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View Full Version : wich plane is easier to fly


ozcoz
01-22-2006, 07:40 PM
i hav a super decathalon and my dad has a pz p51 and want to know which is easier to fly

Twmaster
01-22-2006, 07:53 PM
For a newbie neither.

However if the only two choices are the above the choice is simple. The Decathlon.

watt_the?!
01-22-2006, 09:10 PM
p51..but only because the decathlon has nasty characteristics. (generally high wing jobbies are much better- b ut not this one unfort.)

the p51 will go where you put it but doesnt tip stall. This sounds easier, but in reality, for a beginner a plane needs to ''eventually go there''..it needs to be kinda mushy if you know what i mean.

however that being said, if you are going to buy PZ, get the stryker, it has absolutely no vices and is easier to fly than the p51.

Tim.

Sky Sharkster
01-23-2006, 12:30 AM
To OzCoz, my opinion is "neither". For what it's worth, you will have a much less painful experience if you get a $ 35.00 GWS Slow Stick and learn to fly on that. The Decathlon or P-51 Mustang would be a decent 3rd plane after a Slow Stick, then a Stryker or aileron-equipped E-Starter.
Another possibility is to hook up with your local R/C club and get some flying time on their trainer, also have an experienced flyer trim your planes out.
JMO
Ron

helo-watt
01-23-2006, 09:12 AM
Watt, Sky, Is the Stryker really that well behaved? I would have thought that the Cub or Dec, being "high wingers" would be a better 3ch plane to start out with. I'm currently waiting for conditions to get my Areobird Challenger up in the air, and had my sights set on the P-51 for the future. So do you recommend the Stryker before the Mustang??

watt_the?!
01-23-2006, 09:27 AM
im actually with Ron on this, but thought it was being restricted to the PZ planes.

ive personally seen guys buy the stryker one night, build it, turn up to the field, get it trimmed out by others etc...then take the sticks for a few laps...by the end of the day doing the whole lot.

i truly think it is one of the easiest planes to fly...but it is again a plane that ''goes where you put it''....

i would def go for the stryker before the mustang....and believe me it kills me to say it, as i like scale and nothing really excites me about a stryker for aesthetic pleasure...but having flown them, they really do fly well.

Tim.

MountainFlyer
01-23-2006, 11:47 AM
I owned a Decathlon, its actually not a bad plane if one puts a more powerful motor in it. but in its stock form its a horrible flying plane imo .. It's always on the verge of a stall and looking for a place to crash, not something a beginner wants. ;)
who ever recommended it as a "beginner plane" has obviously never flown it. and as for the PZ P51 ive never flown one .. The only Warbirds ive flown are some of the GWS warbirds and they are by no means a beginner plane. but i hear that the PZ one is a bit more friendly but i think that really depends on the pilot. I also would think the Striker would be a better choice if one was limited to just PZ/HZ Planes.

Sky Sharkster
01-23-2006, 03:19 PM
To Helo-watt, I believe the Stryker is one of the best aileron (actually elevon) trainers, along with the aileron-equipped E-Starter: With one important provision. Have an experienced flyer trim it out. Once the control throws are set correctly it is very easy to fly.
Having said that, I wouldn't recommend either of those, or the Decathlon or ANY Warbird as a first plane. As Mountain Flyerand Tim both mentioned, the PZ Decathlon is not your typical "Cub" high-winger. In the stock version it is under-powered and twitchy.
From my experience, the ideal first electric trainer is a rudder/elevator/throttle equipped high-wing model with ample dihedral, gentle control response and sufficent (not marginal) power. It should not be too fast nor so slow it is on the verge of a stall. It should be large and colorful enough to be seen clearly at altitude and have enough side area to allow the pilot to determine attitude and direction. If at all possible, it should be trimmed out by an experienced flyer and flown with a buddy-box. I know this is not a very exciting-sounding model but believe me there will be plenty of excitement anyway!
Once the pilot can fly that model sucessfully, a STryker or Aileron/E-Starter is a good second plane.
Hope some of this helps!
Ron

watt_the?!
01-23-2006, 09:45 PM
the art tech cessna is a good one.

scale too!

