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-   -   hate soldering.....anyone else? (http://www.Wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73661)

tobydogs 04-30-2014 03:11 AM

hate soldering.....anyone else?
 
maybe it's just me.

I've been switching out the EC connectors to deans T's,even though i do an ok job i really find soldering one of my least favorite parts of this hobby. i tin the plug and the wire....put the 2 together and reheat,smoke gets in the air and my hands aren't as steady as they used to be. also i move so slowly do to the outside chance i might blob solder across the 2 poles for excitement no one wants.

so out of curiosity????,does anyone else dislike soldering? this is really a post for me to vent after only doing 3 batteries in an hr:oops:. did i say i was slow.......sheeeeesh:blah:

CHELLIE 04-30-2014 03:20 AM

Dont feel like the Lone Ranger :D I hate to solder too :D I can Arc, Gas, Mig and Tig weld, but i hate to solder :Q get yourself a helping hand from Harbor freight tools, and use Silver bearing solder from radio shack,( you can buy it from Radio Shack on EBay )it flows great and some rosin soldering flux, use a 100 + Watt soldering gun and that will speed up the process, hope that helps, Chellie

http://www.harborfreight.com/media/c...mage_18418.jpg

kyleservicetech 04-30-2014 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tobydogs (Post 946899)
maybe it's just me.

I've been switching out the EC connectors to deans T's,even though i do an ok job i really find soldering one of my least favorite parts of this hobby. i tin the plug and the wire....put the 2 together and reheat,smoke gets in the air and my hands aren't as steady as they used to be. also i move so slowly do to the outside chance i might blob solder across the 2 poles for excitement no one wants.

so out of curiosity????,does anyone else dislike soldering? this is really a post for me to vent after only doing 3 batteries in an hr:oops:. did i say i was slow.......sheeeeesh:blah:

Oh Boy
You've opened a can of worms here! :eek:

I've standardized on those Anderson Power Pole Connectors back in the mid 1990's, when these APP connectors were used at work. The company used over 1000 APP connectors a month back then. It's likely several thousand a month now.

That said, the current APP connector is no match for what my company used. The current APP connector is a cheaper unit. But, after much searching, Alliedelectronics does stock the original APP connectors.

The current APP connectors are only good for perhaps 40 Amps or so, but the Allied units have a notably thicker contact. I use them at 60 Amps continuous current with no problems. (I had one of those original APP connectors fail from overheating at a continuous 55 Amps. The other end of the same wire had the Allied connector, no problem was noted.)

Nice thing about these APP connectors, they are crimped with a crimping tool. After doing one or two of them, you can easily make a two wire connector in less than a minute.

If you go to the Allied Electronics terminal, remove the black plastic guide from the crimping tool. That black plastic guide doesn't work with the Allied units.

Here is more info:

Anderson Power Poles???
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64539

The Allied Shells are about 60 cents each. Do not buy the shells that cost $1.50 or so. This is a much larger connector that will handle perhaps 140 Amps or more as we use them. (I've got a few of those big connectors for other projects.)

tobydogs 04-30-2014 03:39 AM

thanks for the suggestion chellie,
i have and use that hand helper,got it at harbor freight. i do like getting odds and ends at HF. the alligator clips need replacing do to my over tightening the thumb screws. i'll fix that by filling the wire crimp area of the clips with solder to make them solid.

i have a 60 watt Weller that works great but the tip need replacing and always turns black after each solder. the sponge doesn't seem to work cleaning the tip.

4 more batteries to do and another 1 1/2 hrs of soldering. when i think of the guys here who made a living doing this kind of work soldering.....a few minute's per connector:Q.

Heli Jim 04-30-2014 03:40 AM

I agree with Cellie
Get a jig....they are cheap at Harbor Fright.

That holds everything steady for you.

gramps2361 04-30-2014 03:41 AM

Ba ha Denny I knew you jump in with the power poles.:D
Love the power poles myself fast to attach to the wire could do a whole bunch of batteries and the matching ESC in short time.

tobydogs 04-30-2014 03:57 AM

thanks Denny,

those crimp on connectors look interesting. but do the plastic covers have red and black together or do you plug pos and neg wires separately one at a time.that would be a little annoying with more loose wire to handle. also how large are those plugs:confused:. if all i had to do is crimp new connectors on that would be very tempting to switch plugs:ws:. especially knowing they could handle more power than the deans.
stu

CHELLIE 04-30-2014 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tobydogs (Post 946904)
thanks for the suggestion chellie,
i have and use that hand helper,got it at harbor freight. i do like getting odds and ends at HF. the alligator clips need replacing do to my over tightening the thumb screws. i'll fix that by filling the wire crimp area of the clips with solder to make them solid.

i have a 60 watt Weller that works great but the tip need replacing and always turns black after each solder. the sponge doesn't seem to work cleaning the tip.

4 more batteries to do and another 1 1/2 hrs of soldering. when i think of the guys here who made a living doing this kind of work soldering.....a few minute's per connector:Q.

