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adhoc
05-09-2006, 11:44 PM
Okay, I've added some surface to my rudder (two cut down business cards CA'd together); seems to work okay, although my test flight this morning was in some wind so I was more focused on preventing a crash than evaluating rudder response... {grin} (I'm a beginner, this was only my 4th flight)...

The thing is, the rudder is just not very flexible; the foam hinge is still very stiff, and it doesn't return to neutral when I center the stick. Should I go ahead and cut the rudder off, and then reattach it with tape or something?

The elevator seems fine.

Thanks for any advice or hints...

qban_flyer
05-10-2006, 12:43 AM
Okay, I've added some surface to my rudder (two cut down business cards CA'd together); seems to work okay, although my test flight this morning was in some wind so I was more focused on preventing a crash than evaluating rudder response... {grin} (I'm a beginner, this was only my 4th flight)...

The thing is, the rudder is just not very flexible; the foam hinge is still very stiff, and it doesn't return to neutral when I center the stick. Should I go ahead and cut the rudder off, and then reattach it with tape or something?

The elevator seems fine.

Thanks for any advice or hints...Sounds like you need to loosen those hinges some. If not then cut the rudder off and re-hinge it using CA hinges and foam friendly CA. The rudder should be just as free as the elevator or you may risk stripping the gears on that servo. :eek:

Heard somewhere that the material floppy discs are made of works great for this purpose. I have not tried it yet, though I may in the next few days. :)

Deereret
05-12-2006, 08:27 PM
I use these. They are strong and easy to use. You can cut to smaller hinge size. Also you can and should use thin CA for them on the EasyStar. The foam is OK for reg CA. http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/WTI0001P?&I=LXFG21 If you would like more info on the use of these send me a PM and no I don't work for SIG.
Gene

qban_flyer
05-12-2006, 08:53 PM
I use these. They are strong and easy to use. You can cut to smaller hinge size. Also you can and should use thin CA for them on the EasyStar. The foam is OK for reg CA. http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/WTI0001P?&I=LXFG21 If you would like more info on the use of these send me a PM and no I don't work for SIG.
GeneAre you sure???? :D :D :D :D :D :D

Deereret
05-13-2006, 07:01 AM
Are you sure???? :D :D :D :D :D :D
I'm sure about the CA. The EZ is Elapor foam and the ARF manual says to use med CA an kicker for assembly. I did my fuse with poster tape to make it a bit easier to get at the innards. I did CA the tail feathers on as I didn't trust the tape there.
Gene

Deereret
05-13-2006, 07:04 AM
Are you sure???? :D :D :D :D :D :D
I'm sure about the CA. The EZ is Elapor foam and the manual says to glue with med CA and kicker. The thin will be fine for the hinges as they are designe to slow the thin CA cure to allow it to penetrate better.
Gene

qban_flyer
05-13-2006, 04:30 PM
I'm sure about the CA. The EZ is Elapor foam and the manual says to glue with med CA and kicker. The thin will be fine for the hinges as they are designe to slow the thin CA cure to allow it to penetrate better.
GeneNo, no, no! I highlighted the part I was questioning in jest. :D :D :D

What I meant was: Are you sure you don't work for SIG? :D :D :D

Poof, Landed!
05-24-2006, 12:10 PM
ADHOC; I'm not thrilled with the foam (stock) hinges on mine either. I was about to use an HS-81 (Hitec) [as instructions called for] on my elevator and an HS-55 on my rudder until I found this thread.
Infact, I was 15 minutes from CA glue time (rudder to elevator) when I noticed a deviance in the shape (molded) of my rudder while squaring it to the elevator and thought "time to go to WF".
So, the questions: a) are you using HS-81's for both rudder and elevator; if not what RU using, b) have U done the CA hinge yet? I've done them on Balsa but not EPP foam that's so thin:eek: ; and c) did your rudder seem hard to square, having to move the square forward and back ward till you could get around the moulding **** to get a flat surface on both sides at the same place, yet still feeling like the plane would make a very slow right turn if not trimed left due to it's shape!
When I used the thin CA hinges with balsa, I knew the balsa was going to help wick the CA off the hinge material, but with EPP I fear the CA will stiffen the hinge material as I've heard of others having the same problem with other foam models:confused: . HELP ME get this thing off the ground without bashing my fears. THANKS, Poof!

