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Old 02-06-2009, 06:26 PM   #26
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Default Beginning SUPERSIZED Aeronca Chief scale upsize of Comet 54"

Originally Posted by pd1 View Post
You have to do a few build threads on the planes you build from those plans.

Good luck and I found the Chief files too.
Paul

Yep, a "scale" model of the nostalgic vintage comet 54" rubber model...except its "supersized!"

Used my method of printing and adjusting scale (posted in full in another thread on WF) and am very happily building a supersized Aeronca Chief...Love it!

Maybe I can take a few pics this eve...or weekend . I have already framed the wing halves and both fuse halves. Have to visit LHS for some more 3/16" lumber. Utilizing a modified (but scale sized spar for more strength and less weight) , foam board parts on fuse and inlaid 1/16" birch dowels around perimeter of wing with 1/8 " birch dowel LE and foam board ribs.



The FB saves a bit of weight and adds a bit of strength with lack of grain weaknesses.



Note: edited 06/06/2013 I just signed on to correct this error..

In using the clay-laminated foamboard from Lobby Lobby (shown here) there was a serious problem.
when the wings were originally covered, the rib/trailing edge joints crumbled and let the TE warp downward....a LOT....making the wings unusable.

I was so disgusted with this I put the plane in the attic for 4 years not wanting to have to rebuild the wings. Upon deciding to 'do it' I retrieved the plane/parts and made a rib pattern. and cut a stack of new ribs from balsa, numbering them.. each foam rib was cut out and a new balsa on replaced. After finished, I covered the wings again and all was fine.....use balsa... its a much better /more reliable rib material with actually no gain in weight over the foam ones.

Added were 1/64" thick small triangles (or other custom shapes) at all joints of the 3/16 inch balsa strips etc adding MUCH strength and cures the Cyano brittleness syndrome.



Target is an all-up weigth of 3# or less (yep 72") and will probably use a High torque motor swinging a very large prop directly...like a 13" or 14". Wings struts will be functional , wings removeable and interior access through open scale doors. Scale sized aelerons (outlines provided on original drawing) will be employed.

Will be using the color scheme of the 11AC version googlable for lots of pics.I do realize the comet version is not exactly scale....and I may add a bit of deviation to achieve a better scale of a Chief...we'll see how that goes.

Anybody got reccommendations for a good motor , prop , esc and batt combo I can order from HobbyKing , please discuss....Any questions, I'll answer as I can. This is going to be one great project... Rumplestadt (built 2 different ways) or 54" comet (built 3 different ways) next build project.

Also have a fully framed Mach None I have brought to the point of covering I will resume later. difference is built up wing, hollowed balsa half canopy, GWS retracts, Norvel 061*, flaps , rudder , ailerons, and elev with throttle. Will be a killer pattern plane....miniaturized!

Also finishing a much modified old rubber scale/upsized Champ with Surpass26 fourstroke, oversize flaps, oversize ailerons,,



* Yeah, a Nitro, goes back to my having an original 2 ch one in '74' with a Ace foam wings, a Cox TD 049 special glowhead and custom modified 4.5 inch grey cox prop
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Old 02-08-2009, 01:14 PM   #27
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Default

It's looking good.
I built the Comet Taylorcraft and had a few problems when I joined the fuselage sides.
The Taylorcraft and the Chief are very similar in construction.

The top longeron kept separating from the door frame when I brought the fuselages sides together at the nose.
If I had it to do over again. I would have made the top longeron go from front to rear in one piece. Then If I really had to have doors that opened, I'd cut the longeron after the nose was brought together and additional structure was added.

Paul

ps. I like your use of foamboard.
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Old 02-08-2009, 08:30 PM   #28
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Default

I have a 108" precedent aeronca champion which I built many moons ago.

before I built it, a review in one of the model mags warned that the ailerons were ineffective and that the down going aileron caused so much drag resulting in the the model turning in that direction.

I went ahead anyway - built in what I thought was a large amount of differential ( plenty of up and little down ) and was shocked to find that adverse drag substantial. I had to land quickly - swopped rudder and aileron controls and flew rudder only. I have been told that coupled rudder/ailerons was better.

I dont know whether you will run into this problem with your models but as a precuation, with the dihedral shown on one of the photos , I would suggest building in differential aileron action.

John
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Old 02-10-2009, 06:33 PM   #29
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Default

I'm author of http://academodel.ru/plans
Server is keeping shutting down sometimes. Please do not worry, I'm working on that. No need to dump entire site because I'm going to keep this site forever and I have backup copy of all files. Contributions for plans not listed there welcomed as long as complaints about broken files (there are some there)

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Old 02-12-2009, 01:48 AM   #30
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Default My Hat is off to you!