Dip the soldering tip into the flux once in a while and use a damp paper towel thats been folded a few times and wipe the tip after every use with it, you got to keep the tip of the soldering gun clean, tighten the screws that hold the soldering tip to the soldering gun. I found that a 100 Watt soldering gun works the best to keep things flowing, sometimes i have to solder 8 to 10 Gauge wire, and a 100 Watt soldering gun is a Must for larger wire diameters.

thepiper92 04-30-2014 04:21 AM

What I do is hold the connector in a pair of pliers with a elastic wrapper around the plier handles. That leaves both hands free. I slip the shrinks around the wires, drip solder is the xt60 holes and then heat it up really quick and push the wires in. Then just take a lighter to the shrink tubes. It helps to have a strong soldering iron, as you can heat up, and put the wire in before the solder solidifies, rather than needing to keep heat on the area.

kyleservicetech 04-30-2014 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tobydogs (Post 946908)
thanks Denny,

those crimp on connectors look interesting. but do the plastic covers have red and black together or do you plug pos and neg wires separately one at a time.that would be a little annoying with more loose wire to handle. also how large are those plugs:confused:. if all i had to do is crimp new connectors on that would be very tempting to switch plugs:ws:. especially knowing they could handle more power than the deans.
stu

Those APP connectors can be singe wire, two wire, three wire, or what ever number is required. These units have locking tabs on them that allow the plastic shell's red shell, and black shell to lock together.

I've found that it's a good idea to put a tiny drop of thin CA between the black and red shells to permanently lock them together.

The APP connectors are slightly larger than the Sermos units.

Don't try to crimp them with a pair of pliars. That will not provide a quality crimp. The proper crimp joint consists of a gas tight connection between the wire and the terminal. Try to pull the wires out of the terminal, and, good luck. They don't come out.

kyleservicetech 04-30-2014 04:34 AM

[QUOTE=tobydogs;946904]

i have a 60 watt Weller that works great but the tip need replacing and always turns black after each solder. the sponge doesn't seem to work cleaning the tip.

QUOTE]


I've also got one of those 60 Watt Wellers. It's OK, but I've also got a Weller 100 Watt temperature regulated soldering iron. This soldering iron also has iron plated tips, rather than bare copper. Those tips last a long long time.

Nice thing about temperature regulation, the soldering iron doesn't just keep getting hotter and hotter during none use, but levels off at about 700 degrees F. Soon's you try to solder, that tip cools off a little bit, the soldering iron powers up, and keeps it at 700 F.

Nice.

http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69147

and

http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59884

thepiper92 04-30-2014 04:52 AM

Power poles are good, unless you get solder outside of the wire seating, or it comes out the bottom, making it difficult to seat the contacts into the plastic housings. What is good about this is you can solder on positive and negative completely separate from each other and shrink tubes are never needed.

kyleservicetech 04-30-2014 05:05 AM

[QUOTE=thepiper92;946918]Power poles are good, unless you get solder outside of the wire seating, or it comes out the bottom, making it difficult to seat the contacts into the plastic housings. What is good about this is you can solder on positive and negative completely separate from each other and shrink tubes are never needed.[/QUOTE

????

Anderson Power Pole connector terminals are CRIMPED, not soldered. I suppose you could solder a crimped connection, but the crimped terminal has better continuity than solder ever can.

APP does have solder type terminals, I've got some, but much prefer the crimped type terminals. Both the solder type, and crimp type terminals fit into the same plastic shell.

Also, since the terminals are crimped, there is no problem with soldering your wires to a terminal mounted in plastic, and deforming the plastic with heat.

AirmanAirhead 04-30-2014 05:19 AM

The only thing I would add to the suggestions already given, is try to solder with a consistent manner each time. With a good clean iron, it becomes easier to approach it exactly the same way each time. Tin the wire, make sure the bullet has solder in it, not too much, not too little. With practice you will find that you can keep things consistent and that results in no surprises, no big drip, no seepage that keeps you from pressing the bullet into the connectors, etc. Frustration often results in skipping simple little consistent practices that then results in even more frustration.

A good iron as suggested above will keep consistent heat. When all these things come together, it really is not that big of a deal and the mystery/frustration diminishes considerably. Did I use the word "consistent" enough?

Jeff

kyleservicetech 04-30-2014 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AirmanAirhead (Post 946924)

A good iron as suggested above will keep consistent heat. When all these things come together, it really is not that big of a deal and the mystery/frustration diminishes considerably. Did I use the word "consistent" enough?

Jeff

Can't agree more on a quality soldering iron with temperature regulation. I've got over a dozen soldering irons and guns in my collection. My two temperature regulated irons do 99.9% of my soldering, the other's sit in a plastic bin on a shelf.

thepiper92 04-30-2014 05:31 AM

[QUOTE=kyleservicetech;946922]
Quote:

Originally Posted by thepiper92 (Post 946918)
Power poles are good, unless you get solder outside of the wire seating, or it comes out the bottom, making it difficult to seat the contacts into the plastic housings. What is good about this is you can solder on positive and negative completely separate from each other and shrink tubes are never needed.[/QUOTE

????

