa running through the formers, the width of the formers, to join them up really helps with the structural design itself significantly and makes it easier to drag your wires and esc through the fuse. I hear you on the carbon fiber element, that's why I normally run a couple of tubes along the leading edge of the wings with stick builds.

Good find with the epp cradles, it's amazing people are using that stuff for packing, such a waste.

Progress is looking really good, this one not only is going to be a good flyer, it's going to be around for a very long time. A huge reason I stress for people to consider scratch and/or kit building, they end up spending less time and money in the end, not having to replace their planes all the time, and there is nothing like that feeling when you are flying your own creation.

Bill G
10-01-2007, 03:10 AM
I also found that adding a horizontal length of balsa running through the formers, the width of the formers, to join them up really helps with the structural design itself significantly and makes it easier to drag your wires and esc through the fuse. I hear you on the carbon fiber element, that's why I normally run a couple of tubes along the leading edge of the wings with stick builds.

Yep, I've done that horizontal reinforcing with the formers before. Especially on Guillows planes I built from the kits, where the formers are Guillows contest wood. That's right, Guillows is not famous for just iron wood. Sometimes they give you wood that will disintegrate when you blow on it.:D

Look at these pics, and you'll see a lot of CF. The first pic shows the wing saddle looking forward. There is a CF spar ran along the center wing saddle former, to secure the threaded wing hold down. This spar locks in above a cross-former reinforcer on the rear side of the rear wing saddle fuse former.

The second pic shows the CF spar ran across the hole for the dowel pin in the front of the wing. There is also a 1/32" ply plate lamintated in this area, where the hole is drilled through.

The third pic (shot from the bottom front of fuse) shows the vertical CF reinforcement spars on the other side of the wing dowel hole. This dowel lodator is not ripping apart.:D
Also notice the CF spars laminated to the inside of the fuse balsa spars that will run across the canopy bottom. These route to behind the canopy. There is also extensive CF tape, reinforced with CA. The outer wing saddle framers on the fuse have been tied into the fuse formers with CF tape, for example.
There is 1/32" ply laminated to these wing saddle framers, and also laminated to the upper center fuse keel, which is between the firewall and the dash.

Obviously, I don't like things that break easily.:D

Saucerguy2
10-01-2007, 03:19 AM
It looks pretty rock solid, you addressed exactly the area where mine crumbled up at. I think this is going to be good for anybody, kit or scratch wise to take note of.

Kemorc
10-01-2007, 09:48 PM
Not a bad lookin Junker 87 you have there saucer

Saucerguy2
10-01-2007, 10:02 PM
Thanks, I still have the wing and aft section of the fuse in tact, but I think I'm going to build another from the plans, this time using the Bill G approach.

Bill G
10-02-2007, 05:28 AM
Finished sheeting the fuse. I can't believe how fast this build's going. I also can't believe how tired I am, so I guess I've just been putting too much time into it.:eek:

The fuse was almost entirely sheeted with 2 panels. There are 2 small filler panels in the bottom. The sheet is very light and very soft 1/16" balsa. Lighter than some of the 1/32" sheet that I've used.

I usually start by gluing the panels down to a major flat area across the fuse sides, with the exception of the last section at the tail. This part will be glued down later, since it requires relief cut/s. Some of the panel seams can be slowly trimmed to fit to the center of the spar where they will join to the second panel. Other seams are glued down and then cut down the center of the spars, to leave the other spar half for the next piece of sheeting to butt against. Just depends on the area, and if you can trim the panels accurately before gluing them down.

Also notice the few low areas that were padded out with pieces of sheet, to fill the area and provide sanding latitude for leveling. These filled spots allowed for the fuse to be sanded smooth with few waves and low spots. The padding was needed, since the plan is from the 17" Guillows kit, and the sparr frame shape of those small kits is not exactly 100% accurate. All in all, it turned out pretty well. The shape was easier to sheet than most other fuses I did this way, like their P47:eek:, since its reasonably straight.

Saucerguy2
10-02-2007, 05:35 AM
He he, all guillow's kit plans are far from accurate, there has been many times where I've reached the end going, 1/2 the amount of time I put into this kit is fixing the innacuracies, I could have scratch built it without the stock and only used the silouet of their plans faster. I think cutting your own pieces is helping speed up the build process, with your skills, you are getting more precision.

I look forward to seeing more progress, keep up the good work!

Bill G
10-02-2007, 05:31 PM
He he, all guillow's kit plans are far from accurate, there has been many times where I've reached the end going, 1/2 the amount of time I put into this kit is fixing the innacuracies, I could have scratch built it without the stock and only used the silouet of their plans faster. I think cutting your own pieces is helping speed up the build process, with your skills, you are getting more precision.

I look forward to seeing more progress, keep up the good work!
Fortunately, the thick 1/8" sparring gave me enough latitude to reshape things a bit. The tail stringers were down to half thickness in some sections after reshaping.:D

Saucer, I was so tired last night posting, that I actually passed out at the computer right after entering my post. Dead out of it:blah:, I woke up a few minutes later, and checked to see if I had actually gotten my post entered. I saw your post as the last post and was totally confused for a few seconds.:D After realizing what happened, I was way too tired at that point to even attempt to type and reply at the time.
BTW, if your wing is still good, then it would be even easier to build a new fuse for the plane. The sheeting really only needs to be done back to the rear wing, as you know, for strength. It would be really easy to sheet that way.