adhoc
05-24-2006, 05:09 PM
ADHOC; I'm not thrilled with the foam (stock) hinges on mine either. I was about to use an HS-81 (Hitec) [as instructions called for] on my elevator and an HS-55 on my rudder until I found this thread.
Infact, I was 15 minutes from CA glue time (rudder to elevator) when I noticed a deviance in the shape (molded) of my rudder while squaring it to the elevator and thought "time to go to WF".
So, the questions: a) are you using HS-81's for both rudder and elevator; if not what RU using, b) have U done the CA hinge yet? I've done them on Balsa but not EPP foam that's so thin:eek: ; and c) did your rudder seem hard to square, having to move the square forward and back ward till you could get around the moulding **** to get a flat surface on both sides at the same place, yet still feeling like the plane would make a very slow right turn if not trimed left due to it's shape!
When I used the thin CA hinges with balsa, I knew the balsa was going to help wick the CA off the hinge material, but with EPP I fear the CA will stiffen the hinge material as I've heard of others having the same problem with other foam models:confused: . HELP ME get this thing off the ground without bashing my fears. THANKS, Poof!
Hey Poof...

a) I got the Ready To Fly (RTF) version of the Easy Star, which came with Tiny-S servos already installed;

b) Sorry to say I have NOT redone my rudder yet! It is flying quite well with my business card extension right now; I'd still like to cut off the rudder and hinge it, but that is on the back burner; (my new Twin Star II will be on the front burner when it comes!)

c) As I said, I haven't done it yet, so I can't help you much. I was planning to cut off the rudder, AND the rest of the tail in a straight line up from the rudder; then I'll make a somewhat larger than normal rudder that goes the entire height of the tail. If I understand the "squaring" problem you are talking about, seems like that might help, since the new rudder wouldn't have to fit against anything on top.

In my opinion, aside from the original rudder being too small, the main problem is that the stiffness of the foam hinge causes some hysteresis, that is, after you swing the rudder left, and then release it, it doesn't return all the way to the center, but is still a bit left; then when you swing it right and release it, same problem, it doesn't center but keeps a bit right. I find I have to fiddle with the rudder a bit while I'm flying it to get it as centered as I can after turns...

BUT, I also see this as a very minor imperfection, and overall the Easy Star is a joy to fly. If you are getting ready to learn to fly RC with the Easy Star, I would NOT worry too much about getting the ruddar perfect -- you'll be able to easily compensate with trim, and while flying. It is almost impossible to build your airplane perfectly, and you'll almost always need to trim one or more of the controls anyway. I would say getting your CG right is far more important than getting the rudder perfect... (actually the Easy Star is not especially picky about CG, either)

If you are learning alone (I know, I'm making an assumption here), check out the various threads on the Beginners forum, including my own experiences teaching myself with the Easy Star (I think the thread name is something like "Success with Easy Star for older guy"). If you are really worried about crashing/failing, definitely get a flight simulator and an interface for your radio (I got a USB one that works well for both Windows and Macs), and put some hours in on that before you throw your real Easy Star up in the air. Also, make sure your first flights are in little or no wind!

BUT, the Easy Star is pretty easy to learn with, and really hard to damage... (last weekend I foolishly flew behind a small building and whacked into a baseball backstop; it knocked the battery and ESC out; I stuffed them back in, motor didn't want to start; disconnected then reconnected the battery, motor worked fine; only damage is two very slight indentations in the left wing; Easy Star was back in the air a minute later!) So don't worry, go for it, just fly!!!!

Poof, Landed!
05-25-2006, 01:07 AM
ADHOC:Thanks for your reply and the go for it spirit. I didn't realize you had the RTF version when I ask about the servos, though in hindsight I'm sure most were sold that way and by the time I got to the rudder I wished I had. I'm not afraid of crashing with foam, I spent all of last summer w/RTF's practicing hitting about anything imaginable, trees, guide wires, stop signs, ball field fences, etc.; all with little control surfaces or "Thrust Vectoring" (aka: U know your going to hit something, good luck"). But after I built the Hob-Lob Super Cub balsa kit, that careless side of me went away. I've since built two more planes, none of which have left the ground yet, though I did break the (home made) stearable tail wheel (TG) on the cub while praticing taxi movements thru a very small pot hole in a parking lot:o , lost control and hit my car:D :eek: ; but did wake up to how quickly many many hours of work can evaporate. Thus enter Easy Star. More fun. Again thanks, Poof!

