Wattflyer RC Network: RC Universe :: RCU Magazine :: RCU Forums :: RCU Classifieds :: RCU User Reviews :: RCU YouTube
Home Who's Online Calendar Today's Posts RealTime Post Spy Mark Forums Read
Go Back   WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight > Electric R/C Airplanes > Beginners
Register Members List Wattflyer Extras Articles Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Social Groups

Beginners New to e-power flying? Get the low down in here from experienced e-power RC pilots!

Thank you for your support (hide ads)
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-20-2011, 06:46 PM   #1
DanWard
Member
 
DanWard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Deer Park, Tx (East side of Houston)
Posts: 178
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (1)
Question Help - CC Ice 75 - new guy needs help

Hello,

The new guy is trying his best to build a plane with quality components. Yes I am guilty of pruchasing a lot of my stuff from China (plush speed controller and turnigy motors) and this plane...well I want to do the best quality my budget could afford.

So right or worng my research ended with me purchasing a Castle Creations ICE75, Castle Creations ccBEC,Scorpoin S-3032-12, and 4000mA 4S1P Nano tech batteries.

What I'm experiencing is with the prop on (not noticed without the prop) I'm getting studder right at zero speed. Sometimes this studder is more noticable than others. Sometimes you can just hear it. Other times you can see the prop turn 1/4 turn the wrong way, or bobble back and forth a couple of times, before it turns around and runs in the right direction.

I checked all motor lead connections both visually and with a fluke 87. I see could see no measurable risistance or voltage drop across the bullet connectors but I resoldered just for grins and sill no measureable risitance or voltage drop across the bullet connectors. But it still does it.

I have tried every possible motor connection combination that produces proper rotation direction and it does it with all combination. I logged on the the ICE75 and reversed direction in it and then tried all motor lead combinations again and I still get it.

Heck, it happened even when running the wrong direction.

Here are my ICE settings and results.

I have throttle settings in ICE75 set for airplane, auto endpoint detection with medium throttle response

I have Brake disabled

I have cutoff set for auto lipo, 3.2 volts per cell, soft cutoff.

I've tried low, medium, and high motor start power and noticed no difference, left it at medium.

I have not played with PWM frequency but castle creations recommended 8kHz and that is what I have it set on.

I've tried low, normal, and high timing and noticed no change in the studder so I left it at normal.

I am prepared to just live with it. I only notice it when coming off zero speed and I'm not sure if that would affect flying performance or not.

It is just sort of a bummer because my Plush ESC and Turnegy motor runs like a sewing machine and my expectation was this "better" equipment ... well I was not anticipating this problem (if in fact it is a problem).

I'm hoping there is someone out there with Castle creations ICE experience that may be able to offer some advice or a possible solution short of buying a Hacker motor

Thanks in advance to any and all that take the time to read and possibly responde.


Attached Files
File Type: pdf S-3032-1.pdf (26.2 KB, 158 views)
File Type: pdf scorpion-3032-12-687kv-1200-watt-brus.pdf (37.1 KB, 152 views)
DanWard is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2011, 07:06 PM   #2
Sir Crash-A-Lot
Crash Specialist
 
Sir Crash-A-Lot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 294
Thanked 34 Times in 34 Posts
Club: AzWingNutz
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (2)
Default

Try outrunner mode on the Speed Control and see if that helps. Also that is what was known as Scorpion Screech and there is a very good explanation of that here:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...postcount=1090

Mike

P.S. BTW I have a few Scorpions that do it every once in a while and none do it once the planes are in the air.

Sir Crash-A-Lot is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2011, 07:24 PM   #3
DanWard
Member
 
DanWard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Deer Park, Tx (East side of Houston)
Posts: 178
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (1)
Default Thanks Sir-crash-a-lot

Reading the spec on the scorpion motor it really does sound like I made a good purchase. I did see some post about bearing periodic maintenance (lube) that I didn't see for other motors but after all my reading I wasn't sure this maintenance is a requirement or just...well...some of the stuff you read on the internet.

And I think the ICE 75 is a good purchase based on what I could read about it.

I'll try outrunner mode and see how that does and not worry about it much if it doesn't clear up. Seems to be while in the air even if I did go to zero speed the windmill effect will keep the prop turning such that I may never notice it during flight.

Also thanks for the link. Interesting reading. But after reading it I'm suprised that playing with the ICE75 starting power setting didn't help. It is my understanding that this variable controls the amount of power sent to the motor when coming off zero speed. Having now read the post in the link you provided I picture as this variable would have delivered more power coming off zero speed to over come the magnets...but I must still be learning and not fully understanding.

Thanks again!
DanWard is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2011, 08:26 PM   #4
Merritt
Member
 
Merritt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 69
View Merritt's Gallery1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Club: Austin Radio Control Association
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (8)
Default Are you using a futaba transmitter?

Originally Posted by DanWard View Post
Hello,

The new guy is trying his best to build a plane with quality components. Yes I am guilty of pruchasing a lot of my stuff from China (plush speed controller and turnigy motors) and this plane...well I want to do the best quality my budget could afford.

