Wattflyer RC Network: RC Universe :: RCU Magazine :: RCU Forums :: RCU Classifieds :: RCU User Reviews :: RCU YouTube
Home Who's Online Calendar Today's Posts RealTime Post Spy Mark Forums Read
Go Back   WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight > R/C Electric Power - Batteries, Chargers, ESCs and More > Batteries & Chargers
Register Members List Wattflyer Extras Articles Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Social Groups

Batteries & Chargers Discuss Li-P, Li-Ion, NiMh, Nicad battery technology and the chargers that juice 'em up!

Thank you for your support (hide ads)
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-10-2014, 02:42 PM   #1
Hogflier
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 9
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default Lipo Battery fully charged??

How can you tell if a lipo battery is fully charged. I bought a Turnigy Accul-6 50W 6A Battery Charger. I hooked it up to the proper port on the charger and got all kinds of readings except what I wanted to know, and that is, the state of charge the battery is in. When i put it into my trans. it showed 9.9V right out of the box, no charging or nothing. I then tried it out on my plane and everything worked great. Its a zippy 1800 mah Transmitter battery. Do these things come fully charged, this one seemed to have. I have just recently switched to electric, so actually I know hardly anything.
Hogflier is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 03:13 PM   #2
Rodneh
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 718
Thanked 69 Times in 68 Posts
Club: Moonport Modelers
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

You do not say how many cells but from the info you gave it must be a 3 cell unit. Now a LiPo should read 4.2 volts per cell or, in your case if a 3 cell, should read 12.6 volts fully charged. At 9.9 volts, the cells were dangerously near the critical low level. LiPo's are normally delivered in a partially charged state and never lower than 3.7 volts/cell. It will serve you well to do a bit of study on the care of LiPo's, lots of info here on this site. You can quickly ruin a LiPo be discharging it to low.
Rodneh is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 03:56 PM   #3
fhhuber
Super Contributor
 
fhhuber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,096
Thanked 209 Times in 200 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (1)
Default

They shouldn't ship a 3 cell at 9.9 v.... it should ship at 11.1 v.

Full is 12.6 for 3 cell.

LiPos are very predictable about voltage relationship to % of full charge. Modern LiPos start to be damaged below 3.5 v/cell at rest. 9.9v might be OK for a LVC setting, but its TOO LOW for the battery with no load on it.
fhhuber is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 05:07 PM   #4
xmech2k
Ya got any Beeman's?
 
xmech2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 2,543
View xmech2k's Gallery21
Thanked 238 Times in 236 Posts
Club: CVMRCC, SEFSD
Awards Showcase

1kW  Outstanding Contributor Award 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (7)
Default

Where was that chart? Here it is. Found it posted by immelguy over at RCG. Mind you, the voltage is the voltage per cell. If you're going to stay in this hobby, you should really get a volt meter that can plug into the balance plug and tell you each cell's voltage.

xmech2k is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2014, 03:45 AM   #5
kyleservicetech
Dennis V
 
kyleservicetech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 7,934
Thanked 683 Times in 666 Posts
Club: www.racinercclub.com (I'm the newsletter editor)
Awards Showcase

Outstanding Contributor Award  3kW  2kW  100mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (1)
Friends: (20)
Default

Originally Posted by xmech2k View Post
Where was that chart? Here it is. Found it posted by immelguy over at RCG. Mind you, the voltage is the voltage per cell. If you're going to stay in this hobby, you should really get a volt meter that can plug into the balance plug and tell you each cell's voltage.

Do you have the tread at RCG? That long time storage at 4.2 Volts DC affecting battery internal resistance is interesting.

DennyV
Retired and the days are just too short, busier than ever!
kyleservicetech is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2014, 01:28 PM   #6
Hogflier
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 9
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default battery condition

Yes thanks Kyle, somtimes just asking a question will keep a guy from reading a manual the size of a telephone book.
Hogflier is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2014, 04:10 PM   #7
xmech2k
Ya got any Beeman's?
 
xmech2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 2,543
View xmech2k's Gallery21
Thanked 238 Times in 236 Posts
Club: CVMRCC, SEFSD
Awards Showcase

1kW  Outstanding Contributor Award 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (7)
Default

Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
Do you have the tread at RCG? That long time storage at 4.2 Volts DC affecting battery internal resistance is interesting.
Is that not true? I already asked the poster permission to use it in our club newsletter, and it turns out he found it elsewhere himself. And it was posted to give a new person an idea of how to care for his batts iirc. If it's not true, I'm certain it is bad to keep your lipo fully charged, what is the science behind it? One of our club members who flies a large electric plane was complaining the batteries were getting puffed and would barely fit any more, and in the course of the conversation it turned out he stored them fully charged. I forget if he was losing performance.

