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Micro Sized Electric Helicopters Discuss micro and mini sized electric rc helis in here

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Old 12-28-2005, 11:36 PM   #1
John A
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Wink Venom Night Ranger 3D

Hi, Iím new to choppers. I have been flying planes for over 20 years Nitro and electric. Well my wife got me a Night Ranger 3D for X-mas. I was hopping for a Blade CP but she said the hobby store was out and the owner recommended this one. It was about the same price so she bought it. It sure is a nice looking bird. It was packaged nicely and I think the box could be used as a carrying case. The frame of the NR3D is aluminum along with the landing skids, tail boom and part of the rotor head. There are also tail boom supports, which is not present on some of the micros. I did find some slight problems, when I mounted the battery pack I noticed that the bottom of the main rotor shaft was sticking below the frame and was rubbing on the battery. I could see no way to adjust for this so I added some sticky back rubber sheet, that I have to the frame and it moved the battery away from the shaft end. The next thing to do was to charge the battery and to my surprise there were no directions on how it operates. It has 2 LEDs a green and a red one. They are both on when you plug it into the wall, when you connect the battery the red one goes out. After the 2-hour charge time I was expecting to see the red one come back on but it never did so I have no idea what they are for. While waiting on the battery I noticed that the fly bar paddles were not the same so I adjusted the so they were parallel to each other and the same length. Now that the battery was charged I set the blade tracking this was not that difficult but it took a little bit because the directions are not as clear as they could be. I did notice that the rotor head was pulling it to the left so I started to adjust the trim and had it maxed out and it was still pulling left. I noticed that one of the pitch servo push rods was a lot longer than the other. I pulled the ball link and adjusted it to match the other. After that I was able to adjust the trim to get stop pulling left. It seemed awful sensitive to rotor head pitch inputs so I decided to add some fly bar weights this seemed to tame it down. The next thing I noticed was one of the servos that control left and right pitch, the bottom of its case isnít fully closed. I tried to snap it together but I think the servo will have to be removed to do this. It seems to be cosmetic because the servo functions fine. The next step in the directions was to set the gyro. The gyro is in the receiver like most others. I didnít know if it made any difference or not but it was not in a straight line with the tail boom so I repositioned it so it was. Man for a bird that is supposed to be ready to fly out of the box there sure was a lot of tweaking to do. I think Venom RC has a very nice bird here but they need to look at their quality control and correct some of these things. Well as I have said Iím new to this so Iím going to try the RADD approach to learning this. Since I only have the one battery pack this will probably take a while. Iíll try to add to this as I learn how to fly it and what ever other pros or cons I encounter.
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Old 12-29-2005, 12:47 AM   #2
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John A,

I got one for Christmas also (I picked it out). Mine flew well and tracked out of the box. I have now flown (hovered) it five times or so in the backyard.

I have a Blade CP (which I have flown quite a bit) and the VNR3D much more of a "hotrod" (at least in the hover). The Blade is pretty mellow (even with the AEK) by comparison (the Blade is Hiller with collective, the VNR3d has Bell/Hiller and collective). At the moment, I have nowhere to fly it around as the Rosebowl is occupied with parade and football game set up.
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Old 01-03-2006, 10:31 PM   #3
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OK,

I finally got the VNR3D into fast forward flight today.

It is much more responsive than the Blade CP and does not have the tendency to pitch up in forward flight that the Honeybee CP2 does.

The VNR3D seems to be neutrally stable in forward flight (goes where you point it, stays where you put it in terms of flight attitude) and has, thus far been extremely impressive.

Tail authority is very good, but I may adjust things to speed it up a little. I did have to adjust the gyro down when I added the Lipo (not a big deal). The tail stays right where you point it in the air.

The stock radio was dead solid, although I did not take the machine that far away (probably a couple hundred feet or so).

