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Old 01-15-2013, 03:07 AM   #76
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Originally Posted by ONETENOR View Post
I asked a few days ago about converting Txs/Rxs from whatever freq. they are now 35 27 40 .6 etc to 2,4 Ghz. Only suggestion i got was but new kit. Yes that is the obvious solution but expensive. I am om pension so want to avoid undue costs hence my question. Do you have any ideas ed/ Cheers john M. ( onetenor)
There are 2.4 radios and receivers from the big online stores for less than $50.00 that work quite well. I have 3 "Radiolink" 2.4 Tx's that cost that amount, and work better than my $300.00 Hitec or JR 36mhz set ups' ever did.
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Old 01-15-2013, 05:29 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by ONETENOR View Post
I asked a few days ago about converting Txs/Rxs from whatever freq. they are now 35 27 40 .6 etc to 2,4 Ghz. Only suggestion i got was but new kit. Yes that is the obvious solution but expensive. I am om pension so want to avoid undue costs hence my question. Do you have any ideas ed/ Cheers john M. ( onetenor)
If the radio is module based, conversion to 2.4 is very easy. If it is not module based it is still possible but may take more work.

Upgrading your 72 MHz radio to 2.4 GHz –
If you don't fly sailplanes, just ignore that part of the discussion
This applies to most 72 Mhz, 75 MHz, 35 MHz, 40 MHz and others

RC Soaring Digest
Two part series – July and August 2012

Upgrading 72 MH Radios to 2.4 GHz
http://www.rcsoaringdigest.com/pdfs/RCSD-2012/RCSD-2012-07.pdf

Low Cost Radio based on open software
http://www.rcsoaringdigest.com/pdfs/RCSD-2012/RCSD-2012-08.pdf

Receivers, on the other hand can not be converted. But new receivers can be as little as $10 each or as much as $200. Depends on which 2.4 system you go to and what your receiver requirements may be.

There is no reason to change your whole fleet over all at once. I have my main planes switched from 72 MHz to 2.4 Ghz, but a lot of my less frequently used planes are still on 72 MHz and I would have no hesitation flying them on 72 MHz until such time as I decide to move them over to 2.4.

Even if you have to solder in one of the DIY kits to convert your radio, I have seen them implemented with a switch so you can go back and forth between your old frequency and 2.4 GHz.

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Old 01-15-2013, 08:47 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by ONETENOR View Post
I asked a few days ago about converting Txs/Rxs from whatever freq. they are now 35 27 40 .6 etc to 2,4 Ghz.
Only suggestion i got was but new kit. Yes that is the obvious solution but expensive.
I am om pension so want to avoid undue costs hence my question.
Do you have any ideas ed/ Cheers john M.
( onetenor)
Hi John, your country of domicile is not shown under your profile.
These forums have multi national posters & readers so the answers can and do vary accordingly,
especially in regard to providing links regarding mail order and even top brand name items common
in one country are often unknown in another country.

Much easier to convert your Tx if a modular unit, most being made to either JR or Futaba/Hitec
measurements and operation will simply plug in.
Receivers are not economic to convert.

Besides the sub sections:
"Transmitter - Convert old Hitec, Futaba, JR, Sanwa, Airtronics to 2.4GHz"
"Transmitter - FAQ - Additions, Adjustments, Mode Change, Clonepacs & Repairs."
with more below
"Radio Systems, Accessories, Alterations and FAQ" at
Alan's Hobby, Model & RC FAQ Web Links

Whilst headed for the Hitec Spectra, the same idea suits dual operation with other brands
- keep old PPM & new 2.4GHz flying same Tx:
. Spectra 2.4GHz Antenna Mast DIY easy install / remove remote mounts for single or multiple antenna on Aurora and other TX.
DIY with photo instructions x 3 examples post#2.

Alan T.
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:11 PM   #79
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I am with the rest, with the cost of todays radios and receivers I don't see why you would want to try converting all the old stuff.

Seems much easier and cheaper just to replace the gear, not to mention all the time savings of trying to convert everything.

Unless you are just into that kind of stuff and like a challenge!

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Old 01-15-2013, 01:50 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by firemanbill View Post
I am with the rest, with the cost of todays radios and receivers I don't see why you would want to try converting all the old stuff.

Seems much easier and cheaper just to replace the gear, not to mention all the time savings of trying to convert everything.