Tim.

opquickie
01-30-2006, 04:08 AM
first of all the styker should in no way be considered an aileron trainer. it is 3-ch and wouldn't fit as an ail trainer at all.

and as a stryker owner i have to say that i love it. today i took it out in probably 8mph avg winds with gust probably up to 12-15mph and it was a blast. the very first time i flew it i was pulling loops and stalls and rolls everywhere. it's a great plane and can grow with your skills especially if you go BL/lipo.

so i haven't flown the p-51 or decathalon but i can back up the assesment that it is a great plane.

i would imagine the decathalon would be more stable, but if not it is at least slower is it not? i mean it has a lower stall speed?

watt_the?!
01-30-2006, 04:11 AM
first of all the styker should in no way be considered an aileron trainer. it is 3-ch and wouldn't fit as an ail trainer at all.

.....

so i haven't flown the p-51 or decathalon but i can back up the assesment that it is a great plane.

i would imagine the decathalon would be more stable, but if not it is at least slower is it not? i mean it has a lower stall speed?

with respect, having flown all of them...i'd rate ease of flying as 1. stryker, 2 p51, 3 decathlon.

in fact i wouldnt fly the decathlon ever again its that bad.

azkeith
01-31-2006, 06:02 AM
The Best Trainer IMHO is-- EASY STAR. It will fly great with "the out of the box" power. Thats a rare thing now days. I think most ARF's are under powered at least 35%.
Get an Easy Star package follow instructions. make CG a bit nose heavy and it will fly great.
Keith

azkeith
01-31-2006, 06:05 AM
Easy

opquickie
01-31-2006, 11:55 PM
with respect, having flown all of them...i'd rate ease of flying as 1. stryker, 2 p51, 3 decathlon.

in fact i wouldnt fly the decathlon ever again its that bad.

hmm interesting. well i'm glad i didn't get the decathalon.

helo-watt
02-28-2006, 08:05 AM
Tim, Ron, I picked up a Stryker this weekend. One thing: above, you mentioned having an experienced flyer trim out the stryker...this is a problem. I fly "in the wild" on my own, so any help with this subject? I have to do all the experimenting by myself for the most part. I'm taking the Decathlon apart to send in the RX due to some glitches, and double checking all the wiring. In the meantime, my Aerobird is getting quite a workout. Hope to get a few pointers before making the Stryker a "lawn dart". -Paul

watt_the?!
02-28-2006, 08:40 AM
the great thing is that the stryker can be glued/taped back together.

you can throw it without power and glide it to the ground to get used to the reactions at first...dont worry if it darts in, it cant do much damage with the motor off...and if it breaks, tape it up and go again.

next, once you are confident in it, apply power enough to give it a gentle glide..remember to shut the power off just befoe landing though.

keep extending the glide.

the next bit is a bit of a step, but one you have to take... once you are happy (i cant recommend enough how helpful a simulator is with all this stuff), apply power and allow the plane to gradually spiral upwards to a decent height before trying any sort of circuits or moves...once up high, trim her out thenpractice turning left, right, up, down, then bring her down, power off..glide in to land.

next flight do the same but this time do a loop and a roll...etc..

mate- if you can get hold of a simulator...do it. they even have the stryker modelled on it. My young cousins ''played'' on the sim for a few weeks, then went straight out and solo'd.

a couple of things to not do..(applies to all planes).

never have the nose pointed high at slow speed (it will stall)
never try anything at less than 2 mistakes high.
never do ''just one more flight''
never fly is something isnt quite right..i.e. glitch, wind, connecting rod, mood (yes mood)..

here endeth war and peace.