@ hogflyer: Not that I've ever charged a life battery, but on my chargers I have to select the type of battery I'm charging. You post sounds like you're not making a battery type selection? IDK, maybe your charger is ok with that, but just checking.
xmech2k is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2014, 05:25 PM   #8
JetPlaneFlyer
Super Contributor
 
JetPlaneFlyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
Posts: 4,327
Thanked 477 Times in 445 Posts
Awards Showcase

5kW  Outstanding Contributor Award  1kW 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (8)
Default

Originally Posted by xmech2k View Post
Is that not true? I already asked the poster permission to use it in our club newsletter, and it turns out he found it elsewhere himself.
Yes, it's true.

The best resource I've found that talks with authority on the subject is here: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/a...ased_batteries
JetPlaneFlyer is online now  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 01:34 AM   #9
kyleservicetech
Dennis V
 
kyleservicetech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 7,934
Thanked 683 Times in 666 Posts
Club: www.racinercclub.com (I'm the newsletter editor)
Awards Showcase

Outstanding Contributor Award  3kW  2kW  100mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (1)
Friends: (20)
Default

Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
Yes, it's true.

The best resource I've found that talks with authority on the subject is here: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/a...ased_batteries

Thanks for the link. That article is interesting.

I'm beginning to appreciate my over weight, oversized, undervoltage A123 cells even more and more. They don't care how they are stored, and as long as you don't discharge them below 2 Volts per cell, they last a long long long time. Also, it seems that as these batteries get old, like five years or more, with hundreds of flights on them, their internal resistance doesn't change. What does happen is lower ampere hour capacity, like a loss of 10 or 15 percent of original Amp Hours.

I just flow my Redwing models MXS-R model today for three flights. (Winds were gusting at 23 MPH). The 10S2P A123 pack was last fully charged November 10, 2013. Topping that battery off today took 74 Mah. So, in five months of sitting in the model, the 10S2P battery lost 1.7% due to internal discharging. That's typical of these cells. Not bad.

DennyV
Retired and the days are just too short, busier than ever!
kyleservicetech is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 05:29 PM   #10
JetPlaneFlyer
Super Contributor
 
JetPlaneFlyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
Posts: 4,327
Thanked 477 Times in 445 Posts
Awards Showcase

5kW  Outstanding Contributor Award  1kW 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (8)
Default

Are you sure the battery is a LiPo and not a LiFe? LiFe batteries have lower voltage.

As noted above, if it's a 3s LiPo then it's basically already over-discharged at 9.9v and risking permanent damage or 'instant death' if you run it any lower. You also will suffer loss of power on the Tx shortly because voltage will be about to collapse catastrophically, there is almost nothing left in the tank of a LiPo when they get that low.

What about a link to the actual battery?
JetPlaneFlyer is online now  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2014, 02:02 PM   #11
Hogflier
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 9
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

you are right, this battery is a life, but my charger says life/lipo, so i guess i will charge either one the same.
Hogflier is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 01:24 AM   #12
kyleservicetech
Dennis V
 
kyleservicetech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 7,934
Thanked 683 Times in 666 Posts
Club: www.racinercclub.com (I'm the newsletter editor)
Awards Showcase

Outstanding Contributor Award  3kW  2kW  100mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (1)
Friends: (20)
Default

Originally Posted by Hogflier View Post
you are right, this battery is a life, but my charger says life/lipo, so i guess i will charge either one the same.
LiFe and LiPo batteries use different chemistry. And, each one has its own charging routine. Don't mix them.

LiFe cells are to be charged to a peak voltage of 3.60 Volts per cell. Compare that to a LiPO that is to be charged to a peak voltage of 4.20 volts per cell.

Charging a LiFe battery to 4.2 Volts per cell is not good for it, and may damage it.

DennyV
Retired and the days are just too short, busier than ever!
kyleservicetech is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 06:24 AM   #13
solentlife
Super Contributor
 
solentlife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Ex UK Brit now in Latvia west coast - Ventspils
Posts: 5,921
View solentlife's Gallery47
Thanked 235 Times in 232 Posts
Club: Founder Member Ventspils RC Club. Ex Waltham Chase and Meon Valley Soaring.
Awards Showcase

Scratchbuilders Award  Scratchbuilders Award  Outstanding Contributor Award  125mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (15)
Default

Originally Posted by Hogflier View Post
you are right, this battery is a life, but my charger says life/lipo, so i guess i will charge either one the same.
That totally changes the matter and voids near all replies.... LiFe are a different ball game and charger needs to be user set to them.

Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
- Subscribe my Youtube: "solentlifeuk"
solentlife is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2014, 06:49 PM   #14
solentlife
Super Contributor
 
solentlife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Ex UK Brit now in Latvia west coast - Ventspils
Posts: 5,921
View solentlife's Gallery47
Thanked 235 Times in 232 Posts
Club: Founder Member Ventspils RC Club. Ex Waltham Chase and Meon Valley Soaring.
Awards Showcase

Scratchbuilders Award  Scratchbuilders Award  Outstanding Contributor Award  125mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (15)
Default

Originally Posted by Hogflier View Post
How can you tell if a lipo battery is fully charged. I bought a Turnigy Accul-6 50W 6A Battery Charger. I hooked it up to the proper port on the charger and got all kinds of readings except what I wanted to know, and that is, the state of charge the battery is in. When i put it into my trans. it showed 9.9V right out of the box, no charging or nothing. I then tried it out on my plane and everything worked great. Its a zippy 1800 mah Transmitter battery. Do these things come fully charged, this one seemed to have. I have just recently switched to electric, so actually I know hardly anything.
Details of LiPo and details of Transmitter ..

If its a 9x Transmitter - the voltage reading is wrong anyway - they all read low.

The main thing to remember with the charger - is that it will cut-off at FULL charge when operated. So no need to know exactly voltage or charge state - as the Charger will look after that for you.

It's always good to know state of your batterys though and that's where the WATTMETER comes in handy .... it gives a direct reading of % capacity remaining etc.

Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
- Subscribe my Youtube: "solentlifeuk"
solentlife is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2014, 04:20 PM   #15
hayofstacks
Super Contributor
 
hayofstacks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Utah
Posts: 1,553
Thanked 115 Times in 114 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (5)
Default

Storing fully charged does kill batteries. i had a few a barely used that i chargrd up and forgot about that puffed up badly in about 6 months.

my 4000mah 3 cells sat for a year before u charged them above the storage charge, and worked fine since.

slow stock prop reversal. it flies! easily! 543 watt dual motor bipe slow stick. push-me-pull-you. 242 watt 3 channel slow stick. 365 watt mini ultra stick. 415 watt mini contender. 810 watt ultra stick .25e. 220 watt alpha 450 sport (retired).
hayofstacks is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2014, 04:51 PM   #16
Hogflier
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 9
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Thanks to you guys I might not have ruined the battery, i also got more info on Youtube in a video. It covered charging , discharging and storage. The storage recommends the battery be about half charged.
Hogflier is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 01:35 AM   #17
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,181
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

Fully charged certainly does kill lipos. I had a 5000mah 3s was originally taking my rc car up to over 70mph, then came winter, and after the snow was gone I couldn't get past 40mph with it and it lasted maybe 3 minutes.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 02:39 PM   #18
Hogflier
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 9
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

I'm back guys. I've learned a lot about Life batteries. This particular Life battery is a 1800 mah transmitter battery. I have studied my Accucel -6 charger and learned how to quick charge, balance charge and store charge. What's puzzling me now is when I get it all set up, I get a connection break error. I'm using one of those jump start things for my power supply, made to jump start a car, it has a USB port and Cigarette lighter port. Does this thing have a diode or something to protect the car battery and interrupt the current?? I cannot figure out why i keep getting this error, I've followed the directions to the letter.
Hogflier is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 08:47 PM   #19
kyleservicetech
Dennis V
 
kyleservicetech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 7,934
Thanked 683 Times in 666 Posts
Club: www.racinercclub.com (I'm the newsletter editor)
Awards Showcase

Outstanding Contributor Award  3kW  2kW  100mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (1)
Friends: (20)
Default

Originally Posted by Hogflier View Post
I'm back guys. I've learned a lot about Life batteries. This particular Life battery is a 1800 mah transmitter battery. I have studied my Accucel -6 charger and learned how to quick charge, balance charge and store charge. What's puzzling me now is when I get it all set up, I get a connection break error. I'm using one of those jump start things for my power supply, made to jump start a car, it has a USB port and Cigarette lighter port. Does this thing have a diode or something to protect the car battery and interrupt the current?? I cannot figure out why i keep getting this error, I've followed the directions to the letter.
You might want to check the LiFe batteries balance connector with a voltmeter, to make certain the individual cell wiring matches what your Accucel - 6 charger expects. I've seen several LiFe batteries that use the standard servo connector wiring for the balance cable. And, the pin-outs have varied on some of them.

As for me, I re-terminate these wires with my own connector, so there is zero possibility of accidentally mixing a LiFe battery connector with a servo connector while hooking everything up.