Unless you are just into that kind of stuff and like a challenge!
A lot depends on what you have. Converting a module based unit takes a few seconds. Swapping receivers is the same no matter what you use.

But I would agree that it makes sense to evaluate a new radio system as part of the analysis. The new radios have a lot of capability for very reasonable prices. And they are downright cheap compared to radios of years ago for the functionality you get.

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Old 01-15-2013, 05:51 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by AEAJR View Post
A lot depends on what you have. Converting a module based unit takes a few seconds. Swapping receivers is the same no matter what you use.

But I would agree that it makes sense to evaluate a new radio system as part of the analysis. The new radios have a lot of capability for very reasonable prices. And they are downright cheap compared to radios of years ago for the functionality you get.
And, these new receivers are far more reliable than the stuff used 20 years or so ago. A lot of this improvement can be directly traced to the surface mounting technology used in the 2.4 Ghz RC radios along with the Cellphones, Ipads, Ipods, USB memory sticks and on and on.

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Old 01-15-2013, 08:00 PM   #82
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You can replace the RF section in an older receiver and retain the encodeing hardware/electronics to modulate a new 2.4GHz RF. There are several different brands of RF modules that you can purchase to do this. Just do a little surfing on the web for the different sources along with their specifications. I will cost you in the neighborhood of 20 to 30 $ for the module. Of course you must then get a compatible receiver for that brand of module. Other brands are available but I know the FrSky equipment works well.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:33 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Rodneh View Post
You can replace the RF section in an older receiver and retain the encodeing hardware/electronics to modulate a new 2.4GHz RF. .

Just to clarify

Did you mean transmitter??

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Old 01-16-2013, 05:30 AM   #84
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Friends,

I would really prefer we don't turn this into an engineering debate. The topic is What You Need to Know About Receivers. That doesn't include how to reengineer them.

OK?

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Old 01-16-2013, 11:06 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by AEAJR View Post
Friends,

I would really prefer we don't turn this into an engineering debate. The topic is What You Need to Know About Receivers. That doesn't include how to reengineer them.

OK?
Maybe you could re=label the title 'What you need to know about recievers except anything too technical" The original poster was only trying to figure out some way of converting his existing gear inexpensively, and so people responded accordingly. if the subject matter went off on a bit of a tangent, it still retained relevance to the enquiry. I, for one, found the tech advice valuable and interesting My personal input was to circumvent the issue and simply go with the very inexpensive and affordable new 2.4 gear being offered. If others wanted to offer advice about conversion, everyone benefits. No knowledge is wasted
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Old 08-16-2013, 07:10 PM   #86
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COMPATIBLE RECEIVERS

In the days of 72 MHz we had lots of compatible receivers available and they worked well. It was not unusual to fly a Futaba, JR, Airtronics, Hitec radio and mix Hitec, Berg, GWS or some other brands of compatible receivers. They worked well.

2.4 GHz shows up and you have to buy the same brand receiver as radio or nothing works. But that is changing. Compatible receivers are popping up all over the place. The early ones were iffy, but today many are receiving very good reports.

FrSky - excellent reputation - has receivers for Futaba FASST and Hitec A-FHSS

HobbyKing/Orange has DSM2, DSMX and FASST compatibles

Lemon has Spektrum compatibles

I think Corona has compatibles. for Futaba and maybe Spektrum too.

Now Hitec releases the Aurora 9X and we are going the other way. the Aurora 9X includes A-FHSS, their own protocol, and SLT which is used by Hobbico's Tactic Radios, so Aurora 9X owners can fly the Hobbico Tactic receivers and the TX-R planes.

I have 2 Futaba 9C Super radios that I like. I have 72 MHz (ch 35 and 40) as well as Futaba FASST and Spektrum DSM2 modules for them. I have planes with 72 MHz, Spektrum 2.4 receivers and Futaba 2.4 receivers.

I have now purchased an Orange FASST receiver - have not tried it yet but reports have been good.

And I am about to buy some FrSky FASST receivers - getting great reports

So, what are your thoughts on compatible 2.4 receivers? Ready to make the leap? Perhaps you have some experience to share?

Inquiring minds want to know.

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Old 08-16-2013, 09:37 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by AEAJR View Post
COMPATIBLE RECEIVERS

HobbyKing/Orange has DSM2, DSMX and FASST compatibles

Lemon has Spektrum compatibles

So, what are your thoughts on compatible 2.4 receivers? Ready to make the leap? Perhaps you have some experience to share?