So right or worng my research ended with me purchasing a Castle Creations ICE75, Castle Creations ccBEC,Scorpoin S-3032-12, and 4000mA 4S1P Nano tech batteries.

What I'm experiencing is with the prop on (not noticed without the prop) I'm getting studder right at zero speed. Sometimes this studder is more noticable than others. Sometimes you can just hear it. Other times you can see the prop turn 1/4 turn the wrong way, or bobble back and forth a couple of times, before it turns around and runs in the right direction.

I checked all motor lead connections both visually and with a fluke 87. I see could see no measurable risistance or voltage drop across the bullet connectors but I resoldered just for grins and sill no measureable risitance or voltage drop across the bullet connectors. But it still does it.

I have tried every possible motor connection combination that produces proper rotation direction and it does it with all combination. I logged on the the ICE75 and reversed direction in it and then tried all motor lead combinations again and I still get it.

Heck, it happened even when running the wrong direction.

Here are my ICE settings and results.

I have throttle settings in ICE75 set for airplane, auto endpoint detection with medium throttle response

I have Brake disabled

I have cutoff set for auto lipo, 3.2 volts per cell, soft cutoff.

I've tried low, medium, and high motor start power and noticed no difference, left it at medium.

I have not played with PWM frequency but castle creations recommended 8kHz and that is what I have it set on.

I've tried low, normal, and high timing and noticed no change in the studder so I left it at normal.

I am prepared to just live with it. I only notice it when coming off zero speed and I'm not sure if that would affect flying performance or not.

It is just sort of a bummer because my Plush ESC and Turnegy motor runs like a sewing machine and my expectation was this "better" equipment ... well I was not anticipating this problem (if in fact it is a problem).

I'm hoping there is someone out there with Castle creations ICE experience that may be able to offer some advice or a possible solution short of buying a Hacker motor

Thanks in advance to any and all that take the time to read and possibly responde.

If you are using a futaba try reversing the throttle on the transmitter.

Merritt Pratt
AMA #831578
Round Rock, Texas
Merritt is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2011, 09:15 PM   #5
Sir Crash-A-Lot
Crash Specialist
 
Sir Crash-A-Lot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 294
Thanked 34 Times in 34 Posts
Club: AzWingNutz
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (2)
Default

Originally Posted by DanWard View Post
I did see some post about bearing periodic maintenance (lube) that I didn't see for other motors but after all my reading I wasn't sure this maintenance is a requirement or just...well...some of the stuff you read on the internet.

Thanks again!
That lubing is for the helicopter motors, I have several hundred flights on some of my motors and have never lubed the bearings.

Mike

Sir Crash-A-Lot is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2011, 02:27 AM   #6
Larry3215
Look out for that tree!!!
 
Larry3215's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Gig Harbor, Wa USA
Posts: 6,797
View Larry3215's Gallery63
Thanked 692 Times in 671 Posts
Club: Kitsap ARCS & E-FLAPS
Awards Showcase

90 Minute Thermal Duration  60 Minute Thermal Duration  30 Minute Thermal Duration  4kW 
iTrader: (6)
Friends: (21)
Default

Dan,

Your settings look ok, but Id recomend you stick with low timing. Outrunner mode may help or it may not.

Are you running the newest firmware in the ICE? newer versions do start better.

Now to the key question - are you "sneaking up" on the throttle very slowly? That will often result in what you are seeing. Some motors just will not start or run smoothly at very low rpms and very low throttle settings.

If the motor starts ok when you just push on up to 1/4 throttle or so - even if there is a slight initial jerkiness - then I wouldnt worry too much about it.

A word of warning on Outrunner mode. Outrunner mode allows some motors to run waaaaaaaay beyond their max efficiency points. In other words, running outrunner mode may allow you to over load the motor well beyond where it would normally stop working. You could burn it up if its over proped.

My advice it to get and use a watt meter to be sure how many amps your system is pulling.

In most cases outrunner mode is perfectly safe. Its only if your setup is way over propped that you may have trouble.

Normally a motor will complain - screaching, loss of sync, poor starting and stuttering at full power - if its grossly over propped and your trying to push it way too hard.

Outrunner mode is a special mode castle came up with that allows the motor to keep running smoothly even when grossly over worked. So its a good idea to check before you run too much in outrunner mode.

Like I said - in most cases its not a worry and infact it makes many outrunners run a bit more efficiently and with a bit more power. But its best to be safe

I think I need a signature.
Larry
Larry3215 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Reply

  WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight > Electric R/C Airplanes > Beginners

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Question Ice 75 Controller Resistance Merritt Castle Creations discussion 6 01-31-2011 05:36 PM
For Sale Cc bec pro brianfp_400 Motors and Speed Controllers for sale & WTB 0 12-27-2010 02:10 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:28 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005 WattfFlyer.com
RCU Eflight HQ

Charities we support Select: Yorkie Rescue  ::  Crohn's & Colitis Foundation



Page generated in 0.17486 seconds with 33 queries