Saucerguy2
10-03-2007, 02:38 AM
I followed the plans closely so there is alot of revision needed on those, and it's set up for tail feather control so by the time I revamped it, it would be faster to scratch build a new one. The balsa stock left much to be desired and I'd be adding carbon fiber rod throughout it as well.

I've fallen asleep in my chair before several times as well, so don't feel so bad, we have a genuin passion for building so tend to lose all track of time while building. I have a guillows skyhawk 172 begging to be started as well, this is a very nice kit designed by default for RC control, I want to get that one together before doing another stick build, meawhile, the Murph biplane is coming along nicely which has been my primary focus at the moment on the build table.

Bill G
10-03-2007, 04:42 AM
SaucerGuy
There was a 172 Skyhawk video on RCG a while back. Flew great, and the pilot flew it with confidence. Was not being real conservative, so it must have been pretty controllable. Probably is the best Guillows subject for conversion, if you really get down to it.

Stuka Progress
Did a bit of filling and sanding on the fuse today. Didn't need much, after the low areas were first padded with patches of sheet balsa, and sanding the 1/16" light sheeting to level. Also put the last 2 pieces of sheeting on the fuse bottom front, to frame in the battery opening. The first pic shows where they would go, although they are not there yet.

Now I'll need to hunt down more light sheet for the next project.:D I buy up this extra light sheeting whenever I find it, since its difficult to find stuff as light as what I used on this Stuka.


Stick Mount
I made the stick mount for the stick mount:D today.

The first pic shows the grooved stick, and looking into the fuse, it will mount on the upper fuse keel. The groove in the stick (facing up) is a bit tough to see, in the lighting. The sheet of balsa below is NOT connected to it:D, as it appears to be.
This entire area has been reinforced, with a gusset brace tying the upper fuse keel down to the lower fuse keel, right behind the instrument panel. These stick mounts will disintegrate a fuse in a light nose-in, if not beefed up.

The second pic shows the mount for the stick being glued in place.

The third pic shows it installed. I wonder if strong magnets could be embedded to make a break-away stick? Just an oddball thought.::o

Maybe my Stuka parts being donated to me by PD1 will be here tomorrow.:)
Should I blow off work in anticipation?:D

Saucerguy2
10-03-2007, 05:30 AM
I have a rather elaborate system for setting up a retractable stick, I don't think you'll have enough room to fit it in yours, so I'd scale it down a bit, toss in a couple of skewers, pushed through the stick laterally and up against the firewall, but this will still require a decent amount of engineering to make work.

I hear you on the 172, I bought it on a whim, not knowing what was in the kit, once I opened it up, I was amazed at how this was so set up by default for e-conversion. Probably the easiest one of their lines to do, but I haven't done all of their giant scale planes "yet", way better then the stuka, all control surfaces are in place by default so no need to even modify it outside of adding servo battery and motor mounts, they even included the push rods.

Along work, if you have it, I wouldn't blow it off, the plane will still be there when you get back, but it's your call obviously. What do you do for a living btw?

Bill G
10-05-2007, 03:40 AM
SG, I work for a contractor that I grew up with. That's the problem. I know him too well, so he knows he can't force me to show up anymore than I care too.:D
The motor stick is now in place, and is probably about the strongest setup I've done with a stick. By rights, I really don't care for stick mount, since I prefer to distribute the load over the firewall, but I like the GWS box, so I had to go with it.

BIG THANKS TO PD1, FOR DONATING A 34" GUILLOWS STUKA KIT!

Now I can easily make this a better detailed build, than the Wattage Sports Flyers Stuka is.:D Look at all the detail parts (pic 1)
The donated kit is from 1969. They actually made a much better kit back then. This is the first time I got to see a Guillows kit with real plywood, instead of that 2 cent nylon stuff. The parts are like laser cut, from the fresh dies. The plastic parts also seem a bit thicker too.
There is an order form which has all the replacement parts listed. Can I still order the parts at 1969 prices?:D
The whole dang kit was listed at something around 10 bucks.:eek:

Now that I have this kit, I quickly realized two things about the 17" span kit, that I doubled the plans from, for this scratchbuild:
1. The 17" kit's fuse is NOT exactly scale. Its simply too thick. Add sheeting, which I did, and its even thicker.
2. The cowl from the 17" kit is much longer, given its scale, than the cowl of the 34" kit. In other words, if you double the 17" plans, you will end up with a firewall closer to the wing leading edge, that the firewall of the 34" kit. This difference is very obvious when looking at the cowl and firewall profiles in (pic2).

All things considered:
It looks like the cowl and the canopy will work fine, with a small amount of mods.

Cowl:
As mentioned, my fuse's firewall is about 3/4" short of where it shoud be, to use the cowl as-is. I thought building out the fuse with 3/4"X1/4" stock, and then shaping to match the fuse shape. The solution of simply extending the cowl with thick, clear plastic seemed easier (pic3). The clear plastic was scuffed in the area where it glues inside the Guillow's cowl. I left the rest unscuffed for now, simply because it looks cool to see the motor through it.:D It will be scuffed and blended to the cowl with body filler.

This elongated cowl, versus the stock setup intended with the 34" Guillows kit, has a few benefits also: The motor/gearbox fits entirely in the cowl area. No big deal, but simply easier servicing with the motor leads in the cowl area, and the ESC also. The ESC will easily fit in the cowl area, for venting. It would have fit in the stock 34" kit, but now its fits with ease.
I also filled the rear of the stamped cowl radiator vent ribs with glue, to strengthen them. Then I cut out the low areas between the cowl vents, to make a functional vent grille (pic 4). The ESC will be directly behind the vents.