I have not tried any aerobatics yet.
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Old 01-04-2006, 09:18 PM   #4
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Man, I just ordered one of these VNR3D's yesterday. I should have it by Friday I hope! I learned to hop (hover kind of ) on a Raptor 30 Gas about 3 years ago but my trainer moved so I haven't flown until about a month ago I bought the VNR2 and have pretty well mastered tail in hover with it quite painfully but wanted to upgrade to the VNR3 before I get to far. What kind of upgrades are you flying yours with other than the lipos?
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Old 01-05-2006, 03:56 PM   #5
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Zap,

So far, just the Lipo and the heat sinks. I have the brushless motor, but have not installed it yet.

I also added a little weight to the nose (two quarters double stickied to as far forward as possible).

I think I would continue to learn on the NR2 for a bit, as the NR3 is really, really quick. It truly surprised me.
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Old 01-05-2006, 04:04 PM   #6
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I put a sticky on this thread so you VNR3D guys have an official thread
Happy hovering,
Jay

There are two dogs inside of me. One is good, one is evil.
These two dogs are always fighting a constant battle.
Which dog wins? The one I feed the most...
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Old 01-05-2006, 08:12 PM   #7
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Jay,

Thank you very much!!!
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Old 01-06-2006, 01:04 AM   #8
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Yes, Jay, thanks so much. I feel like I belong now I'm just hoping that means Im that much closer to being a heli pilot! I was telling a friend (who happens to have bought a VNR3 last week about this thread and he said to ask you if it is fairbanks or squarebanks not sure what that means...He was stationed up there in the Army back in the 80's.
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Old 01-06-2006, 08:44 AM   #9
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Smile Squarebanks it is

Your friend is right, anyone who has lived here in the winter calls it squarebanks, or snowbanks. It is very cold and there is very little to do in the winter. I build (and repair)rc's all winter. Keeps me sane. I have the new Blade cx now and I can fly right in my kitchen, it is great. Your friend must have been stationed on fort Wainwright. I live five minutes from the helicopter flight line there. I get to see the gunships hovering right over my house.
Clem-
Please let us know how the brushless system works in the VNR3D. I see they list all the parts for them now on the Venom web site. The parts are very reasonably priced as well. It is looking like a better deal all the time!
Happy hovering guys
Jay

There are two dogs inside of me. One is good, one is evil.
These two dogs are always fighting a constant battle.
Which dog wins? The one I feed the most...
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Old 01-06-2006, 07:08 PM   #10
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Im sick! The VNR3D came. I checked everything out. one of the wires was setting against the main Gear so I adjusted that. Had to tighten up the rotor blades just a bit. I taped them with the included tracking tape, they tracked perfectly out of the box. So far so good. I have a 1 foot square chalked out on my basement floor I have good open space probably about 25x40 with a 9ft ceiling I havent finished the walkout basement yet... anyway I was having some probs with the tail wanting to move left on me at low idle so before adjusting I wanted to spool her up a bit to get the tail kicked in good. I adjusted the trim a bit and tried again only this time I compensated by moving the left control stick a bit right, well The TX stuck over to the right and then clicked audibly I guess when it freed up I gave it too much throttle and If I remember hit her to about half way maybe a touch further and whoom she took off up and banking left so fast I had to check my pants afterward. I coudn't get back control and she hit an unfinished wall (2X6) and tore up the blades. I felt like I was gonna throw up as my buddy told me to wait until he got here so we could have extra eyes and thoughts. How much damage could I do in a 1 foot square? I talked myself into it. Fortunately, It didnt break much, the ball link on one of blade grips snapped and the other push rod came off not broke and of course the blades are gone but Venom was nice and packed me a spare set. I have glued the ball back on with CA then I touched that up with some JB weld and am letting it dry. I think I'll let it set overnight so I can wait for my buddy tomorrow for some moral support. Hopefully, this all makes sense. My friend has a VNR3D too so I could use his TX. My TX Im wondering if I should try and open her up and try and see what is making it stick it continues to make the click when it is throttle down and to the right as you throttle up it isnt a prob anymore. Any ideas on any of this madness LOL
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Old 01-06-2006, 07:45 PM   #11
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Exclamation