Tim

thomdoe
02-28-2006, 02:41 PM
Watt the, I could not stop laughing at your third " never do" rule. Who many times have I walked with pieces from " just one more time". Keith

watt_the?!
02-28-2006, 10:52 PM
yep...its amazing how true and literal it is aint it?!

helo-watt
03-03-2006, 11:33 PM
Tim...never "just one more" huh? Oh buddy how right that is. Madien flights...were exhilirating to say the least. The CG was a bit off, as i've read before, so I adjusted the battery forward a bit. gave it a nice toss, and it glided pretty smoothly, behaved as i expected...time for power.

Tossed it under full power, and it turned to the left a bit. So I corrected with a small input- or so I thought! The plane almost rolled to the right, with the SLIGHTEST of input in compaison to my other planes. I was able to get it up to a "safer" altitude, but under full power it porpoised grossly, and still had a nasty want to turn to the left. Cut power to half throttle and tried to bring it back around. Seemed to stall often at full power, but at half throttle it was manageable. I glided it down safely, and adjusted the battery forward again. The control surfaces were even, so I left them alone at the clevises, but clicked in a bit of right to conpensate for the left turn.

Next toss, a bit less tendency to turn, but still climbing then diving under full power. This time half throttle was a bit better so i extended the flight a bit, and tried two circles around the pattern. This plane is VERY sensitive to input. The slightest THOUGHT of stick movement has it turning! Losing altitude in the turns ( a bit surprised at that) I had to dial in some power now and then to keep it up and bring it back to me. OK I thought, I should have it now, "JUST ONE MORE" famous last words huh?

One last toss, after moving the battery forward yet again. Now I finally had a hint of nose down when balancing. STILL it was porpoising under full power. I tried to circle it back, but no chance. In a left turn, it stalled, and dived into a spiral from about 50ft. No time to right it, and it nosed in. OUCH...MUCH CARNAGE. I have a new airframe on the way, and I will definitely be building one from scratch once I get the hang of this one...if I ever get the hang of this one. This will be my Spektrum's first airframe...

So what do ya think happened there?

watt_the?!
03-04-2006, 12:36 AM
adjust the amount of throw and also trim elevator down. put the CoG right on the manufacturer's recommendation. I think you will find full power will always create some lift.

you can simulate a R/E/T plane with low Aileron throws, but the problem is you will need faster reactions at times as the aileron a/c is inherently more touchy....you just need to be aware of this.

what will happen is that instead of you thinking the stryker is touchy, you will end up thinking your other planes are downright spongy...mushy...

its just what you are used to. many find it much more natural to be able to control the roll axis of a plane directly.

losing alt in turns...this will always happen, esp in a delta. dont turn so hard and keep elevator and even increase throttle in there.

just to keep it in perspective, and to not scare other beginners off...the styker at standard settings is actually quite tame....

compare it to many pattern/sports models and it is what they would call pedestrian...and compared to 3d planes, well...chalk and cheese.

so i think it's a matter of getting used to it. unfort you dont have a buddy box on hand.

Tim

Grasshopper
03-04-2006, 01:53 AM
Hello All,

I've just started back into the RC sport with electrics after having flown glow years ago. I took the easy way out and bought a PZ J3 Cub. It seems to fly pretty well. It will glide in at a very slow speed without stalling as long as your nose into the wind and I find that it corrects itself very well. I have only been flying again for about a month and this is the first electric I've purchased. Man am I glad I didn't get the Decathelon now. I almost bought it first because I thought I might be able to move into some simple aerobatics that way. I've also bought a PZ P-51 but it isn't going to see the light of day till I've got several hours back under the belt on a trainer. In a momentary lapse of sanity, I purchased a Cox warbird P-40 the other night and it will also be stashed for a while.

Do you think the P-51 will be very difficult to fly after flying the cub for a while? I used to fly 4 channel sport in glow but didn't know how electric was compared to a .40 size glow sport plane.