Canopy:
For the canopy, I will have to add a 1/8" stringer to the top of my cocpit rail, to raise it up a bit, which is a 5 minute job (pic 5).

Ailerons:
I was going to cut my ailerons from 3/32 stock. The donor kit had these parts already made to perfect scale for my build, so I will use them (pic6). The wood is decent, and I will cut lightening holes and use iron-on covering.

Saucerguy2
10-05-2007, 09:29 AM
Looking really good Bill, this is showing there was more pride in what Guillow's was doing in the day's of old as they are doing now, that or economics have driven them that way. The 172 does retain a good level of plastic thickness with it's vaccume formed parts though, but it's using die crushed parts on the balsa, so there is a trade off. I can confirm with you though, the modern Stuka kit is thinner plastic, the pilot also doesn't look nearly as detailed, he's not even attached to a chair, just the torso.

PD1, you are a class act to donate that kit to him, I hope Bill also assembles the rest of it as well... perhaps making another shark. :).

pd1
10-05-2007, 02:23 PM
SG,
I'm glad Bill is getting some use for the parts.

It wasn't a complete kit.
I was given this about 25 years ago by someone who started this and never finished it.
Many parts are missing.

But it's good that Bill has the skill to adapt these parts for his build.
It's nice to see something get used and not thrown away.

Nobody would believe me if I tried to tell them all the weird, old stuff I have buried in this house.

Paul

Saucerguy2
10-05-2007, 02:56 PM
PD1, that old buried stuff would be gold in my book, I have plenty of my own, man this stuff kinda gathers up so I know where you are coming from. Our treasures or usefull throwaways we don't have time for will be delegated to landfill in the wrong hands. I've sent my own care packages out as well to others, it's cool seeing this old stuff getting put to good use.

pd1
10-05-2007, 03:15 PM
SG,
You are soo right.

Paul

Bill G
10-06-2007, 02:11 AM
Well Saucer I actually thought about building another fuse, since I have the formers. They go together fast. Maybe another Stuka?:D The wing build is a bear though.:eek:

The cowl should be perfect. I dug out the good ol' bondo, and will blend the sections together tonight. Fiberglassed the entire inside of the cowl, which I do with all my Guillows planes, except the 20" jobs. Don't need to break all this custom cowl work like an eggshell, from a simple nose-over on landing.

One more benefit of the custom cowl, is that since I had to extend it anyways, then I could extend it as far as I wanted it. The radiator grille sits a bit back from the spinnner on the Stuka, which tends to interfere with the motor/gearbox. I simply mounted the cowl about 1/8" further out than it should be for perfect scale, and it now clears it. The plane has a long nose, and I don't think anyone will notice it being about 1/8" longer than scale. Considering that the sheeting thickens the fuse, it may actully make it more scale.

With everything assembled in (pic 3) the plane balances at about 30% of center chord. When the battery is installed, the CG should be a bit more forward, and pretty much where I want it. From the beginning, I looked forward to easy CG setting, since the Stuka is an ideal long nose subject.

One thing I did to avoid tailheavyness, was to cover the tail feathers with Coverite Microlite. With the tail so far back there, using heavier coverings can require a lot of nose weight to compensate for. The servos are also setup to be mounted in the front of the wing saddle, versus the rear. Probably won't matter with this plane, but can't hurt. Its almost impossible to build any type of warbird that's nose heavy, and I like to use as little nose ballast as possible. They get heavy enough as it is.

Grasshopper
10-06-2007, 02:26 AM
Looks great Bill. Have you thought about a paint scheme yet?

Bill G
10-06-2007, 05:40 AM
Looks great Bill. Have you thought about a paint scheme yet?
I saw a brown camo Afrika Corps scheme in Flying Scale, that I really like. Its a D model, but they have B models in the same scheme.

Autobody 101 for cowls:D:
Finished applying, sanding, and priming the bondo.

First, I put the cowl locator blocks on the cowl (pic1). They cover a large amount of the perimeter, so I can find the best spot for the mounting screws. Usually you can find a certain spot that holds the cowl in the best alignment. Shoud be pretty good now, since I've had ARFs with cowl alignment that is no better.:D

The autobody primer seen in the last pic, is the first coat. A few sanded coats will eliminate small warps and bondo seams. Weighs a hair under 3/4 ounce, and is as tough as any glass cowl, with the inside glassing.
The cowl now actually looks like a larger version of the cowl that comes with the 17" kit, which I doubled the plans from. I bought the 17" kit for the plans. I think what Guillows did was to cheat the fuse scale on the 17" version, so the Cox Tee Dee could be mounted on the firewall and in the cowl, since the Stuka has a relatively thin fuse at the nose.

This build should really start moving now, since steps like custom cowls tend to slow things down. Still, a lot easier than having to fabricate an entire cowl. I did that for a 125% Guillows Hellcat scratcbuild (39" span) which was a lot of work.