Zap,
I would call Venom and tell them about the TX stick and what happened. Then tell them it's on it's way back to them. Return it and get new unit. That was a factory defect and they are obligated to replace the whole set up. Let them know that you like the heli, but your not going to run that TX and the heli is damaged as a direct result of the faulty TX. I am sorry your first experience was such a bummer. I bet you they will shoot you a new heli right off and you can return that one. It must of had shipping damage. does the gimbal do that every time you move it or erratically? I am sure Venom will make it right. I wish you the best of luck. and I hope your friend has a better experience. I'm sure it is just a factory fluke. These things happen. Venom is a good comapany and will set it straight I'm pretty sure
Regards,
Jay

There are two dogs inside of me. One is good, one is evil.
These two dogs are always fighting a constant battle.
Which dog wins? The one I feed the most...
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Old 01-06-2006, 08:42 PM   #12
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I did speak with Venom about my NR2 and They are really nice over there. It shipped without any screws in the tail motor which caused the motor to fly out on my first hover causing a crash.They replaced all broken parts and shipped it back to me at no charge so I was satisfied with the service. I almost feel guilty about contacting them again but this is just my luck LOL Yes the TX clicks every time I move it to low throttle and to the right something in there is catching pretty good. Im pretty sure they are manufactured with a spring then those are removed for helis if my memory serves me right. perhaps something got bent or broke doing that...I hate to send it back I wanna "fly" LOL. My cheapo FMS sim and TX came in so I can practice on the PC
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Old 01-06-2006, 08:59 PM   #13
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Zap,
No need to feel guilty. It is defective and they need to replace it. I am sure they will tell you the same. I know it is a bummer to have to wait on a replacement, but it happens sometimes. I think Venom is working the bugs out as they are fairly new to helicopters and they will probably be more than happy to ship you a new one right away. If you need some helicopter files for FMS let me know, I have a ton of them I can email you a bunch.
Take care,
Jay

There are two dogs inside of me. One is good, one is evil.
These two dogs are always fighting a constant battle.
Which dog wins? The one I feed the most...
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Old 01-06-2006, 10:08 PM   #14
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Zap,

I agree with Jay, contact Venom before you do anything else. I don't think that they would want you to be learning on a defective bird.

As far as gluing a ball for a ball link back on, I don't think this is a terribly good idea. The part should be replaced. There is a tremendous amount of stress on these things, especially on the head and blade arms.

This is a very hot helicopter. You want it in perfect condition-every time you fly!
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Old 01-07-2006, 01:24 AM   #15
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Clem,

I know your right but I am so confident about my fix that I'd bet just about anything that the heli wont break where I repaired it and the way I put it back together it is on perfectly straight. I used to work in the Army in the dental field and I learned alot about retention and ways of creating it when none is there. I have made dentures before. Teeth fillings etc. I am so anxious i am gonna try it out once before I ship it back. Wish me luck! I am going to use my buds TX tomorrow.

Jim A
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Old 01-07-2006, 05:16 AM   #16
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Good luck Jim!

Let us know how it turns out!
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Old 01-07-2006, 07:50 PM   #17
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Well Im through 2 battery packs and just really having a fit getting her trimmed out. I have 2 more charging now cross your fingers! My friend crashed his I'll give details later but that freed up a tail motor for my VNR2 but the pinion gear is larger. I want to switch them but wasn't sure how. Any advice on changing them? Do they just pull off? I pulled a bit but didnt want to try too hard until Im sure. Thanks in advance.

Jim
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Old 01-08-2006, 02:38 AM   #18
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The pinion on the tail motor is larger than the hole in the mount on the tail boom, so you will probably have to use a puller. You many even need to heat the gear slightly. I think I would leave it in your friends VNR3D and get another one for the NRII.