adhoc
05-25-2006, 04:56 AM
ADHOC:Thanks for your reply and the go for it spirit. I didn't realize you had the RTF version when I ask about the servos, though in hindsight I'm sure most were sold that way and by the time I got to the rudder I wished I had. I'm not afraid of crashing with foam, I spent all of last summer w/RTF's practicing hitting about anything imaginable, trees, guide wires, stop signs, ball field fences, etc.; all with little control surfaces or "Thrust Vectoring" (aka: U know your going to hit something, good luck"). But after I built the Hob-Lob Super Cub balsa kit, that careless side of me went away. I've since built two more planes, none of which have left the ground yet, though I did break the (home made) stearable tail wheel (TG) on the cub while praticing taxi movements thru a very small pot hole in a parking lot:o , lost control and hit my car:D :eek: ; but did wake up to how quickly many many hours of work can evaporate. Thus enter Easy Star. More fun. Again thanks, Poof!
Oh yeah, I hear you! I considered a LOT of different planes for my 2nd, but in the end I decided to stick with the nearly indestructable Elapor planes, and ordered a Multiplex Twin Star II, because I want to spend my time flying, rather than building. I know a lot of folks here really get into the building and tweaking/tuning aspects. And I admit that I'm looking forward to customizing the paint scheme on my TS. But in the end I just want to fly, and not stress about crashing.... {smile} I'm not sure I'll ever do a balsa kit -- I'd worry too much about it...

(Reminds me of my model rocket days... same problem, I'd spend many hours putting together a complex, multi-stage rocket with a fancy paint job, and then I'd lose it or break it, sometimes on the first or second launch...)

But, I have to admit, sooner or later you have to fix or modify something, and it is that much harder if you started with an RTF... I'm looking forward to doing a bit more on the Twin Star II (although it is still not much work)...

Enjoy that Easy Star! I'd be out with mine now, except that it is gusty and raining... (okay, and dark now, too... can't see myself ever flying at night, lights or no lights!)

Andy

jb48
05-25-2006, 11:48 AM
After a few flights with the EZ, as many other fliers I wished a little more authority from the rudder. So I made it in two easy steps: first, I put a little piece of packing tape on one side of the junction between the movable part and fixed vertical part (fin), making sure everything was in straight line. On the other side, I filled the little slot with medium CA and activator and put another small piece of tape over the glue joint after curing (short) time. Next, I carefully (I insist on that word) cut away a straight line channel from over the glue line to the top of the fin, both side, mimicking the original crease in foam hinge as much as I could. Result: full span rudder and more control in windy conditions. But as posted by another EZ flier, I too found that the rudder doesn`t return neutral after relaxing the control, keeping a small angle deviation on the same side of the last rudder input. That was before rudder mod and it is the same after rudder mod. Curiously, the elevator, which uses the same hinging system always returns neutral? Maybe more flying time will Ğlooseğ the rudder hinge, but I am not sure about that. Now, if I can find the right CG balance so I don`t have to push or full trim the elevator to fight the permanent nose up tendancy, motor on or off, I`ll have the perfect plane for me.

adhoc
06-05-2006, 06:46 PM
I finally got around to redoing my Easy Star rudder. I cut off the original rudder completely, and continued straight up and cut off the rest of the tail (as others have described). I cut a new, much larger rudder out of balsa, and connected it to the tail with hinges. Unfortunately I didn't plan it out correctly; once I attached the servo horn at the bottom, I had to mount the whole rudder down lower than I wanted, so it doesn't look right. Also, the balsa has now warped a bit; fortunately I picked the grain direction so that it doesn't add any curve to the rudder action, but it still looks funny. I may redo it yet again at some point. BUT, it flies great this way, nice authoritative turns!

mikeyv
03-30-2007, 06:13 AM
I got an Easystar as my first plane just a few weeks ago. I used the AR6000 receiver (7 grams) with the S75 servos (7.5 grams). I use a 2 cell lipo on the stock 400 motor. I have not done the rudder mod yet but I think I will have to. This plane has literally scared the hell out of me a couple of times. It is pretty light with this setup and when the wind kicks up it does not want to come back to earth. Anything that helps me get more control just has to be better then the stock rudder.

Oh yeah, my ES is definitely a right turner. Somehow your insight on squaring the elevator and the tail escaped me during construction. Plenty of trim has it flying well in the sky. It is a blast to fly. I cant wait to do the rudder mod.

mikeyv
04-07-2007, 06:52 PM
I finally finished my rudder mod. I am really happy with the results. The ES turns are much more responsive. This mod has restored my confidence in being able to bring it back in when the wind picks up.

Now if it would just stop raining I could get some more flying in:)

sdeblebo
09-08-2007, 10:24 PM
A very easy mod to the tail is to use a sharp knife to carefully remove a V-section either side of the rudder above the mark you are meant to cut through. Be sure to leave enough foam to act as a hinge.

This is a simple and very effective improvement that has proved to be very durable. I can do barrel rolls and slow speed turns with the rudder set to 30 degrees deflection either side.