Bill G
10-07-2007, 05:21 AM
Thought I'd build one of the two Guillows pilots, just to get it out of the way. They are my favorite scale pilots. Full figure, light, and detailed. They are work putting the halves together though. Especially with 30 year old brittle plastic.:eek:
CA and activator sure makes assembling the halves about as easy as possible. I pity the fool who tries to assemble them with slow drying glues.:D

Built the removable landing gear struts. I started with a wire frame, which inserts into the GWS long-slot gear mounts. The idea is to have them insert with slight spring force, to hold them in place. Notice the "z" bend in the bottom of the "U" wire frames, which was tweaked to get the proper insertion force to hold the wires into the wing mounts (pic2). The "U" shaped wire was then glued into the balsa strut legs, with the wire ends at the top of the "U" angling slightly towards each other. This keeps them in place, once they are inserted into the wing mounts.

The axles were made from soft wire 1/16" pushrod wire. This works well, since it can be easily bent, after inserting it into the wheel. Notches were made in the balsa strut legs for the axle wire to be glued into (pic4).

The wheel pant halves were first coated with epoxy on the inner surface, for strength. I glued the halves together, while concentrating on small areas of the seam at each glue application, to get good seam alignment. Use the glue on the inside of the seams (pic5) by dropping it into the seam, and allowing it to run the length of the inner seam. This will fill the inside of the seam area with CA, so that you don't sand through the seams, when sanding the seams flush after assembling the halves. I concentrated on small areas at a time, and used activator to harden the glue.

The wheels used are 2" GWS wheels. This is the largest size the wheel pants will allow.

Saucerguy2
10-07-2007, 05:36 AM
Looking really good, the detail on the pilot's are much more detailed then mine, of which I didn't even bother to assemble.

Bill G
10-08-2007, 07:52 AM
Looking really good, the detail on the pilot's are much more detailed then mine, of which I didn't even bother to assemble.
Well I put the second pilot together tonight. Not like its going to put itself together, so I figured I'd finish it.:D This is one of these builds that's almost complete, but will take a while to complete, with all the details.:eek:

Raised the canopy rails up a bit, and the glass fits well now. I also glued a ledge to the inside of the canopy rails, so the glass will be easy to locate and glue in place, when it is done later.

Mounted the upper cowl vent, and had to make it into 2 pieces, since the cowl seam is in the center of it. There was a panel line in the vent scoop that was in the perfect location to make the seam.

Bill G
10-09-2007, 07:06 PM
Scrapped the oversize Maxx tailwheel for one that is a bit more scale. It actually came from an old Sterling Peashooter. The Peashooter has a smaller one, for a light tail. I made a wheel caster from railroad detail plastic, which should look ok when painted. The gaps in the wheel caster are actually filled with CA, so it will look much better with paint. Also added the wheel farings to the fuse bottom for the tailwheel.

Made the mass balancer for the elevator, and added a piece of wire insulation sliced in half, to simulate the curved weight that is on the flap portion of the balancer.

Got the ailerons down from 1/2oz to 1/4oz, by tapering them with a sanding block, and added lightening holes. These parts will kill the AUW, if not lightened. The plane is heavy enough as it is.

Bill G
10-11-2007, 06:49 AM
I bougt a package of Dubro micro pin hinges for the flaps/ailerons, in attempts to look a bit more scale. I was going to use slotted hinges, but they would have looked off.

The Stuka flaps/ailerons are mounted a bit beneath the wing bottom, and forward of the trailing edge also. I drilled the holes in the wing for the pin hinges, by drilling them about 5/16" forward of the TE, and on a fairly shallow angle with the wing bottom surface. This worked well, and gave the positioning I desired for the flaps/ailerons.

The flaps/ailerons are only test fitted in the pics, since I need to cover the wings first. Covered the bottom tonignt. The surfaces will all be painted in Afrika Corps camo, but I'm starting with blue covering on the bottom wing, and brown for the fuse and wing top, which will cover more easily with paint, since the colors are close to what will go on. The brown covering will probably be the base color, with the camo added on top.

I'm thinking of making the flaps functional with sub-micro servos in the wings. If so, I'll use 1 servo to activate the 2 flaps per each side. Otherwise, I'll just make dummy linkage rods mounted to the wing bottom, to fix the surfaces in place.

Saucerguy2
10-11-2007, 10:22 AM
I'm away from my computer, have been since last sunday so haven't been prompt with a response to the good work you are doing here. It's looking sharp buddy.

Bill G
10-11-2007, 12:20 PM
I'm away from my computer, have been since last sunday so haven't been prompt with a response to the good work you are doing here. It's looking sharp buddy.
So am I. Posting at the boss's house.:D Was showing him the Stuka.

Bill G
10-12-2007, 10:43 PM
Finished the wing covering and aileron/flap mounting. The parts have the brown camo base color covering on the top surfaces, and blue on the bottom. It will all be painted over, but its nice to have close shades for the covering, to start with.

I used clear phone extension cord wire sheathing, sliced in half, for the wing joint seam covers. Worked well. Instead of gluing on later, I decided to try something different and put them on before covering. This worked well. The covering really wasn't that difficult to neatly work over the strips. The second pic is a bit fuzzy, but the wing joint cover strips can be seen. This will definitely have a cleaner look than a strip put on later, with a mess of glue.:eek: Been there done that with the Dauntless.:D

The ailerons an flaps a permanently glued in place now. I'm really thinking of adding sub-micro servos in the wing for functional flaps. If so, I may set it up so that both of the 2 flaps on each wing panel will be functional, using 1 servo per panel.

Biplane Murphy
10-12-2007, 10:48 PM
Flaps would be sweet.:)

Looks great as usual Bill.......

Bill G
10-13-2007, 04:02 AM
Flaps would be sweet.:)

Looks great as usual Bill.......