Originally Posted by salat View Post
I'm author of http://academodel.ru/plans
Server is keeping shutting down sometimes. Please do not worry, I'm working on that. No need to dump entire site because I'm going to keep this site forever and I have backup copy of all files. Contributions for plans not listed there welcomed as long as complaints about broken files (there are some there)

You have done a wonderful job of inventorying those plans!! and there are hundereds of some of the best old time rubber plans I have seen. I finally found an easy way to tile print a PDF ( I posted the details in another thread.) And have already nearly built my 72" Aeronca Chief. I just had to "wing it" from memory the first 72" Chief I built and even though it wasn't an exact copy of the Comet 54', it flew fantastic.

This one will be several times better as it is way lighter and stronger.
I'm attaching a current pic or two


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Old 02-12-2009, 01:57 AM   #31
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Default Aeleron Differential

Originally Posted by john38 View Post
I have a 108" precedent aeronca champion which I built many moons ago.

before I built it, a review in one of the model mags warned that the ailerons were ineffective and that the down going aileron caused so much drag resulting in the the model turning in that direction.

I went ahead anyway - built in what I thought was a large amount of differential ( plenty of up and little down ) and was shocked to find that adverse drag substantial. I had to land quickly - swopped rudder and aileron controls and flew rudder only. I have been told that coupled rudder/ailerons was better.

I dont know whether you will run into this problem with your models but as a precuation, with the dihedral shown on one of the photos , I would suggest building in differential aileron action.

John
Yep, The Chief I built tongue in cheek also many moons ago had the same problem. I found that if I used nearly zero down aileron and a LOT of up, it worked to some degree....BUT.... I had to always fly it like a full size one in that I always lead the turn with rudder first and ended the turn with rudder last. Made for some really scale looking turns .I could "fudge" and cross ail/rudder and get a turn around a nearly completely stationary inboard wingtip. THAT was a wierd looking turn.
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Old 02-12-2009, 02:04 AM   #32
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Default NEW? building method?

Originally Posted by pd1 View Post
It's looking good.
I built the Comet Taylorcraft and had a few problems when I joined the fuselage sides.
The Taylorcraft and the Chief are very similar in construction.

The top longeron kept separating from the door frame when I brought the fuselages sides together at the nose.
If I had it to do over again. I would have made the top longeron go from front to rear in one piece. Then If I really had to have doors that opened, I'd cut the longeron after the nose was brought together and additional structure was added.

Paul

ps. I like your use of foamboard.
Thanks Paul, I found some distinct advantages to its use.. I found a {new?} way to inlay a dowel in the perimeter of the flying surfaces and it makes for a very light , good looking and strong surface. Its very easy to do and quick.


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Old 03-15-2009, 05:22 AM   #33
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Default

Looks like you'll be flying it soon. My old Comet 54" Chief had a long life of about 8 years and used a number of brushed and brushless motors and geardrives the last being an Esskay 400XT, 9x5 GWS DD prop, and 1300mah 3S lipo. The wing panels had lengthened spars with hooks that plugged into the fuselage and rubberbands held the wings. Wing struts were hardwood with clevises on the ends the clipped onto modfied Nylong control horns mounted to the wings and fuselage. It's long flying carreer ended when on of the clevise attached to the fuselage detached. If you use this attachment, use tubing over the clevises to prevent possible opening. I did not use ailerons but used a fair amount of dihedral. If you use ailerons, you will need to use rudder with ailerons to counter adverse yaw and make graceful turns. I use aileron/rudder mix or use rudder plus aileron manually on all my high wing monoplanes. When I built the Comet T-Craft I'll use install ailerons. They make inverted flight, rolls and other manuevers possible. I imagine that your 72" version won't need much power , perhaps a Scorpion 3008-32 outrunner with an 11x7 GWS DD prop and one 2200mah 3S pack would allow cruising at 1/2 throttle with an occasional loop for about 15 minutes. Your model will probably grab thermals and fly for many minutes with throttle cut .


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Old 03-22-2009, 02:57 AM   #34
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Default Well eventually....

Originally Posted by E-Challenged View Post
Looks like you'll be flying it soon..




Your model will probably grab thermals and fly for many minutes with throttle cut .

I didn't get the info I really needed from coverite... so I may just solarfilm this 72" Chief. I think I would be best running a geared brush 550 or 600 with the great planes gearbox I already have and run a 3 cell A123 battery system. Use a 14 inch prop and should get a nice scale looking flight out of it.Should sound about scale as well (propwash)

Will probably set up a FPV and camcorder on board with tilt and pan and rig me up a separate gimble to the side of the transmitter for its control.

That huge set of windows just beckons for such a setup.

www.CrazyPlanesRC.com Designer/developer CrazyBall Design
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Old 05-25-2009, 02:31 AM   #35
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Default Uh Oh...Gee Golly Whiz!

