dual rate and expo

[Yakfishingfool]

Do they change from plane to plane? I am setting up my Super cub LP and Champ. Went with settings in owners manual of the dx6i, just as written. Is that ok? Too much too little? Thanks. Scott

[flydiver]

Absolutely.
D/R and EXPO are PLANE and PILOT specific.
What you might use on a jet, you absolutely would not use on a 3D slow flier.
Recommendations are just that....recommendations, but they are a good place to start.

[Yakfishingfool]

Is it pilot experience that determines the rates or does the plane mfg'r suggest settings? I am relatively new to this and so would think I would not want 100% movement when flying, and a less sensitive stick until I master the small movements needed for success. I can see a jet needing reeling in vs my super cub, more forgiving. Makes sense

[flydiver]

The Mfg'r suggests what seems to work well for 'most people'. That covers a LOT of ground.
Ultimately it's up to you. You'll be messing with the settings for years until you sort out your own preferences.

Oh, what to do, what to do?
Go with the suggested settings.
Play around from there. As you gain experience your preferences for the same plane will change, so you adjust accordingly.

[Yakfishingfool]

thanks Fly, I actually really understand the two now after watching a couple of great video's. It really is up to the pilot and the squirliness of the plane. Will make some adjustments and give it a try. Thanks again. Scott

[dahawk]

On the Super Cub, you might start with 30% expo on rudder and 20% on elevator. On planes with ailerons like the T-28, I started off with 40% on ailerons, 30% on elevator and 20% on rudder. Expo simply smoothes out the control movement.

For dual rates, you can simply try 40-50 % for low rates and see how you like it. For a Super Cub, you probably don't really need dual rates. I added ailerons to my SC after a while. makes it a much better plane.

On my small , fast and twitchy warbirds and edf's , it's not uncommon for me to apply 60-70% expo and dual rates. Sometimes need to adjust the servo end points for the throws as well.

[hoghead5150]

i'm with ya hawk, but i am exactly opposite of some of your settings. all personal preference, but i usually set up 30% on ailerons, and 40% on elevator. seems i usually am more aggressive on the elevator so the expo helps tame that a little!!

[hayofstacks]

I have never used either on my dx6I. Tried the expo settings for my mini ultra stick, and hated them. Ended up reseting everything and just flying it normal, which I felt gave me much more control and a better feel.

I could see the dual rates coming in handy with a newer plane where your not sure how it would feel though.

[solentlife]

Originally Posted by flydiver

The Mfg'r suggests what seems to work well for 'most people'. That covers a LOT of ground.
Ultimately it's up to you. You'll be messing with the settings for years until you sort out your own preferences.

Oh, what to do, what to do?
Go with the suggested settings.
Play around from there. As you gain experience your preferences for the same plane will change, so you adjust accordingly.

Exactly ... I agree.

As you fly more and gain that 'feel' for what is right ... you will instinctively know when setting up a model what is ball-park settings for movement, D/R and expo. Tuning them as you fly it ...

For more years than I care to remember I only used Dual rates ... expo wasn't on sets before, in fact for years even D/R wasn't available. But the use of both can and does increase the enjoyment of various models. In the case of a slow trainer style ... its debateable whether either are really needed. I subscribe to the person should learn 'finesse' of control as well as to just fly. But once you move away from the trainers and slow machines - this becomes more difficult to maintain.

The extremes like my Parkjet ... the D/R are set at 100 / 38 ... the Expo at 60 / 70 ... yes - extreme settings and for very good reason. At cruise speed of about 80kph .. it is manageable and can have reasonable movements at centre stick and full ... but as she gest faster - those movements beconme wing busting stresses that the model would basically tear itself apart at over 200kph. So it has to be tamed down not only in overall movement ... ( my elevons are at +/-3mm at that speed ... +/-8mm at low speed ) ... but also around the centre to avoid serious consequences. Even with the settings as these ... I can flip that PKJ around / over like a scalded cat .. it's unbelievable.

But such a model is not for the faint hearted and is extreme. But it illustrates the point ... as performance increases D/R and expo have a serious place and can benefit the smoothness and enjoyment of flight. Some like Hayofstacks choose not to use ... fine, each to own ... but 'd love to see his attempts to control my Parkjet !! That I would HAVE to video !!

Go fly and enjoy ... experiment with it ... you are the judge of what suits you ..

Nigel

[solentlife]

I'm going to throw in another factor - which many people overlook.

Many people fly Mode 2 ... Elevator / Aileron on right stick. These are what are termed Primary controls.

No-one is perfect in moving a stick and often a slight touch of other control is introduced when moving the stick ...

Example : You want to do a loop. you pull back on the stick and up she goes, but as she goes up she starts to screw out left or right. Initially you think ... damn my rudders not trimmed properly .. It's more likely that you had a touch of aileron creep in. Why if model tracks straight when level flight, should rudder suddenly change to out of trim for your loop ?

Now adjust expo to soften the centre of aileron ........ try that loop again .. better ?

This interaction of primary controls I learnt as a Mode 2 flyer competing against Mode 1 flyers who are generally much cleaner flyers when it comes to precision .. a fact shown to me by one of the greatest aerobatic model flyers ... Hanno Prettner. I was never ever good enough to even approach his level and only competed in regional stuff in UK .. but his words I never forgot.

Nigel

[AEAJR]

If you had 10 pilots with the same radio and the same plane you would likely find 10 different settings for D/R and/or Expo.

This is one of those "tune to taste" tools.

[Yakfishingfool]

Was just looking for this thread! Got a new PZ UM corsair and this is my first aileron flyer....need to make adjustments. Anybody do aileron and rudder mixing? Scott

[flydiver]

Originally Posted by Yakfishingfool

Anybody do aileron and rudder mixing? Scott

That only gets asked occasionally....
Rudder/Aileron Mixes?

There is no right answer....only opinions.