Thanks Murph

Well I'm doing the flaps at this point. I just mounted the short body Cirrus 4.9 servos in the wing panels. Each servo will drive 2 flaps. The are mounted such that the servo horn fitting is inline with the gap between the two flaps. Since the servo is in the first wing former bay from the fuse, I was able to route the wire through without butchering the wing at all. The wire exits the wing into the fuse where it is not seen.

Edit:
Got it all working now. The first pic shows the FlyZone thumbscrew E-Z links used for the flaps. They are fine threaded, and tighten down well. Usually they've been really good, although I had to enlarge one of the keeper holes that was drilled too small, and another keeper hole wasn;t even drilled at all.:eek: Luckily I have small drill bits, so I drilled it out.

Second pic shows the ailerons thrown. Third pic shows the flaps unactivated. Fourth pic shows the flaps activated. The linkage is set up such that the inner most flaps activate progressively faster than the outer flaps.

The whole ball of wax::eek:
I'm trying to convince myself the servo-in-wing method was the best way to go. I'm thinking cables would have been cleaner, but they are difficult to get working smoothly. I could have used 2 separate cables, 1 for each flap pair, ran to a single servo. The direct linkage method which I used is very solid, however. No play. When I setup the aileron cable exits, I wasn't thinking about how the ailerons are somewhat under and below the wing, so the cable exit should have been further away from the trailing edge. I had to hack into the sheeting, and move them. Then, I had to play around forever to determine the best position/angle/etc for the servo horns, cable exits, and the control horn hole that provided the least freeplay, once everything was connected. Pain in the :eek:, on this oddball aileron setup, since the geometry is a mess, compared with a standard aileron/flap setup.

With the linkage setup I used, I had to cross the pushrods over each other for the flap setup on one of the wing panels, to get the same servo reaction. Not the prettiest, but at least it works well. It is somewhat hidden a bit too, being near the large wheel/strut pants.
Otherwise to avoid the crossing pushrods on the one wing panel, I would have needed a bellcrank, or to have one of the servos exit the top of the wing, and have the pushrods go through the wing. That would have been a mess.:eek:

Bill G
10-14-2007, 07:54 AM
Finished my least favorite step, fuse covering.:eek:
I'm a big fan of iron-on coverings, but not a fan of putting them on.:eek:(again)
Took about 3 hours to do a very thorough job. I like iron-ons to be glued down to the sheeting like a coat of paint, and don't do that "tack down and then heat gun the hell out of it" nonsense.:D

If I did it again, I may have used my favorite Coverite Microlite. It doesn't add the stregth that standard weight covering does, and does not hide imperfections like standard weight covering, but goes on easily. Unlike what they say, it actually paints pretty well too.

I'm thinking about assembling this plane as is, and test flying it, before doing all the painting and detail work. It may actually have a chance of being flown once completed, if I do it that way.:D

Saucerguy2
10-14-2007, 07:20 PM
I prefer Ultracoat, Solite is my second choice and is really the way to go on foamies or when weight is most critical. Fuse covering is by far the hardest to cover, how many pieces did your's end up at? You gotta dig how these are able to be pulled around rather complex curves with relative ease, it sure beats paper and dope.

pd1
10-14-2007, 08:50 PM
Bill, the plane looks real nice.

SG, I have to agree paper and dope is a lot more work.

Have you tried silk and dope? Or silk and wbpu?
Silk is way easier to cover with, just a greater amount of work to finish.

Did either one of you see the Globe Swift plans I posted?



Paul

Saucerguy2
10-15-2007, 02:36 AM
I haven't tried silk yet, the dope is so toxic, once I moved onto plastic coverings, I never looked back.

Bill G
10-15-2007, 05:58 AM
Never tried dope/wbpu and tissue PD. Mostly got into the iron-ons, since they are complete, once applied, and add considerable strength.
Haven't seen your Globe Swift plans either. I'll have to take a look.

SG, the standard Monokote brown I used was not the most workable stuff in the world.:eek: I really need to try that Ultracoat stuff. Now if I had used my Econokote (a favorite) I could have stretched it around a ball.:D I used the brown simply because I had it, and the color is what I want for the Afrika camo scheme base color. The standard Monokote is really not much stronger than Econokote, and is not nearly as shrinkable or stretchable. I don't buy it anymore, but still have a bunch laying around. For all practical intent and purpose, it makes much more sense to use Econokote versus Monokote. I've heard the Ultracoat works similar to Econokote.

Stuka progress:
Its amazing how a build seems to be so far from complete, and then all the sudden its like you have an ARF on your hands. Getting close now, but I plan to add a lot of little details. I made some scoops from saved cutaway plastic from molded Guillows radial engines. I save the scrap plastic, since it has usable features for making small vent covers, and other things. The first pic shows the painted scoops and gun turrets, which were all hand fabricated.

Speaking of scrap, I used a piece of a blown neodymium rotor magnet, to make the batt door magnet.:D Its located toward the side of the batt compartment, since the wing dowel comes through the center, and would be in the way if mounted on center. A steel washer was used for the door side, and a cutoff FlyZone control horn was used for the door handle. They have ribs in the control horn for their retainer clips, which also make a nice finger grip for a batt door. Also notice that the door is not full length. I had to shorten it a bit and add a filler piece to the fuse, since the cowl radiator blocks it from opening all the way, if it was full length. The filled section worked out to be a good area to glue the hinge to.