When my tail motor eventually expires and I have to remove it, I will probably enlarge the hole so that I do not have to pull the gear while it is on the helicopter. I will also be able to use the arbor press that I have for installing model train wheels to press the new gear on the new motor while it is off the helicopter.

The replacement tail motor comes with the gear unattached.

A new gear will have to be pressed on. A used gear (one that has been pulled as yours will be) will probably still have to be pressed on, but with some locktite to hold it.

It would be spectacularly unpleasant to have it come off in flight!

By the way, I have one of the newer tail motors in my Sabre, which is very similar to your NRII, and it is lasting far longer than the original type motors.

You said that you were trimming the VNR3D, how does it feel to you compared to the NRII? My VNR3D is so quick compared to the Sabre that it is amazing. The tail on the VNR3D is much steadier though.
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Old 01-08-2006, 04:49 AM   #19
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Thanks for the info. I need more tools. My wife is gonna kill me LOL I flew 6 battery packs through her and OH MY you are right. That beast is quick alright. It took me 4 batteries just to tame it down to a 1 foot square on the ground. So much different than fixed pitch. I don't think you can know until you experience it. I just made a few hops in the air but the neg pitch as I throttled down sucked her right back to the floor almost like a vacuum. I am gonna like her but Id say that this one isnt a training heli. It might tame her down with some training gear but I like to get control of the heli without any first so I can get a feel. My tail motor for the VNR2 should be here early next week. I am boxing the VNR3D back up and gonna send it back to Venom so I can make sure she is right, and get a TX that works. the repair I made was at the back of my mind and you were right you need to make sure everything is original so you can get that confidence you need to fly. My friend has been holding his in a 1 foot square in his kitchen but doesnt have a good indoor spot to fly it. He brought his over and decided to "show off" first. Well he held her nice and tight but then when the positive pitched kicked in the heli took a jump and he wasnt ready and brought her down into the work table. He broke the blade holder, the tail busted off, bent the flybar to **** and one of the boom supports busted. Definitely repairable. Not bad for how it came down. Thats 2 crashes between us and the helis held up pretty good both times. Lots of CA on the canopies LOL look like war Helis. We both are thinking we need to get back to our fixed pitch machines for some more lessons. He has a helimax rotofly and I have seen him hover that without touching right stick at all in about a 3 foot circle. Very smooth hovering but I think he will have trouble when he is ready for forward flight. I'll be glad to get mine back airborne in a controlled fashion as well. Did I mention I appreciate you guys helping me out (even if I don't always listen)
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Old 01-09-2006, 05:33 AM   #20
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Zap,

Thank you for the thank you. If I am able to do anything to help you, just pass it on to the next guy.

Sounds like you and your friend are making good progress. FYI, what you are now flying is quicker than a Honeybee CP2 and much, much quicker than the Blade CP-this would explain why you are getting such a workout.

I took mine to the local park today and flew around. I brought the RPM up a little with the PZT knob and turned the gyro all the way down. This thing flies REAL GOOD, but you have to stay on top of it (I guess that is what it is all about anyway).

I still have not had the nerve to flip the 3D switch and try a roll yet. Still just zipping it around and piroutting all over the place.

