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-   -   aileron-elevator-spoilers set up (http://www.Wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73803)

carpetbagger 05-28-2014 12:28 PM

aileron-elevator-spoilers set up
 
Operating off small fields I've decided to try spoilers. Problem is my budget electronics is limited to 4-channels. Mode 2 right stick is rudder and elevator, left is throttle for e-power - good so far, but spoilers? How do you set up a spoiler channel? Rig it so moving left stick one way or the other deploys spoilers? Modification of that stick, say removing spring centering, or connecting wires to a toggle switch mounted somewhere on the Tx cas?

Or should I suck it up and get a Tx with more channels?

fhhuber 05-28-2014 03:52 PM

Considering how cheap the "off brand" systems are now I'd just get the new radio.

carpetbagger 05-29-2014 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fhhuber (Post 949223)
Considering how cheap the "off brand" systems are now I'd just get the new radio.

Where's the challenge in that? Somewhere in the UK they've been messing with a RadioLink 4 channel ($50) and adding a fifth channel, that would work if I could find the details. And I figured one of the creative folks here would have a slick linkage answer to my question.

solentlife 05-29-2014 05:56 AM

Given that there are plenty of 6 ... 8 ch radios out there that are serious budget priced .. can't see the point of mucking about with a 4ch.

For less than $50 shipped - there are 6ch radios which will do the job properly .... for less than $90 shipped there are 8ch sets that put most 'branded' radios to shame ... and give you far more flexibility and capability than 99% of people ever need.

The other fact of course is having a radio that others can use also ... not so much a decider if you can fly already and don't need others help ... but if still learning - then it pays to stay with normal operation style. That way others can help.

Nigel

carpetbagger 05-31-2014 04:30 PM

Okay, I'll take the dive into a computer radio with numerous channels. When the box arrives I can tell Milady the Pros ordered me to buy it! I hope you folks are handy when my tiny brain starts to hurt while I try to noodle out the various program options:-)

fhhuber 05-31-2014 05:12 PM

Plug in servos for an airplane... one servo per channel (using the standard R E T A + ch 6 = 2nd aileron) and load the other channels ... then start playing with mixes and see what they do.

Note that JR/Spektrum 1= throttle, 2 = aileron, 3= elevator , Futaba/Hitec 1= aileron, 2= elevator, 3- throttle and Airtronics does something else...

And different brands do servo reverse different... Futaba throttle (actually all channels) is reverse to JR.... and JR vs Futaba one uses + expo and the other use -
So do initial testing without a prop on the motor.
Everyone puts rudder on 4.

If the closest you can get on elevons is correct aileron but reversed elevator just swap which servo is in which channel. This has to do with the order the radios apply the mix vs the servo reverse.

carpetbagger 05-31-2014 09:39 PM

Thanks. I'm familiar with Futaba, have one, and first deal with that was I had to reverse the throttle channel to fire up the ESC. Of course before I figured that out I discovered the safety rule = no prop. Lucky me, the inside the house launched plane at WOT missed Milady's nearby plant. My other Tx is RadioLink and is works like the Futaba, probably a Futaba clone, and my budget 7 channel will most likely be RadioLink as well.

I have several small servos that have real long arms apparently for pull-pull systems, so I will use those to get an eyeball on the effect of end point set and expo.

AEAJR 07-01-2014 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carpetbagger (Post 949208)
Operating off small fields I've decided to try spoilers. Problem is my budget electronics is limited to 4-channels. Mode 2 right stick is rudder and elevator, left is throttle for e-power - good so far, but spoilers? How do you set up a spoiler channel? Rig it so moving left stick one way or the other deploys spoilers? Modification of that stick, say removing spring centering, or connecting wires to a toggle switch mounted somewhere on the Tx cas?

Or should I suck it up and get a Tx with more channels?

Yes you could put the spoilers in the rudder channel and have them closed when the stick is centered and move the stick to the left to open them, but you will have to hold it there and do elevator comp with the right hand at the same time.

Getting a computer radio is a good idea.

What are you using now?

You might find this helpful.

How to select your first radio
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68741

carpetbagger 07-01-2014 09:19 PM

I got a computer radio . . .
 
AEAJR - yes I did. Tactic 650 which I am now noodling over the setup. my next adventure will be hooking up servos so I can eyeball the result of my twitchy-finger program inputs. Might even try spoilers on one of the 3-position switches, like closed, half open, wide freaking open. Since you are a learned glider pilot, and my experience is limited to A-1 towline, is there any reason to half deploy spoilers?

Found a site in the UK and a tutorial on adding a fifth channel to my Radiolink 4 channel. Such a simple mod if my radio pc board is the same as the one modded in the UK many moons ago.

AEAJR 07-01-2014 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carpetbagger (Post 951989)
AEAJR - yes I did. Tactic 650 which I am now noodling over the setup. my next adventure will be hooking up servos so I can eyeball the result of my twitchy-finger program inputs. Might even try spoilers on one of the 3-position switches, like closed, half open, wide freaking open. Since you are a learned glider pilot, and my experience is limited to A-1 towline, is there any reason to half deploy spoilers?

Found a site in the UK and a tutorial on adding a fifth channel to my Radiolink 4 channel. Such a simple mod if my radio pc board is the same as the one modded in the UK many moons ago.

I think you will like that radio. I hear very good reports.

Half spoilers? Sure! In fact I have my spoilers on the left stick instead of the throttle so I have them totally variable. Thottle moves to a switch. On or off - climb or glide is all I need on the throttle.

But spoilers on a 3 pos switch is just fine. Be sure you set up the spoiler to elevator mix, or perhaps it will be the flap to elevator mix, but put the spoilers on that channel. You don't have to get them straight up. I would go for 30 degrees and 60 degrees and the appropriate amount of elevator compensation for each of those settings.


Spoilers

Spoilers sit on top of the wing, typically near the spar. Spoilers will reduce lift while inducing drag, but their primary value is not as brakes but as lift reducers. This raises the stall speed, the speed at which the wing can no longer produce enough lift to support the aircraft. So the wing will stall at a higher speed. Some rise like barn doors. This is what we typically call spoilers. Some come straight up like a blade. These we often call air brakes.

When spoilers are deployed typically the nose will drop, due to reduced lift, and we compensate with some up elevator to keep the glider from going into a dive. This is best done with the flap to elevator mix or spoiler to elevator mix, depending on which you have on your radio.

The best effect is that the glider remains fairly flat but the sink rate is raised so it comes down more quickly but without gaining a lot of speed.


Here are some resources you may find helpful.

Detecting Thermals
http://f4bscale.worldonline.co.uk/Thermals.htm

BIRDS, THERMALS AND SOARING FLIGHT
http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/nature/q0253.shtml


Performance Tuning Gliders
http://www.flyesl.org/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=227

The Simple Pleasure of Soaring
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8802505&postcount=38

TUNING THE ELEVATOR
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rz0SqTPv3PQ



> Using Ballast
http://www.flyesl.org/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=232



> Test Flight Procedures
http://www.flyesl.org/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=226


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