Also the overload spring setup on the tailwheel/rudder servo can be seen. You don't link a tailwheel directly to a 4.3gm servo, without some shock absorbsion.:eek: I had good success with the 4.3BA servos, and I'm trying to save weight wherever I can. This is not going to be a floater.:eek: (wearing that little guy out eh?:D) I figure it will fly like my modified Stryker plan ME109 scratchbuild, with about the same wing area, and weight. This plane will be just a hair under 20oz when complete. I just put everything on the scale including the pilots, and will only add a bit of light airbrushing to the weight tally, from now on. I'm hoping the oddball flaps and ailerons will add to the wing area with the same effectiveness as they do on standard wing setups.

pd1
10-15-2007, 10:37 PM
SG, Bill, I agree the film coverings are easier, and once it's on you're done.
Dope smells awful.

But silk is stronger than the plastic film and goes around compound curves very easily.
Just the filler stinks.
It also doesn't wrinkle as the humidity changes.

I did a GWS 190 with silk and wbpu, it was pretty easy, but still more work than plastic.

I'm more interested in the airplane than the finishing materials.

Paul

Bill G
10-17-2007, 02:37 AM
Very true PD about wrinkles. That's why it took me 3 hours to cover the fuse with iron-on. I've found that if you don't iron down the hell out of it, then it will loosten up. You really have to bond 100% of it down. The ARF manufacturers simply tack down the covering at its perimeters and then heat gun the living heck out of it.:eek: It is barely bonded to the balsa, and gets 1 million wrinkles over time.

Got the Stuka programmed with the DX6 radio now. Its a good idea to turn down travel distances BEFORE activating the plane, since the DX6 seems to have higher default travels than non-programmables. I'm lucky that I didn't rip the flaps out.:eek: I now have the flap settings pretty conservative, so I'll go from there, once in flight.

Working on the interior now, and need to make the rear pilot seat. The plane is pretty much together now, and I'm still deciding on a scheme. I've seen a few with the brown base and a very dark green motting that I like.

Bill G
10-21-2007, 05:33 AM
:DFound a good camo scheme. An Africa Corps scheme that is simply solid brown.:D I've been using the Monokote matching paint, which matches so-so, for painted parts. A bit tough when I did the canopy, since the paint is "rubbery" for use on covering. I had to score it along all the masked windows, to keep it from peeling off the frames. This evening I also faired in the rudder base, which looks a lot cleaner and more scale than an ugly seam.

I still have a few details to go, but after masking:eek: and painting the canopy frames, I'll call it done. The major missing feature to complete is the elevator braces.

Certainly would not be as nice a plane, without all the plastic parts donated by PD1.

The last pic is the Dragon Models that I referenced my scheme from. Cutting out all those decals by hand is a pain:eek: , for those who have done it and know. I had a GWS sticker set that had the correct "G" letter for the S1GK markings, so I went from there to make the remaining letters to its scale. I cut the little "G" for the wheel pants from small "GWS" stickers.:D It was the correct font and size.

Saucerguy2
10-21-2007, 05:39 AM
Awsome work Bill, this one turned out very nice, too nice to fly now. :)

It looks like you are ready for the maiden, are you getting good flying weather? I know it's going to fly like a dream.

Bill G
10-21-2007, 05:49 AM
Awsome work Bill, this one turned out very nice, too nice to fly now. :)

It looks like you are ready for the maiden, are you getting good flying weather? I know it's going to fly like a dream.
That's kindof the problem.:D
I actually have a lot more faith after just putting up a 12.5oz Guillows 190, but I still need to stare at it for a few. Its no lightweight, and is now 19.75oz. Will be a gram or so more, with the elevator struts and a few other tiny details added. Still should be ok, if its anything like my 34" 109 scratchbuild that flew recently, and is about the same weight. The big misconception is that heavy planes actually fly fine, and are not terrors. They only fly worse than light planes when they have problems, which is where most folks get that leery opinion of heavy planes from.

The weather this fall here has been mostly summer. Many good days.

Grasshopper
10-21-2007, 06:01 AM
That looks great Bill. I like seeing the Stukas in paint schemes that aren't the norm. Beautiful Job!

Saucerguy2
10-21-2007, 10:40 PM
Bill, 20 oz is not a heavy plane, not at all, when you get into 2-3 pounds, then you have something to worry about. I try to keep my creations in the 20 oz range myself, sometimes I come out way ahead, othertimes, I'm happy to be close to it, especially since I fight the winds on a normal basis, so in heavy winds, I bring my weights with me for added nose weight putting them in over 20 oz ez.

If you opt to only fly it a few times and let it reside in your hanger to only be brought out for special events, there is nothing wrong with that at all. That's why I'm also into foamies, I don't mind wrecking them as much as my stick creations, but even the latter can be made bulletproof. Case in point with my Guillow's 108 cessna, and like you, I used enlarged plans on it. The mistake I made was not reinforcing where the wings joined onto the fuse, it crashed twice, once when one of the wing halves broke loose, the other when the other side did the same thing, the lateral bracing I added into the fuse is what saved the plane from certain destruction, sure there were repairs made, but just as in your case, the added bracing really saved it so it can handle abuse. I'm rebuilding the plane to handle even more torture so that it will fare well as a trainer, of which is what I intended it to be in the first place.

Bill G
10-23-2007, 02:37 AM
Bill, 20 oz is not a heavy plane, not at all, when you get into 2-3 pounds, then you have something to worry about. I try to keep my creations in the 20 oz range myself, sometimes I come out way ahead, othertimes, I'm happy to be close to it, especially since I fight the winds on a normal basis, so in heavy winds, I bring my weights with me for added nose weight putting them in over 20 oz ez.