Inquiring minds want to know.
In life I find you get what you pay for.

I have been very happy with my authentic Hitec, Futaba and Spektrum RX's. I have had all three systems but primarily use Spektrum. After MANY glowing reports on the Orange Spekky compatibles I decided to get a few.

Bought 4 610's from Hobby King. 1 was OBF (that is about typical of my HK experience). That didn't instill a great deal of confidence.

The others all bound and tested fine. I put each of the in test planes and had good results.

I found this one:
http://www.valuehobby.com/radio-syst...-receiver.html

It is from ValueHobby. I am not a big fan of HK so I thought a US vendor and cheap, fast shipping. I got one. It tested ok (range check to about 25 paces) and I have used that in a small foamy with good results. I would not trust it in much else.

Then I started reading and looking at reviews for the Orange 610 and decided that I needed satellite RX's. Then after seeing other reviews it appeared that the satellite on 610's DID NOTHING I did my own tinkering and indeed found when the main RX was completely cut off from the sat you had no signal. This really IRKED me.

So then I read the Orange 710 with sat's performed on par with Spektrum so I got two. One has been performing flawlessly. The other flew away with my MUCH loved AJ Slick (51"). Never found the plane so have no idea what went wrong. But I no longer use any Orange RX's.

I know many have had just the opposite result. About that time the AR400 came around and I decided there was just no more reason for cheap. I have a dozen AR400's and they have all been flawless.

Enter Lemon RX. I am a glutton for punishment. Rather I like to play around a bit.

Ordered two. One failed to bind. TaDa! I am impressed. They replaced it no questions asked.

The Lemon's are of MUCH higher quality than the Orange. The boards are quite impressive as is the soldering. My only compliant in fact is the fragile antenna attachment and the fact they should at least have a shrink case.

I had excellent test results from these two. Bought 5 more. I mean they are like $6 each. Order got lost. Vendor was NOT as responsive this time even though the order was clearly lost. I asked for a refund. Got nothing (this is after 40 days). Did a PayPal dispute and the vendor shipped 5 more too me. 6 days later BOTH orders arrived (46 days for one 6 for the other).

OK so now I have 10 Lemon's. Only one OBF this time and 9 others work fine. Most have not been tested in the air.

Anyone want to buy a Lemon or two?

At any rate - you get what you pay for. I plan to stick with Authentic.

Mike


I have never used off brand Futaba or Hitec so can't comment on those.
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Old 08-16-2013, 10:50 PM   #88
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Great report Mike. Clearly you have done some investigation. Man, you have a LOT of receivers!

My plan is to stay with the brand name stuff for my high end planes but try out the Orange and the FrSky I some of my lesser aircraft. I will report back when I have time to do the testing. The Orange has been sitting on the bench for almost a year so you can see this is not a priority.

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Old 08-16-2013, 11:18 PM   #89
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You should see how many airplanes I have. YIKES!
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Old 08-17-2013, 12:43 AM   #90
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I have converted all my transmitters(5) to Frsky.3 are Futaba,and 2 Turnigy with er9x firmware.The Frsky receivers are rock solid.
On some early 4channel ones,the aerial was prone to detach itself.This was easily remedied with a dot of potting compound,or even hot glue.Frsky now covers the aerial fixing with some sort of compound from the factory.
Frsky actually listen to what modelers are asking for.
Locally,a 5channel Futaba rx costs $140NZ.Frsky is $25.
Although I don't really need another transmitter,I will definitely look at getting Frsky's Taranis when it becomes more generally available.At the moment they are selling all they can build.The RX with this set is capable of 16 channels,yet is still less than $40.
To my way of thinking,Futaba,JR,et al have simply priced themselves out of the market.Especially since their rx's are made in China or Korea as well!
Incidentally,Frsky now also sell a multi-brand capable rx .
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Old 08-17-2013, 03:14 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by rcers View Post
In life I find you get what you pay for.

I have been very happy with my authentic Hitec, Futaba and Spektrum RX's. I have had all three systems but primarily use Spektrum. After MANY glowing reports on the Orange Spekky compatibles I decided to get a few.

Bought 4 610's from Hobby King. 1 was OBF (that is about typical of my HK experience). That didn't instill a great deal of confidence.

The others all bound and tested fine. I put each of the in test planes and had good results.

