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View Full Version : Help with rewinding/fixing outrunners please?


GreenAce92
08-22-2008, 04:17 AM
Ok i have 2 2409-12's both have theri stator wires taken off, and shafts broken(but i hotglue my prop on so no worries) and i also have a kms motor that gives about 18oz of thrust its a low kv. all these motors' friends gave me, i kinda abused them so i would like to fix them. Can i just pick up some enamel wire from radioshack and rewind them? plus where do i find such small allan wrench's ?

Also how do i replace a shaft on a E-flite Park 480? i kinda did a stupid thing and i snapped the entire shaft to a stub(the shaft doesnt stick above the bell) so yeah i tried hotgluing somethign to the metal piece and pulling it out(after i took out the allan wrench screws) and it would work, i took apart the motor and tried pulling/pushing the main shaft but that didnt work so i just put it back together so i dont lose parts. Anyways yeah please help lol this motor mike gave me. lotsa helpfull people here at Wattyland

oh yeah man i love that when you put the outrunner back together it snaps back together its like sweet....

thanks

Biffidum
08-22-2008, 04:50 AM
I broke the shaft off of my outrunner yesterday. I got it apart, but I am trying to find a replacement 3mm shaft. I just bought another motor and will use the shaft from it. I can't keep doing that or I will get grief from my wife.

I tried searching for threads on brushless motor shafts but nothing comes up.

Looks like I will have to get a friend to machine me some shafts.

GreenAce92
08-22-2008, 05:43 AM
LOL looks like we in the same boat, yeah lesson learned even no matter how desperate you are, dont use a gas prop on an electric engine, the prop lives but the shaft snaps in half. amazing... lol

flydiver
08-22-2008, 06:46 AM
If you are looking for TP shafts go to HeadsupRC (http://www.headsuprc.com/servlet/the-MOTOR-SHAFTS-%26-BEARINGS/Categories)
They bend like putty-very soft. Buy lots if you don't have the tools to straighten.
Use prop savers if able and keep the shaft as short as possible.
I think KMS is just a rebadged TP but I've not seen one in real life.

You might also try these from GoBrushless. (http://www.gobrushless.com/shop/index.php?app=ccp0&ns=catshow&ref=shafts)
Cost more, better quality, but not sure if they would be a direct fit in a TP.

For e-flite shafts go here:
http://www.e-fliterc.com/Products/RelatedPartsSummary.aspx?ProdID=EFLM1500

If you want to learn winding that is a whole discipline in itself. I have just barely started and have wound 1 only motor. Great satisfaction that it works. A couple things I've learned is that Radio Shack wire is ONLY good for practicing. The enamel insulation is thin and brittle so you are likely to get shorts.

Those 2409-12 motors are likely to use something called dLRK winding, NOT the same as 'beginner' ABC winding (see GBv below). I did this by mistake using RS wire to wind a TP as ABC when it needed dLRK and couldn't understand why it just jerked around.

I suggest you read this thread:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=878258

Then if you want to pursue it buy the cheap $10 GBv from GoBrushless.com and wind that. They have information and a tutorial on the website. Then you'll start to get a feeling for what you have to learn. You will NOT have a cheaper motor than buying a new one. It's hard to compete against the Asian market. You will potentially have a better motor. You may also start to understand how and why you are trashing motors and how to stop doing that.

There is as much to learn about motors and winding as you've already learned about RC. It's not merely pick up a motor and wind some wire around it any more than it was get a plane and learn how to fly it. Remember when you thought that was all there was to it?

GreenAce92
08-22-2008, 07:23 PM
IVe put together a brushed motor and got it to work pretty good it was a boat with a D battery pretty sick, the only thing im concerned about is the order the wires go in when all of them are joined to plug into the bullets. like the orders of the wires going itno the bullets.

GreenAce92
08-23-2008, 02:33 AM
Phase 1 of Bm2409-12 motor recontstruction is completed i got it apart, i didnt know that the wound it in a patter like this: its like the went in thre stators in a triangle formation, like there are 9 stators(i think theyred called also i noticed each stator got 3 wires) so yeah they would go 1-4-7 or something around there ahh i cant explain it anyways i understand how its done, man these motors are hard to take apart the magnets are so strong i had to use a hammer and nail to remove the bell. these 2409-12's are strong, i fished out enamel wire i found from a thrown out tv i found in the woods, they were wrapped around what look like a plastic square with a hole in the middle like a transformer i used it before on a electro magnet(for an attempt to raise my submarine from the pond) but that didnt work(the magnet worked fine it was just not strong enough, i hope it can hold the volts ok but i mean from a TV? it should just fine ill find out.

gotboostedvr6
08-27-2008, 10:37 PM
the 2409 12 motors are a abc wind .. if you use 22 gauge and 7 winds terminated y you will get 1740 kv .. 2 strand of 26 gauge 12 winds terminated delta you get 1634 kv

gotboostedvr6
08-27-2008, 10:43 PM
I'm planning on winding it to get 3000kv using ABC and 2 strands of 22 gauge @ 4 winds on a fast wing.

GreenAce92
08-28-2008, 02:28 AM
Oooo that sounds great! i like speed yeah im having troubles with bringing them back to life so i thikn ill do what people suggested pick up a Go Brushless Kit thingy. But i want a big motor too not no whimpy one.

flydiver
08-28-2008, 03:42 AM
But i want a big motor too not no whimpy one.

With the GBv you'll end up with a small (but inexpensive) one. I've read (cannot confirm as of yet) that the double and triple stator GBx are good for 200W and 300W. Sounds optimistic to me but maybe I'll get there.

fly

GreenAce92
08-28-2008, 03:46 AM
200W maybe 300W sounds fine to me lol but that seems alittle big...

ron_van_sommeren
08-28-2008, 04:17 AM
Start small I'd say ... to get experience.

Tips, tricks, manuals, howto's ESC savers:
Tips & tricks (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240993)

Several excellent articles on building lrk and cd-rom motors, pictures, winding diagrams, by Brian Mulder a.k.a. 'Mr DIY' on E-zone:
www.southernsoaringclub.org.za (http://www.southernsoaringclub.org.za/)
-> Articles from Southeasters
-> Electric Motors - part 1 ... part 5

GreenAce92
08-28-2008, 07:09 AM
Yess!!! i successfully well sorta rewounded the 2409-12 motor, but i ran into a problem, it got hot!!! i got it to spin and all controllably and i used the winding method where you tie off three of the wires together and use the other three for the bullets. But yeah i was happy with my results. I think i got the same KV as what i had when she was new. Only problem like i said was the heat. lol

gotboostedvr6
08-28-2008, 10:32 AM
did you check if you had a short? what gauge is the wire you used/

GreenAce92
08-28-2008, 05:42 PM
I thought if you had a short it wouldnt turn at all? i dont know i believe its just that the wire gauge is too small well at least it cant take the voltage although it is pretty thick i could only get 6 turns around each stator.

ron_van_sommeren
08-28-2008, 05:48 PM
Either tie all three beginnings or all three endings of the wires together, star hookup.
In delta you tie the ending of one wire/phase to the beginning of the second wire/phase.

GreenAce92
08-28-2008, 06:28 PM
yeah i did the termination method. Its annoying i cant get it to start back up again lol. So ill buy some new enamel wire like thin stuff and perhaps triple or double wire it.

GreenAce92
08-28-2008, 07:32 PM
http://www.vimeo.com/1619911