Yep, after flying my 12.5oz much smaller Guillows FW190 for the second time today, I'm much less worried about the Stuka weight. I also have a scratchbuilt 109 about the same size and weight, that doesn't fly heavy, and glides forever.

The FW190 is getting better with tweaks, and should be really good the next flight, I hope.

Added the elevator strut braces to the Stuka, and still adding a few more little details.

Pic from today with the 190, and changing thrust angle after the flight, by adding washers to the motor mount. Last pics obviously the Stuka:

pd1
10-23-2007, 01:16 PM
Bill, The plane looks great, just like all your others.

Sea Bee next?

Paul

Saucerguy2
10-23-2007, 01:21 PM
Bill, The plane looks great, just like all your others.

Sea Bee next?

Paul

Nope, I'll be doing the Sea Bee!

pd1
10-23-2007, 01:22 PM
Looking forward to that SG.

Paul

Saucerguy2
10-23-2007, 01:46 PM
I was at my LHS today, one of the "retired" old timers was there, his name is Nelson, I tend to not call him by that name because I keep thinking, Simpsons version and at the same time, know he's the opposite by nature.

Nelson pointed out the plane in ARF version and I just had to explain to him, I don't do ARF's, I gotta build it since I enjoy that element just as I do flying it. He told me I'm a dying breed, yet we both agreed when I explained to him, our kit/scratch builds "he does his own builds as well in and out of the shop" will fly better and outlast any ARF currently produced simply because we take that extra TLC and extra expense on them.

I left with enough materials to pick up two ARF's, but know I come out ahead since I can make my plane(s) to my own specs and know only quality is put into everything. I come out ahead in the long run knowing these future creations will last much longer then any if not all ARF/RTF's on the market as well.

Back to the plane though, I built one in die cast plastic and strung it from the roof of my bedroom when I was a child, that was many years ago, I've been pondering building one into RC stick form, so looks like this is going to be the one to do at this point, the prompting and timing is perfect, it will make a nice winter new build/production project. I may even take it onto the next level. "evil grins here", hehe.

Bill G
10-24-2007, 03:55 AM
PD1, yeah I will get back on that soon. My problem is I have the most steam in the real building phase, and not detailing and linkage. I even had to kick myself to finish the last few Stuka details, like the spinning sirens made from cut down GWS 3020 props.

Saucer, I get a kick out of talking to older guys in the hobby shop that ONLY do ARFS.:D I think they get embarrassed when you tell them about all the Guillows bashes and stuff that we do, that they are supposed to be into also, from their era when folks actually built. Does give them a lot more respect for you, when they find out that you build.

Saucerguy2
10-24-2007, 05:47 AM
I'll be joining the ARF realm as a manufacturer soon, yet with a twist, I'm doing it to quality standards, my own standards only, not trying to compete with China, it seems people simply don't want to build from kits these days, at least from what I'm getting gis wise with the foamies. There are still a few, but most are only doing ARF's regardless of age bracket. They'll be stick built of course and I will stand by them to extreem degree's and not gouge these guys for replacement parts as most currently are doing.

I hear you on the nitty gritty details, those can be very time consuming, but you gotta admit, the plane is going to look really cool in the air with those in place.

pd1
10-24-2007, 02:07 PM
PD1, yeah I will get back on that soon. My problem is I have the most steam in the real building phase, and not detailing and linkage. I even had to kick myself to finish the last few Stuka details, like the spinning sirens made from cut down GWS 3020 props.

Saucer, I get a kick out of talking to older guys in the hobby shop that ONLY do ARFS.:D I think they get embarrassed when you tell them about all the Guillows bashes and stuff that we do, that they are supposed to be into also, from their era when folks actually built. Does give them a lot more respect for you, when they find out that you build.


Bill, I agree, as I get close to finishing a plane I tend to lose enthusiasm too.
Sometimes I have to put it aside for a while before I can get back and finish them off.
Even then your attention to detail is a quantum leap ahead of mine.


SG, I too find it remakable how many of the "old timers" only fly ARF's.

I have fun with a few of them now.
When someone asks me where I bought the "ARF" I'm flying, I usually tell them off the internet, it was on sale $29.99.

It's true, the balsa and materials only cost $29.99.
The plane was designed and built by me.


Paul

Saucerguy2
10-25-2007, 12:01 AM
$29.00, that's pretty cheap, I've been buying my balsa, carbon fiber and covering locally, so pay significantly more then that, but I don't mind knowing what I end up with, there is no comparison quality wise to what's on the shelves in ARF form. Well, unless I'm doing a foamie and I tell them it's $3.00 in materials I get from the hardware store. :)

The biggest appeal with ARF's is the time factor, yet I've heard on many occassions, especially with new pilots how they complain after putting their planes together that the weather is preventing them from flying, so there they are sitting and looking at it when they could be having fun building it. People don't realize how much we get out of this end of the hobby and even though it looks a little intimidating from the new builders perspective, it really is not, especially after having a few planes under your belt. I was building Guillow's kits when I was 9, if a child can do it, why the reluctance from the adults?

pd1
10-25-2007, 12:17 AM
SG, I buy my balsa at Balsa USA.
A sheet of 1/16 x 3 x 36 is about 0.60 cents.

I can get selected light weight balsa for only 20% more.