I found this one:
http://www.valuehobby.com/radio-syst...-receiver.html

It is from ValueHobby. I am not a big fan of HK so I thought a US vendor and cheap, fast shipping. I got one. It tested ok (range check to about 25 paces) and I have used that in a small foamy with good results. I would not trust it in much else.

Then I started reading and looking at reviews for the Orange 610 and decided that I needed satellite RX's. Then after seeing other reviews it appeared that the satellite on 610's DID NOTHING I did my own tinkering and indeed found when the main RX was completely cut off from the sat you had no signal. This really IRKED me.

So then I read the Orange 710 with sat's performed on par with Spektrum so I got two. One has been performing flawlessly. The other flew away with my MUCH loved AJ Slick (51"). Never found the plane so have no idea what went wrong. But I no longer use any Orange RX's.

I know many have had just the opposite result. About that time the AR400 came around and I decided there was just no more reason for cheap. I have a dozen AR400's and they have all been flawless.

Enter Lemon RX. I am a glutton for punishment. Rather I like to play around a bit.

Ordered two. One failed to bind. TaDa! I am impressed. They replaced it no questions asked.

The Lemon's are of MUCH higher quality than the Orange. The boards are quite impressive as is the soldering. My only compliant in fact is the fragile antenna attachment and the fact they should at least have a shrink case.

I had excellent test results from these two. Bought 5 more. I mean they are like $6 each. Order got lost. Vendor was NOT as responsive this time even though the order was clearly lost. I asked for a refund. Got nothing (this is after 40 days). Did a PayPal dispute and the vendor shipped 5 more too me. 6 days later BOTH orders arrived (46 days for one 6 for the other).

OK so now I have 10 Lemon's. Only one OBF this time and 9 others work fine. Most have not been tested in the air.

Anyone want to buy a Lemon or two?

At any rate - you get what you pay for. I plan to stick with Authentic.

Mike


I have never used off brand Futaba or Hitec so can't comment on those.

Yeah
And now Spektrum has a six channel park flyer receiver for $19.99!
http://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/D...dID=SPMAR6115E

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Old 08-17-2013, 09:03 AM   #92
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Unfortunately,despite Spektrum's assurances,some local flyers are still suffering Spektrum's infamous brown-outs.This is with the latest and greatest spekky set up.Not a good look,or investment,IMHO.
Sure,the odd occasion it might be due to something the pilot has or hasn't done,but the frequency of these type of failures points to a serious problem,something that should have been sorted by now.
As for brand names,who remembers Futaba's dire 115H "double deck"receivers,that frequently fractured the pins between the 2 boards?Mostly due to vibration.It could be argued that radio gear should be insulated from vibration,but in a glow powered model,that's going to be next to impossible.I complained to the local distributor,but was virtually accused of trying to show them a crashed rx,which it wasn't.I then wrote to Futaba Japan,but never received even the courtesy of a reply.
I hasten to add that Futaba tx's have seldom given me any problems.I did have a dislodged wire on a stick pot,but this was a 20year old tx.
I have never been a fan of JR,due to something odd about their transmission method.It was explained to me in great detail many years ago,but I was never convinced enough to buy one.
In any case,price wise they are even worse than Futaba!
But to get back to the point of this thread,I have no qualms about putting a Frsky 8ch. rx in my best model.Experience has proved them to be top notch
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Old 08-17-2013, 11:56 AM   #93
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Not here to defend any brands, but a brown out, by definition, is caused by installation error. The installer has not provided a power system that can handle the load. If your friends are suffering brown outs, it is their own fault ... by definition. Receivers can't cause brown outs, they suffer brown outs.

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Old 08-17-2013, 05:40 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by AEAJR View Post
Not here to defend any brands, but a brown out, by definition, is caused by installation error. The installer has not provided a power system that can handle the load. If your friends are suffering brown outs, it is their own fault ... by definition. Receivers can't cause brown outs, they suffer brown outs.
A big +1. That is correct. If you don't power your TV with enough power it won't run either.

But saying this:
Unfortunately,despite Spektrum's assurances,some local flyers are still suffering Spektrum's infamous brown-outs.This is with the latest and greatest spekky set up.Not a good look,or investment,IMHO.
I am a bit baffled. Spektrum has lowered the voltage threshold a bit and more importantly they stuff reconnects many ordinals faster than before.

So that does not add up to me. What I think still regularly happens is people like to "blame" dumb thumbs on "brownout". It is a fact of the RC trade - folks look outwardly for mistakes they actually make.