DennyV
Retired and the days are just too short, busier than ever!
kyleservicetech is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2014, 05:43 AM   #20
solentlife
Super Contributor
 
solentlife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Ex UK Brit now in Latvia west coast - Ventspils
Posts: 5,921
View solentlife's Gallery47
Thanked 235 Times in 232 Posts
Club: Founder Member Ventspils RC Club. Ex Waltham Chase and Meon Valley Soaring.
Awards Showcase

Scratchbuilders Award  Scratchbuilders Award  Outstanding Contributor Award  125mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (15)
Default

Originally Posted by Hogflier View Post
I'm back guys. I've learned a lot about Life batteries. This particular Life battery is a 1800 mah transmitter battery. I have studied my Accucel -6 charger and learned how to quick charge, balance charge and store charge. What's puzzling me now is when I get it all set up, I get a connection break error. I'm using one of those jump start things for my power supply, made to jump start a car, it has a USB port and Cigarette lighter port. Does this thing have a diode or something to protect the car battery and interrupt the current?? I cannot figure out why i keep getting this error, I've followed the directions to the letter.
Connect BOTH main and balance leads of battery pack.

Power in to charger is INPUT ERROR

Power out of charger has many different error messages - one being CONNECTION BREAK - where you haven't connected main battery lead or balance plug.

It has nothing to do with the car starter battery etc.

Advice : The Car starter battery pack - is usually only about 7 - 12A/Hr ... this is small and will not charge many average packs ... it will also struggle to charge anything over a small 3S pack.

Nigel
Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
- Subscribe my Youtube: "solentlifeuk"
solentlife is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 03:07 PM   #21
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,181
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

Get an ac adapter first of all, so you can just plug it into a wall. There should be some available for that charger. I don't even think a cigarette lighter has enough oomph, but I could be wrong. A USB charger definitely won't suffice, very low amps. it takes 30 minutes for me to charge a 250 mah battery. 1300...really long time. A connection break shouldn't have to do with the source, as if there is one...well your charger would be off, but it could be detecting too weak of a supply. It may be the wires going between the battery and charger, one could be not plugged in all the way, or a solder joint giving a bad connection, or a connector isn't making good contact.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 03:20 PM   #22
Hogflier
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 9
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

You'd think that a power source with the oomph to start a car would be enough to charge an 1800 mah battery. Im going to try it straight through my car battery via cigarette lighter port. I'll let you know what happened.
Hogflier is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 03:39 PM   #23
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,181
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

The car battery yes, but is that lighter port receiving enough? I don't know what they produce myself. If you connect right to your car batt, there will be no issues.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 04:36 PM   #24
xmech2k
Ya got any Beeman's?
 
xmech2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 2,543
View xmech2k's Gallery21
Thanked 238 Times in 236 Posts
Club: CVMRCC, SEFSD
Awards Showcase

1kW  Outstanding Contributor Award 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (7)
Default

I hate to send you to the manual hogflier, but you might want to verify, I imagine a connection break error is between the charger and the battery you're charging, not the power supplying the charger. If that were the case the charger just wouldn't be on. Check the connections between the charger and the battery. Make sure it's set to the correct cell count too.
xmech2k is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2014, 06:04 PM   #25
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,181
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

Connection break on my iMax only means a bad connection. It will have another error if battery is the wrong type. Ive had a number of connection breaks when I was using nimh batts in receiver, and i stick tape on the positive of one batt, tape on negative of another and throw the other 6 batts in between. Lol, maybe not the best way to charge, as if one batt wasn't touching, connection break. For charging, mine has lipo, life, nimh and nicd, all separate. Your charger should be the same for the most part
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Reply

  WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight > R/C Electric Power - Batteries, Chargers, ESCs and More > Batteries & Chargers

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
100+ MPH Club CHELLIE Hi-Performance and Sailplanes 1955 08-20-2014 02:55 AM
Battery boxes - design or retail ? solentlife Scratch and Kit Built Aircraft 25 09-08-2013 11:47 PM
For Sale Power Wing, 2100mAh 2S 7.4V 20C LiPo Battery JimH Ca Batteries and Chargers Forsale/WTB 8 07-04-2012 03:13 AM
GT Power XDrive 6 Davethebluessinger Batteries & Chargers 20 02-10-2012 11:39 PM
"best" weekday charged lipo voltage for the lazy weekend flier? aeroknot Batteries & Chargers 5 06-14-2011 03:12 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:22 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005 WattfFlyer.com
RCU Eflight HQ

Charities we support Select: Yorkie Rescue  ::  Crohn's & Colitis Foundation



Page generated in 0.69097 seconds with 67 queries