One thing I will add for any beginner (that includes me) is that this forum has been a huge help. Watt a wealth of info this place is and Watt a bunch of helpful people!!!!

Tom

Bill G
03-04-2006, 07:06 AM
Everyone always seems to have a "best trainer" definition. There is no such thing, since its more complicated than that. It depends on the flyer's natural style, for one, and things like wind conditions.
I'll compare the Slow Stick and GWS Beaver as an example of how this can work. Some flyers can handle a plane in rough winds, and respond very well on the sticks to that condition, granted that the plane flies in slow motion. I was like that. I could handle a Slow Stick in hellish winds, but got jittery when a plane flew faster. Another flyer might do better with a slightly faster and better wind cutting plane, like the GWS Beaver. Its going to respond more positively to inputs than the Slow Stick. This type of flyer does better with a plane where the response is not so slow, that they have to somewhat anticipate it.
Most will say that for flat out ease of flying, the Slow Stick is better than the Beaver. This is probably only true because of how much it is slowed down. The Beaver has a high wing with a low cg, making it extremely well self-correcting. To some flyers, this may make it easier to fly than the Beaver, even though things are sped up a bit.

Just my 2 cents. I'm sure somebody has a few dollars to add to this.

Twmaster
03-04-2006, 07:09 AM
I could handle a Slow Stick in hellish winds, but got jittery when a plane flew faster.

Geez Bill, you been peeking over my shoulder??? :rolleyes:

wobbles99
03-04-2006, 07:52 AM
If you are sticking with PZ then take a lok at the slow V or the J3 cub. I've got the cub for a first plane and find it very easy to fly. It may also interest you that PZ has great customer service. I had a replacement stripped fuselage come to me and the servo tray was crooked. After sending an email off to PZ they offered to replace then entire kit with a new one. That's right the whole thing. That rates pretty high in my books.

watt_the?!
03-04-2006, 09:05 AM
my comments only apply to PZ planes... i do like the stryker for aileron and ease of flying, but wouldnt recommend it as a first trainer...seems the consensus for that is the easystar..(?)

Tom, the PZ P51 isnt greatly difficult to fly...not too fast, doesnt respond really quickly.....generally good characteristics.

the only trick we found was in launching the thing...

Tim

opquickie
03-04-2006, 01:45 PM
i guess it's best to decide if you are looking for speed or maneuverability for the first plane. speed would probably lead you to somethin like the firebird freedom, which is much faster than the slow stick stock.

Grasshopper
03-04-2006, 04:13 PM
Tim, I've had people tell me that you should launch the P-51 at full throttle and it will dip a little and then climb out. I've had others tell me not to launch at full throttle or it will roll into the dirt. I've watched videos of them making a very smooth launch at full throttle without dipping. Unfortunately, all these people offering advice have never actually flown one. My first real experience was last weekend when I was at a local park and a guy showed up with the P-51. We talked a while and of course I asked a lot of questions since mine has never flown yet. He was pretty new to the sport and unfortunately when he launched it under full power, it was like the motor just cut off as soon as he let go of it and it made a firm glide to the ground breaking the prop. Since he didn't bring an extra, he was done.

Long story short, I still have yet to see one fly or know for sure what power setting to launch it at.