Keep us posted!
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Old 01-09-2006, 07:38 AM   #21
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The good news was Saturday while I was busy with the NR3D... The tail motor for the NR2 was in the mailbox! Luckily the pinion was on there and it slipped right into the housing. The great thing was I picked right back up and was hovering it beautifully. I had to go get my wife to watch cause someone had to see this very nice and stable hover. I call it "walking the dog" I fly it out forward then bring it backward to me tail in whole time. Luckily I hovered it great for several minutes and then it is like I have tail problems I seem to experience this alot even whith th NR3d. Its like all of a sudden the gyro changes something changes and I cant control the tail. the NR2 suddenly decides to do a 180 ,yeah great, Nose in turn all by herself luckily I have been practicing on the sim and quickly got the tail back. But Im really thinking I can fly when I have the bird set up right. My problem is Im not real mechanical so this is a big learning curve. I can fly great on FMS. I learn mechanics easier when someone shows it to me rather than just reading. If Im not flying well Im thinking of what I need to adjust and really it has been just trial and error for me. Move the trim left move it right center it back up hopefully I have the paddles right etc etc and Im always fooling with the stuff and right now I have the NR2 out of whack and cant get a good hover it frustrates me sometimes. this is what happened when the last tail motor went out it got squirrely sometimes then just died. Any ideas? I did read that these 4 channel micros will do that as battery gets low but this started with plenty of juice left.
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Old 01-09-2006, 03:02 PM   #22
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Zap,
That is kind of the nature of the beast with the FP micros. They kind of get their own ideas on where to go, just when you think it is adjusted just right. I have a century hummingbird v3. I have been flying heli's for a while and I can't hover this little machine. I punch the throttle, jump it up off the ground and start flying it around. It flies around ok, but won't hold a hover even a few feet off the ground out of the rotor wash. I am glad to see your NR3D model on it's way back for replacement. You deserve a fresh start after all of that! Did you get the FMS heli's working?
Clem,
Glad to hear that your heli is doing good, flying curcuits and all. It sounds like an impressive micro for sure. Have you dropped the Brushless system into it yet? I think your ready to try the idle up (3D switch) You will like it
Keep us posted guys. The VNR3D is looking better all the time!
Take care and happy hovering,
Jay

There are two dogs inside of me. One is good, one is evil.
These two dogs are always fighting a constant battle.
Which dog wins? The one I feed the most...
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Old 01-09-2006, 03:17 PM   #23
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Good Morning Gentlemen,

Zap,

Sounds like you are very persistant. This will serve you well for RC Helicopters. Are you still running the Nimh pack on the NRII? The voltage will change pretty dramatically on those, causing a trim shift on the rudder from left to right over the course of a battery pack. I am using a 2-Cell Lipo on the Sabre and it has helped dramatically.

Jay,

I am going to continue to fly it stock for a little while, as it has more power than it really needs. I also want to examine the collective pitch behaviour with the motor unplugged to make sure that I understand how the PLT/PZT knobs affect things in 3D mode. On the Honeybee CP2 and the Blade, the throttle does not go below 50% and the pitch range is mirrored from what it is in the normal mode from half stick up to half stick down. I just need to make sure that I have a handle on what is going on first. I also may want to roll the Honeybee a couple more times before I try it with my nice new bird. My guess is that the VNR3D will roll better, even than the Honeybee, but I will not know that for sure until I actually do it.

I am really enjoying this forum!
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Old 01-09-2006, 03:47 PM   #24
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Sounds great Clem,
Try it on your older heli first I only use idle up mode. Once you get used to it you won't go back. I am glad to hear about the performance of the NR3D right from the box. My Father-in-law lives less than three blocks from Venom in Hayden ID. I am tempted to have him go see what kind of deal he can get right at Venom. He was up here for X-mas and He said I have seen them guys flying the little heicopters down the road. He said they have a heck of a race track as well. And they race on saturdays.
Happy hovering,
Jay

There are two dogs inside of me. One is good, one is evil.
These two dogs are always fighting a constant battle.
Which dog wins? The one I feed the most...
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Old 01-10-2006, 05:29 AM   #25
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Yes Im still flying the Nimh stock battery. I have been spending my money on parts since at this time I am mentally drained after a normal pack Maybe now I can upgrade since I figured out the prob with the NR2 tonight. The main wire broke out of the 4 in 1! it was jostling around back there and thats why the tail sometimes was getting away from me getting and losing power all the while I was trimming away back and forth! The battery connector wire is short and tight. I have had to pull pretty good to get them apart. I thought I was being careful, but not careful enough I guess, does anyone put in a switch like on my Raptor? I have a friend who went to school for electronics so he says the wire for the 4 in 1 will be easy to fix, I hope to learn some good soldering skills. Its always exciting isn't it? Maybe an addicition! Someone should've warned me LOL
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