Even if you don't buy my take - consider what people use. Go to any large event here in the US it is dominated by Spektrum and JR. If Spektrum were not reliable, you simply would not see that, period.

Just my $0.02

Mike
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Old 08-18-2013, 12:29 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by AEAJR View Post
Not here to defend any brands, but a brown out, by definition, is caused by installation error. The installer has not provided a power system that can handle the load. If your friends are suffering brown outs, it is their own fault ... by definition. Receivers can't cause brown outs, they suffer brown outs.
Well Said.

Funny, in my RC club, those members that have gone to the LiFe or A123 receiver batteries stopped having brownouts on their 2.4 Ghz radios.

Can't be a coincidence.

As I've pointed out before, even the "Smaller" Hitec 645MG servos can and will pull two amps each, just running them back and forth. That's been measured on my $$$$ Fluke 87V multimeter.

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Old 08-18-2013, 01:11 AM   #96
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Mike,

If you still have extra Lemons a few months from now, I'll buy a few. Going after the DX9 and will need to a whole new supply of rx's. Not uded to using sattleites as Futaba doesn't need them. +1 on Value Hobby. Good service from them. That's where I've been getting my Frsky fasst rx's. The only thing about frysky fasst rx's is that they don't like Dynam retracts. I also use orange and corona without incident. Also had a DOA 30 amp esc that they replaced immediately with a 40 amp upgrade. Nice guys.
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Old 08-18-2013, 01:18 AM   #97
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What I think still regularly happens is people like to "blame" dumb thumbs on "brownout".
.
This is of course very true.Very few people will admit it's actually their own fault.
But it's strange that the people with those type of problems are all using Spektrum gear.In any case,the local distributor has placed Spektrum as a sort of "premium brand",which means pricing above other mainstream brands,IMO completely unwarranted.
Let's leave it at "you pays yer money,you takes yer choice".
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Old 08-18-2013, 01:38 AM   #98
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To me a brownout is loss of signal between the tx and rx. Another condition that is common or at least has happened to me is overload. Just using an esc with the standard linear bec is not always enough. When you have busy servos combined with servoless electric retracts there can be the perfect storm when it just can't handle the voltage being thrown at it and decides to shutdown. Had an incident where on climbout, and at the exact split second I flipped the retract switch, nothing. Nada. straight in from 30 feet. Been buying cheap insurance with UBEC's
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Old 08-18-2013, 02:58 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by dahawk View Post
To me a brownout is loss of signal between the tx and rx. Another condition that is common or at least has happened to me is overload. Just using an esc with the standard linear bec is not always enough. When you have busy servos combined with servoless electric retracts there can be the perfect storm when it just can't handle the voltage being thrown at it and decides to shutdown. Had an incident where on climbout, and at the exact split second I flipped the retract switch, nothing. Nada. straight in from 30 feet. Been buying cheap insurance with UBEC's
Yeah
I've seen several models in my club go in because of this problem. IMHO, any model with more than two LiPo cells in their ESC, and using a linear type BEC in a model with perhaps 4 servos is risking his equipment.

And, as the moderators have pointed out, this is installation error, not receiver design. I've checked the re-connect time on my bunch of Spektrum receivers on my oscilloscope. That reconnect time checked out at about 1/2 second after a receiver voltage sag below the required minimum voltage of 3.2 Volts DC.

Take a look at this thread from two years ago.
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63779

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Old 08-18-2013, 03:32 AM   #100
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Originally Posted by dahawk View Post
To me a brownout is loss of signal between the tx and rx. Another condition that is common or at least has happened to me is overload. Just using an esc with the standard linear bec is not always enough. When you have busy servos combined with servoless electric retracts there can be the perfect storm when it just can't handle the voltage being thrown at it and decides to shutdown. Had an incident where on climbout, and at the exact split second I flipped the retract switch, nothing. Nada. straight in from 30 feet. Been buying cheap insurance with UBEC's
Yup
I've been using the Castle Creations 10 Amp uBEC switching type regulator in all of my models, including giant scale units with seven Hitec 645MG servos. Those giant scale models also have a two cell A123 battery for a backup. And, after several hundred flights, my on board battery monitor has indicated that the backup battery has never had to take over for the CC uBEC.

Now, for the larger models, Castle Creations has their Talon 90 Amp ESC with a built in 9 Amp uBEC. I've got one, and it is NICE!!!

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