Well, I made it through a Refi After 2 years finally got a 5% interest instead of the ARM 13 % I was paying...


Then I got laid off....Yuk! while working for a company with a field crew of 300+ that bragged about never having a layoff.....but yep....

Now back to the shelf and let's get ready to cover that Chief.......LOL


Take a look at what happens if you don't either fully paint or cover and finish this new building method I brought out..

This did not happen on surfaces without dowel edging and only to a mild degree if they had been finished in some way (ie painted or covered etc)

Suspect. The dowel is a hardwood (Birch) and has a different shrink coefficient than the balsa hinge strip and different than the foam itself.

If encased in a few layers of acrylic, the warp is only slight and in small surfaces like the Skampy, was non existent....but crank up the size and this happens. I gave up and tried to cover with an iron-on but surface is simply ruined.

Will have to tear them off and build new ones, covering immediately or just build an open surface (it would be lighter still).....but other than for the huge "honeydew" list my wife handed me when I suddenly had more time, I should be able to get this bird (and several others I started) soon to a completion stage.


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Old 05-25-2009, 12:48 PM   #36
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Default

That is something I didn't expect.
Would steam or just heat take the twist out? Or is the twist too much?
Paul
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Old 05-25-2009, 03:35 PM   #37
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Default Steam....Hmmm

Originally Posted by pd1 View Post
That is something I didn't expect.
Would steam or just heat take the twist out? Or is the twist too much?
Paul

Hi Paul...
I never thought of steam....it just might have worked....but the heat gun was a bit too hard to get "just right" and would bubble the foam and destroy the finish when I tried it...

I tried a monokote iron and it helped a bit . Even tried to just cover it with the HK yellow film...but it was just too warped to recoupe. The original surfaces only took about 30 minutes to cut and edge and about 30 to finish and they were perfectly flat....so I just surgically removed the surfaces (took maybe 15 minutes) and laid er' down again to get back on the honeydew list...grrrr.

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Old 05-31-2009, 09:04 PM   #38
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Default This, I believe is better...and lighter still!

Anyone can do this, all you need is the foamcore board (or depron) and a balsa stripper that uses an xacto blade to strip off whatever thickness you need. Begin with a piece of say, 1/16 or 3/32 sheet and set the stripper to the thickness of the foam and strip off a few strips (whatever you need for the wing, stab, elev rudder etc.) after cutting surface outline ,then take a sanding block with 150 and square the edges.Use Gorrilla glue (new clear stuff) and only use a very small amount on edge. The thinner the original balsa stock, the easier the unwet balsa will bend to the outside of your surface piece.As you start from one end , use Blue painters tape (2") to anchor the end to starting point. as you bend strip to meet edge it will be glued with the glue you put on earlier. as you continue bending strip, keep putting strips (youve previously torn off and tack-struck to your bench edge--makes it handy) of tape on strip to make it lay down on edge of surface. You will eventually get all the way around surface and the strip will be perfectly tacked down until glue dries.

then peel off tape and sand away excess glue. and round edge with sanding block (here a 200-320 grit is good) and then sand whole surface to smooth).

This is a whale of a lot easier to do than to describe.

You can wet/soak-with windshield washer fluid, the balsa strip if you have a really tight radius to turn....but dry is faster for gentle radius'.

This beats the birch dowel, is more readily available, easier and lighter....but just not as tough (impact resistance) but will probably prevent what happened in above pics.


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Old 07-11-2009, 02:14 PM   #39
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Default

Originally Posted by salat View Post
I'm author of http://academodel.ru/plans
Server is keeping shutting down sometimes. Please do not worry, I'm working on that. No need to dump entire site because I'm going to keep this site forever and I have backup copy of all files. Contributions for plans not listed there welcomed as long as complaints about broken files (there are some there)
I guess it's shut down now because I can't seem to get in. I'll subscribe to this thread and keep checking back. Would love to see the plans.

Dave
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Old 07-11-2009, 07:35 PM   #40
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It wil be up by Monday-Tuesday.
Thanks

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Old 07-11-2009, 11:10 PM   #41
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Default free plans site

Originally Posted by av8djc View Post
I guess it's shut down now because I can't seem to get in. I'll subscribe to this thread and keep checking back. Would love to see the plans.

I was told a while ago that this site is down quite often...but keep trying as it is just dopwn because it hits a certain traffic level, and being a free hosted site, is limited. I found it down first couple of times myself...then I caught it up and got the plans I wanted...good luck....it is well worth the inconvenience

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Old 07-12-2009, 04:14 AM   #42
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Default

Originally Posted by gittarpikk View Post
I was told a while ago that this site is down quite often...but keep trying as it is just dopwn because it hits a certain traffic level, and being a free hosted site, is limited. I found it down first couple of times myself...then I caught it up and got the plans I wanted...good luck....it is well worth the inconvenience
It hangs during faulty hardware. I'm working on it. Sorry.

