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View Full Version : Magpie AP more durable than the non-AP Magpie?


xray328
03-11-2006, 12:29 AM
I was just wondering if the already durable Magpie is any stronger in the AP version?

Kosh
03-11-2006, 01:51 AM
The AP version is pretty much just a bigger version of the standard Magpie as I see it. Very close to the same build and just as durable.

xray328
03-11-2006, 01:59 AM
I thought I saw that it had balsa reinforcement?

aviatordave
03-11-2006, 02:56 AM
hey xray....I remember you.....

the AP magpie has a lite ply reinforced camera bay, longer fuse and larger wings. Are you still messing with the old original magpie?

xray328
03-11-2006, 03:21 AM
Well, I went to glow planes for a bit, but I'm tired of driving 45 minutes to the field when theres a perfectly good park 2 blocks away. I was considering the SS (again) but that Magpie just can't be beat. Mu Magpie bit the dirt (literally.) It cut off in flight a few times and the nose and outrunner got smashed up beyond repair. Anyway, now I've decided to go back with the Magpie. Just not sure which version. I'm leaning toward to AP version though. I'm just not sure how much thrust I need. My non-AP was 22oz. I think the MM website lists it at 12-13oz! The AP version is listed at 19oz. God knows what mine will weigh! My plan was to use a TP 3S1P 1320mah, a CC Thunderbird 18, and a Berg (CC) receiver to power a Esskay 400 outrunner. I hear they produce about 20oz @ 10A. I was considering a PJS unit but they are twice the cost. But of course they are twice as powerful.

Anyway, the reason for the thread was that I thought I saw some pictures of a balsa reinforced MP. Maybe that was a modification?

My first purchase this time around was a watts up meter.

aviatordave
03-12-2006, 05:32 PM
you might be thinking of this magpie (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4501235&postcount=591) that nakel built over in the other forum. I built mine stock like the directions and with camera mine weighs at 32 oz, with a 3 cell kokam 2000 mah battery. flies perfect and lands ever so soft. just remember that when you beef up one area, it allows another area for failure.......

good luck, let us know what you do-

Mountain Models got sold, but the new guy runs it the same - great service

-Dave

xray328
03-12-2006, 06:07 PM
Yep, that was the one. I guess that was a mod? Did he lasercut the parts? I only wish i had that much skill. My biggest gripe about the Magpie is the motor mount area. I wish it came in a pusher version. I'd think that would be better for AP anyway (get the prop outta the way.) Then you could easliy do a forward mount.

Funny though, I'm complaining because things start to break after I've nosed this $30 plane (fuselage only) in half a dozen times. Guess I better stay away from balsa. :D

I hope the addition of the landing gear saves me. I bet if I was landing on wheels instead of its belly I'd see a big improvement.

Anyway, back to the thrust issue...

20oz of thrust should be enough for a 32oz plane, right?

Sorry to hear they sold the place. Doug and Karen were great! But if the new guy is just as good, thats great. Hopefully he'll keep bringing us great planes.

aviatordave
03-12-2006, 06:16 PM
I believe he cut it out on a table saw....he might chime in here, he checks these forums also. I am pretty sure that 20 oz of thrust will do the trick, I'll find an article that better describes that...I remember reading about thrust vs weight somewhere. I'm sure you'll be ok with the thrust issue.....

are you planning on putting a camera in the plane or just fly it as a sport plane?

xray328
03-12-2006, 06:30 PM
It'll be a sport plane at first. Then if I can get it to fly I'll look into the AP aspect. Not sure if you remember my issues with this plane. When I put on the 54" wing I would lose all power (to everything) after a couple minutes. So there was no way I was going to strap a camera to it. I was using a GWS pack at the time which is rated at 6C I believe. Anyway, thats why I was nosing it in and damaging it. I would be flying, and then the power would cut and it would spiral into the ground. Very frustrating. But like I said, I have a watts up meter on the way, so hopefully I can work out all this on the ground.

I'd think a 22-24oz plane (no camera) with 20oz of thrust should be fun.

aviatordave
03-12-2006, 06:40 PM
I just looked back at some info and if you have a power system that provides 50% thrust to weight you can fly comfortably (take off, land, cruise around...no fancy stuff)
so from that info your 20 oz of thrust could propel a 40 oz plane, but since your going to be considerably lighter it should excel at flying.

My magpie has about 30 oz of thrust, but sometimes I need the extra ummph to get out of tight spaces. I pm'd nakel to chime in here so he can explain his modification's to you...