My local hobby shop has a poor selection and it cost 4 times as much.

Here's a link to Balsa USA.
https://www.balsastore.com/store/products.php?cat=12

Kids have no fear of not being able to finish a build.
I think some adults actually fear building a kit because they don't want to possibly fail.

Here's some of my balsa selection.

Paul

And now return to your regularly scheduled thread topic....

Saucerguy2
10-25-2007, 12:24 AM
I bookmarked the site, those prices are outstanding, I take it they are reasonable on shipping costs as well. I looked through their kits, have you tried any of them out? They look like they are geared strictly towards slimers.

pd1
10-25-2007, 12:26 AM
SG, Haven't tried the kits yet.

$100 of balsa was $7 shipping.
That's the box on the left, aside the Shoestring kit.

Paul

Bill G
10-25-2007, 03:41 AM
SG, Haven't tried the kits yet.

$100 of balsa was $7 shipping.
That's the box on the left, aside the Shoestring kit.

Paul
Well shipping doesn't cost that much for balsa I guess.
Its not like it weighs that much.:D

I really need to make a big order from Balsa USA. I've exhausted all the half-decent balsa from the few shops I go to, and then I have to wait for them to sell the rest of the oak:eek: before they order more, before I can sift through and get any useable wood. In all honesty, its a bit of a bummer since the Stuka should have been an ounce or more lighter, if I could have used better wood, but I've pretty much depleted all the decent sheeting in the shops I go to.

Saucerguy2
10-25-2007, 04:06 AM
If you don't mind using Midwest balsa, the local crafts stores usually have abundant stock of it on hand since people rarely go there for that purpose.

Bill G
10-25-2007, 05:22 AM
One of my LHSs carries Midwest. Some is decent, some is pretty heavy.

Stuka:
Finished one of the final details, the dive brakes.
Should be pretty strong, since I don't want the getting torn off. The iron-on covering will give the light 1/32" balsa a lot of strength. Actually worked the covering through the center openings in the dive brakes. The little mounts are thin ply. I slit the covering where they are glued to the flaps, and the mounts will also glue into slots that will be cut into the wing sheeting.

pacomb
05-07-2008, 05:14 PM
Hello Bill and all:

I do also love the stuka plane, but in Spain Guillow does not exist. Is it possible for some one to get me photocopy of the original guillow stuka 1/16 plans?

Many thanks to all

Paco

pd1
05-07-2008, 05:30 PM
Hi paco, Welcome to Wattflyer.

I think I might have a set of plans around for the Stuka.
I'll see if I can find them and scan them for you.

Paul

Bill G
05-10-2008, 01:26 AM
Hello Bill and all:

I do also love the stuka plane, but in Spain Guillow does not exist. Is it possible for some one to get me photocopy of the original guillow stuka 1/16 plans?

Many thanks to all

Paco
I just read this. I'll have to look and see what I have. I may have scanned them, and would then have a file. Been a while. I'll get back to you here soon.

PD1,
It's next on my list to maiden. Really gotta put this one up. I'm just too sentimental about it, that's all.:D
After the Peashooter maiden that just went well, I'm sure it should go fine.

Saucerguy2
05-10-2008, 06:48 AM
Look at it this way Bill, if you crash it, you can always repair it back to it's former state, and in fact, it gives you something to tinker around on as well. My p51 took some beatings trying to dial it in, the COG being one of them and with a symmetrical airfoil set at nuetral incidence, no room for leeghweigh at all and I spent entirely too much time building that bird to it's specs, be it not nearly as detailed as yours.

Something to think about, they have a new line of planes that are designed to be scaled down exactly and static, never meant to be flown at all you might want to look into. I think back now remembering the die cast models I used to build just to look at, it's also another avenue you might want to get into as well since it seems that element might suite you here.

pd1
05-10-2008, 12:19 PM
Bill, Glad to hear that.
I'm really waiting for the Sea Bee though.

Paul

FlyingMonkey
05-10-2008, 10:40 PM
Hello Bill and all:

I do also love the stuka plane, but in Spain Guillow does not exist. Is it possible for some one to get me photocopy of the original guillow stuka 1/16 plans?

Many thanks to all

Paco

Thanks to the internet, companies exist everywhere.

you can order the original plans from here...

http://www.balsamodels.com/Parts/kitparts.htm

this is the listing for all the stuka parts, including the plans (they call them instructions)

http://www.balsamodels.com/Parts/508-kitparts.htm

pick the number you want (plans 508)

then contact them here...

http://guillow.com/contactus.asp?UID=6138055

it will cost $4 plus postage, not too bad a deal

pacomb
05-11-2008, 09:10 PM
Finally

pacomb
05-11-2008, 09:45 PM
Finally I found a shop where I could buy the 30" version. I dont know why, but on the web page of guillows, the 30" version is not listed.

I am not sure if make it electric or glow version. I would like a small glow engine, but I recognize that electric is easy, clean, and ready to use always. I will think and ask people what have they done.

Paco

Bill G
05-12-2008, 02:47 AM
I dug up my enlarged plans from the small kit, which I built. I think they are enlarged to something like 34" span. If you found the kit then that's great. If not, I have the enlarged plan of the small version. It works well for a sheeted build, as the 34" kit has more framing than needed, if you are going to sheet the plane.
Phil (Smokin' Beaver) built one, and gave me the idea to do one.

Bill

karolenaz
11-20-2011, 01:21 PM
Nice model.