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Old 08-04-2009, 02:24 AM   #43
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good plans
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Old 11-02-2010, 05:13 AM   #44
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I just ran across this thread. Is this site http://academodel.ru/plans
still intermittent or down for good? Salat are you still there? I will keep trying. Thanks,

James
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Old 12-23-2010, 02:17 PM   #45
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Here's another site for plans;

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1265873
There are all types of plans here.

Paul
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Old 01-21-2012, 12:59 AM   #46
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Default Hi Salat

Originally Posted by salat View Post
I'm author of http://academodel.ru/plans
Server is keeping shutting down sometimes. Please do not worry, I'm working on that. No need to dump entire site because I'm going to keep this site forever and I have backup copy of all files. Contributions for plans not listed there welcomed as long as complaints about broken files (there are some there)

I noticed the site s down again

Is it still working (sometimes) as it did before?

If not do you still have the files...I could post them stateside on my server..

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Old 05-19-2013, 05:17 AM   #47
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Default Well after getting disgusted... I finished it 4 years later!!

The foamboard (HobbyLobby craft store) I cut the rings out of was useless. In covering the wings 4 years ago..the TE crumpled...and warped down..So I knew the solution was rebuild the entire wings. Having had to rebuild the tail surfaces was not bad... but now the wings...so I shoved it into the attic where it sat for 4 years.

I stripped the wings, and used balsa for the ribs...then covered them. Repaired the broke off half of fin and started finishing it up....Lots of undocumented finish work...but when done with 2 " wheels, pants, FPV cam on a servo pan with dvr cam...windshield custom struts...it came to 2.75# AUW with a 2200 MAH 3 s lipo.

Using 5.8 and a clover for FPV, I then maidened it....then installed an HK 3 axis gyro...but forgot to balance the prop...so vids are jello like.
As anticipated,it was extremely light...and floated like you wouldn't believe.

Flies so scale it is eerie.

All FPV is flown under the glass from inside the cabin


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www.CrazyPlanesRC.com Designer/developer CrazyBall Design
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Old 05-19-2013, 05:22 AM   #48
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Default One of the videos


sorry about jello....was 95 % certain I balanced the prop, knowing that it was to carry 2 cams...FPV and dvr on a servo pan.... but the 5% 'bit' me.....so found that out today when I flew it totally FPV from the cabin with my Fat Shark Dominators

Future videos should be really nice..

Check out my channel for a TON of other stuff I've been up to..

http://www.youtube.com/user/gittarpikk

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Old 05-19-2013, 12:56 PM   #49
pd1
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The Chief looks great, but I couldn't get the link to work.

Got it work, had to remove the colon at the end of the address.

http://www.youtube.com/user/gittarpikk


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Old 05-19-2013, 02:42 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by pd1 View Post
The Chief looks great, but I couldn't get the link to work.

Got it work, had to remove the colon at the end of the address.

http://www.youtube.com/user/gittarpikk


Paul
Thanks Paul... I fixed it...

After finally completing this plane, I now want to build several more in the 72-96" range using the very light stringer/bulkhead method. The older vintage planes designs lend themselves to that as this was the way they were built FS. The difference in the way they fly(scale speed, scale manuevers) is instantly apparent. Several club members have accused me of building 'helium bags' into it as it seems to smoothly slip from one end of the 800' runway to the other , motor off, and lose only a few feet of altitude...something even gliders have a tough time doing.

Now I'm 'eyeing' the vintage KA-8 for several reasons..

Its vintage and is readily apparent.
Easy stringer construction
perfect for glider tow by a 6' cub
can be built quite light
Has a huge easily made canopy for FPV , and dvr with wide angle
lens as the pilots 'head' on servo with pan
stripping my own lumber ...makes it cheap
the FS was modded for a motor on a pod above wing...which keeps it
scale if there is no glider tow available.

Other thoughts include a 60"+ size version of the Rumplestadt bipe I posted in this forum,
a blown up version...or more scale version of the PT-19 or the old Cox PT-
19 CL trainer,
a 72 version of the Astro Hog... and maybe a 72" AT Texan since it has
such a nice ,huge 'greenhouse' for FPV cams

all stringer 'superlight' construction. using 3 mil low melt laminate (I bought a 12" x 250' roll of this for $18 and will do maybe 30 planes) and acrylic sprayed paint , would make for a scale appearance...or HK shrink for brighter colors.

I have a 10' vesion of the Woody's Pusher about 75% finished done with 90% Dollar Tree foam board, laminate and stringer construction... Also a super light plane... it needs finsihing.... maybe soon

www.CrazyPlanesRC.com Designer/developer CrazyBall Design
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