Dave

nakelp86
03-12-2006, 06:47 PM
Hi there
here I am Dave :-) got your pm.
Remember Im far from being an expert.
Xray,
The first thing I cut out the general shape ( with exacto knife) from 1/16 ply drew the lightening holes on one piece combined 2 pieces together (clamps)
drilled pilot holes in the openings and then smoothed them out with dremel sanding thingy.
At the time did not have a scroll saw so its all hand made :-)
My MAPie was 36oz loaded, dont remember the numbers anymore but I had enough thrust on my set up.
Remember that bench test is different from actual flying.
On the bench I barelly had enough thrust (looking at numbers) but in the air I had more than plenty.
Good advice for you check the MagAPie thread on RC groups.
U get all answers with pictures:-)
My MagApie is grounded for now till I make a new wings.
I had the entire computer box slid on it in the car and heard a crack.
U believably the foam cruched before any of my reinforcements.
Still wing was so strong I had to use my knee to break it in half (like a stick) to get it into the dampster.
Will try to use same building technique on all my wings, not a chance of folding in the air :-))

nakelp86
03-12-2006, 06:48 PM
wondering why would you lose the power. Something wrong with set up?
get some bullet proof electric set up and will fly forever :-)

xray328
03-12-2006, 06:53 PM
I thought I remebered something about .5:1 for sedate flying, 1:1 for aerobatics, and 1.5:1 for 3D?

Thanks for getting the info on that mod.

BTW, if anyones interested...

I bought the GWS lipo charger for $8.95 and it charged my pack right to 12.6V. I know its only good for 3 cell packs but I have the MKII and it only charges lipos to 12.2V. Its still handy though so that I can charge two packs to 12.2V, then finish them with the GWS charger.

I wonder how much difference there is between 12.2 and 12.6V performance wise.

xray328
03-12-2006, 07:01 PM
Wow, that was fast. Thanks for the info. Did you use epoxy to secure it to the foam?

That cutoff deal was a real pain in the rear. And there was nothing I could do once it happened. THe weird thin though is that it flew with the SF wing just fine. All I'd do is change the wing to the 54" AP setup and it would happen everytime without fail. That was the real mystery. Why would simply changing to a 54" wing cause that? Maybe the motor ahd to work harder? But then why would that cuase a total power failure (everything shutdown including the servos)? And by the time I'd get over to pick up the pieces everything was working again.

I wonder what CC swould charge to check the ESC. I know its $15 to repair it, but I wonder what a "check-up" would cost.

tandemssafetyguy
03-15-2006, 06:51 PM
I used some 6c lipos on my brushed 400 powered Slow Stick with a lipo friendly ESC and it would do the same thing. It would be flying find under full power and then just cut out. Turns out that it pulled all the juice out and the ESC would cut off. If I could glide it for a while then the ESC would reset or something and it would fly again for a while. I changed to a higher rated lipo and never had the problem again.

xray328
03-15-2006, 09:28 PM
Did you loose all power (servos too?) or just to the motor?

tandemssafetyguy
03-15-2006, 09:35 PM
I lost just the motor. The ESC senses the big voltage drop and cuts power to the motor but still has power to the servos. Did you loses everything?

xray328
03-15-2006, 10:29 PM
Yep. I lost the motor and servos. But again, only with the 54" wing.:confused:

Everything just died and the plane went into a nose down spiral into the ground.

It happened everytime I used the 54" wing.

tandemssafetyguy
03-15-2006, 10:45 PM
I am just guessing but with that much wing, additional weight, whatever prop and motor you used just pulled too much out of the 6C lipo battery at once that the voltage was too low to run things. When the battery was fully charged, it had enough umph to get it in the air but not keep it there. Maybe some electronic experts could help us out here?

xray328
03-15-2006, 10:50 PM
Yeah, that was my thought too. I'm starting over here with everything minus the ESC. CC said they can give the ESC a checkup free of charge. This time around I'll be using a TP 1320 with a 13C rating and a Esskay 400 with a Castle Creations TB 18 ESC. I'm just afraid to send it up again.

tandemssafetyguy
03-21-2006, 02:25 AM
Hey xray328. How did your Magpie fly with the new setup? The Park 400 outrunner has more than enough power to fly mine. I fly mostly at half trottle.

xray328
03-21-2006, 03:01 AM
Oh, I haven't ran it yet. I'm doing this piece by paycheck. So far I have the lipo, the esc, the watts up metter, and the Esskay 400 is on the way. Next paycheck it'll be the servos, then the Magpie to follow. I already have the wings from the old Magpie. In the past Doug was able to send just the fuselage at a reduced rate usually the full price - $20 for the wing I didn't need. I understand MM is under new management so I'll have to check if the new guys will do the same.

Trust me, you guys will be the first to know when I get it airborne.

I've gotta find a way to post videos. I have a digital camcorder, I just have to find a place to host it I guess.

Rugar
03-21-2006, 03:13 AM
You can upload your videos to Putfile. Free hosting.
http://www.putfile.com/

xray328
03-21-2006, 03:28 AM
Hey thanks! I'll check it out.

I need to find a faq on this. I can obviously record the video, but after that I haven't a clue.

nakelp86
07-03-2006, 02:40 AM
any help with the Mpie let me know,
Im not expert but I just love this plane

TexasRCFlyer
07-07-2006, 05:14 AM
I dont have anything to add, I wanted to follow this thread and I couldnt find how to just subscribe to it without posting.