Thanks,

Tom

helo-watt
03-04-2006, 04:20 PM
I know a few of the guys here cringe when they see me type this, but for ease of getting in the air, you'll find it hard to beat any of the parkzone or hobbyzone planes. I own three of them, and wil soon get into building my own stuff. I'll keep them all. The firebird freedom has received a few complaints on forums, and I've never flown it, but the firebird commander I owned and it's a GREAT first plane. Floats at a good pace, not too fast, but not as slow as any of the "sticks". When I was ready for three channels, I picked up the Aerobird Challenger. Again, it floats nicely, and it's a little quicker than the Commander. Set it into "pro" mode, and it will teach you to pay attention. A quick jerk to the left or right, and you're spiralling. Loops are generally easy; if you're high enough and get into trouble, release the sticks, just a wee bit of elevator input and it will right itself. Next, I got a STEAL of a deal on a Super Decathlon. It handles a little different than the Cub from PZ, but it's S-L-O-W, which gives you time to correct any elevator or rudder errors you make. Now I have a Stryker. Durable, acrobatic, and you just can't beat the customer service from the folks at Horizon. I've experienced nothing but top notch service from them. Now, not that the other airframe/ radio combinations aren't good. No, they're GREAT. It's just that for a guy like me, with no club support, and just want easy to go, hassle free flying out of the box, I dare you to find a product with ALL these selling points: One box purchase; durable airframes; excellent customer service; TONS of spare parts support. Blah blah blah, ooh, eeh, ooh, ahh-ahh, ding, dang, walla-walla bing-bang, thus endeth sermon.

Bigfoot21075
03-17-2006, 03:40 PM
Seems no one has asked - Which Decathlon model do you have (who makes it) They are not all created equal! Same with the Mustang

helo-watt
03-20-2006, 10:09 AM
'foot, I have the Parkzone Super Decathlon. It's underpowered out of the box, FOR SURE. It floats along nicely though at about 75% power, and that gets me a good 8 minute flight with enough power to "abort" some landings. It's also a very tough airframe. I had some battery and propeller problems (outlined in another post) and as a result dead-stick landed a few times...bounced off the pavement a few of those. It's still flying, with no real visible damage. My only complaints are that it's underpowered as I said before, and the clearance from the prop to the ground is horrible. I almost ALWAYS scrape the prop on landings, regardless of how gentle. Other than that, great little plane, and beautiful in the sky.

PerlAddict
07-09-2006, 06:15 AM
Lot of folks talking about the PZ P-51 ... anybody flying the PZ Focke Wulf 190? Seems like I recall reading that they had made some improvements in the 190's design over the P-51's, though I don't recall what was cited, specifically. Was just curious what folks thought of it and whether or not it felt easier or more difficult to fly than the others mentioned in this thread.

Bill G
07-09-2006, 09:02 AM
wich plane is easier to fly

I don't know WICH plane is easier to fly, but I know a
Witch plane that I hear is easy to fly.:eek:

Bill G
07-09-2006, 03:09 PM
Lot of folks talking about the PZ P-51 ... anybody flying the PZ Focke Wulf 190? Seems like I recall reading that they had made some improvements in the 190's design over the P-51's, though I don't recall what was cited, specifically. Was just curious what folks thought of it and whether or not it felt easier or more difficult to fly than the others mentioned in this thread.

In scale models, I think the 190 itself is an improvement over the P51. Nicer design for rc.

jcblough
07-09-2006, 03:35 PM
On the stryker the porpoising(sp) can be addressed by adding down trim. The faster it flies, the more down trim you gotta add. That's why it was flying level at 1/2 throttle.

The stryker was my 2nd plane and I like it alot more than my freedom. Don't feel bad about burying it either, I crunched mine good the first week. Epoxy and packing tape got it back together and it has been fine since.

What I would suggest doing is keeping the set up stock - I think that is one hole in from the top on the servo horns and the top hole on the arms on the elevons. Take off and get up about 100 feet + and cut back to about 2/3's throttle and trim it so she flies level. If all is well, she'll fly totally hands off no worries. Then start taking slow wide turns. And just practice practice practice. You'll be surprised how quickly the speed and agility of the plane becomes expected and how comfortable you get with it. Before long, you'll be wanting for more speed and more agility, so then just move down the holes on the arm on the elevon and get some 8 cell packs. With practice, you can make some amazingly tight turns w/o losing much altitude at all.

I have easily increased my ability 10 fold with this plane. I love it. Not the prettiest looking thing but it is very reliable. It'll never surprise you.