Anderson Power Pole connector terminals are CRIMPED, not soldered. I suppose you could solder a crimped connection, but the crimped terminal has better continuity than solder ever can.

APP does have solder type terminals, I've got some, but much prefer the crimped type terminals. Both the solder type, and crimp type terminals fit into the same plastic shell.

Also, since the terminals are crimped, there is no problem with soldering your wires to a terminal mounted in plastic, and deforming the plastic with heat.

Yes sorry. I did read that. I myself have never seen crimped versions but they do sound like a better method for power poles.

hayofstacks 04-30-2014 06:29 AM

http://www.headsuphobby.com/images/b-205.jpg

If you use deans, you could cheat...

mclarkson 04-30-2014 06:53 AM

I'm not going to get into the Deans vs. APP vs. EC3 debate.

I will say that I used to hate soldering. However, now that I've gotten a halfway decent soldering station, I can take soldering or leave it alone. Decent equipment made a WORLD of difference to me.

Soldering tasks went from hours of torture to minutes of mundane chore.

JetPlaneFlyer 04-30-2014 07:01 AM

I quite like soldering, there is something satisfying in working with molten metal and getting it to flow smoothly into a joint.... Maybe I'm just strange:rolleyes:

Admittedly the fumes are a bit unpleasant.

thepiper92 04-30-2014 07:10 AM

Soldering is just something that needs doing so you can get to the fun stuff. With kits, I love the building, don't like the covering, but it completes the plane. Same with soldering. Even if crimp connectors are used, there are a number of motors and escs that still require soldering of bullets. I haven't need an stations, just an iron that melts the solder well, my pliers to hold connectors, and under a minute of time usually it is all done. The smaller the area, the harder it gets though. Connectors are easy, led light strips are fairly easy, but solder point are much smaller, and boards...well I've tried a few times and its definitely not easy to solder on connection points of fets where each contact point is a millimeter wide. Steady hands and aiding equipment are a must. In general, you could graph an exponential graph of level of hate and size of the area of soldering. :p> Most are at the bottom with simple connectors and bullets, as so level of hate should be fairly low; most electronics in the RC's are complete for us, and require minimal work.

thepiper92 04-30-2014 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer (Post 946929)
I quite like soldering, there is something satisfying in working with molten metal and getting it to flow smoothly into a joint.... Maybe I'm just strange:rolleyes:

Admittedly the fumes are a bit unpleasant.

I prefer mercury :D

Actually it is quite amazing to see soldering, how this wire turns it liquid and if it drips onto a surface it looks like a puddle, but no!!! It's not a puddle at all!!

kyleservicetech 04-30-2014 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer (Post 946929)
I quite like soldering, there is something satisfying in working with molten metal and getting it to flow smoothly into a joint.... Maybe I'm just strange:rolleyes:

Admittedly the fumes are a bit unpleasant.

Yeah
After near 50 years of soldering all sorts of stuff, both at work, and at home, I've gotten real sensitive to those fumes.

So, now, I've got a high powered blower that was scrapped out at work that pulls in all the fumes, and blows them out side of the house.

kyleservicetech 04-30-2014 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tobydogs (Post 946899)
maybe it's just me.

I've been switching out the EC connectors to deans T's,even though i do an ok job i really find soldering one of my least favorite parts of this hobby. i tin the plug and the wire....put the 2 together and reheat,smoke gets in the air and my hands aren't as steady as they used to be. also i move so slowly do to the outside chance i might blob solder across the 2 poles for excitement no one wants.

so out of curiosity????,does anyone else dislike soldering? this is really a post for me to vent after only doing 3 batteries in an hr:oops:. did i say i was slow.......sheeeeesh:blah:

Forgot to mention with those APP connectors. You can stick them together in line, or you can rotate one APP connector 90 degrees from its attached mate. That way, you can positively prevent connecting a wrong set of plugs to different ESC's or something similar.

I do that with an Battery charging plug/arming plug using three APP connectors side by side. The black/red connector is charging, the red and rotated yellow connector is arming. Works out well.

If desired, I can provide wiring diagrams and photographs. Its pretty easy to do.

carpetbagger 04-30-2014 01:01 PM

My jig for bullet connectors is shallow holes drilled into a 1x4 scrap wood. I dress the tip of my ancient 60W iron with a sanding board while it heats, then tin it with fresh solder and proceed. I always tin the parts before attempting assembly.

60W is plenty. Someday I'll go shopping for a 45W iron and miss my dainty 15W iron I used to work on circuit boards back in the day.

Do I like soldering? Not really but it is a required skill in our hobby and once I get going it's kind of fun. Sometimes I klutz a joint and the garage words fly, but cheers can be heard when a joint comes out pretty.

riverrat 04-30-2014 03:11 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Works great, with these old hands!

Regards
Jimmy


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