XXL Polaris scratch build

[Larry3215]

Originally Posted by Fviking

My Polaris is done, and the wind is kicking up whitecaps on the lake !
I waterproofed my ESC with conformal epoxy 3M makes it it is called DP 270
you mix it up and after removing the shrink wrap pour it all over in into the ESC, not on the heat sink though. Then take a heat gun and heat it up the epoxy thins out and most runs off but enough to waterproof it remains. Hang it over a paper plate untill it stops dripping.
You can find 3M DP 270 and Corrosion X Here http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/products.php?cat=79
I also do Fast Electric Boats that is where I learned that trick. I have a 36" fiberglass boat I made that does 50 mph. Video here

Scratch built 36"fast electric boat Viking 42mph

Enjoy;
John

I havent tried the conformal coating on anything yet. The CorrosionX has been working for me without issue.

That conformal coating is the same type of thing Castle Creations will do for you if you ask when you order from them. I forget but I think they only charge about $5 or so to do an esc or Rx.

Originally Posted by Alpea42

FVik I saw yours at the thread at R/C G nice job. We've up motored ours to a Turnigy 450 1050 Kv with a 7x5 prop on 4 cells and it seems to have greater than 1 to 1 thrust now. So I'm hopin it gets air born quicker and the motor wont be hot. Have ordered this motor for the 2nd one Says it's equall to a Axi 2808.

Alpea42 - your doing things a bit different from the masses. Most are running motors closer to 1800-2000 kV on 3S.

Nice job to both of you on your Polari

[CHELLIE]

Originally Posted by Fviking

My Polaris is done, and the wind is kicking up whitecaps on the lake !
I waterproofed my ESC with conformal epoxy 3M makes it it is called DP 270
you mix it up and after removing the shrink wrap pour it all over in into the ESC, not on the heat sink though. Then take a heat gun and heat it up the epoxy thins out and most runs off but enough to waterproof it remains. Hang it over a paper plate untill it stops dripping.
You can find 3M DP 270 and Corrosion X Here http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/products.php?cat=79
I also do Fast Electric Boats that is where I learned that trick. I have a 36" fiberglass boat I made that does 50 mph. Video here

Scratch built 36"fast electric boat Viking 42mph

Enjoy;
John

Nice Boat John it seems to bounce to much on the water, would plastic flexable trim tabs here, to help keep the nose down Take care and have fun, Chellie

[Fviking]

Hi;
The wind layed down about 6:30, I ran down to the lake with my Polaris. I am having a little trouble with the throttle and rudder on the same stick, trying to do some of that fancy taxiing. I am new to flying.
A gentle breeze came up and I ran straight into it, just touched the elevator and she came up so nice, about then a gust of wind hit so I hit the down elevator and my plane disappeared beneath the surface of the lake like an Olympic swimmer. It rose slowly to the surface, I waited a minute then tried the motor and it spun to life and I drove it back to me, and took it to the shop to dry out. All seems well. Well all of the blue tape came off and so did all of my tape hinges. We have been using this clear Hockey stick tape to tape down hatches on FE boats and it is super sticky but comes off clean, haven't had a hatch leak even when it was upside down while I paddled out to get it.
I put a coat of WBPU on the hinge areas maybe that will help.
Later;
John

[Alpea42]

Ha ha ha a Polaris as a submarine. Hmmmm that's mixed up. Yeah Larry we're still tryin to use a motor we already have on James's. The new Chinese motor tho is 1700Kv. The recomended Grayson is about $40 and the new Turnigy is only $18. If it comes close to an Axi 2808 it should do O K. I know you don't care for the Chinese stuff guess we'll see.

[Larry3215]

Originally Posted by Fviking

Hi;
The wind layed down about 6:30, I ran down to the lake with my Polaris. I am having a little trouble with the throttle and rudder on the same stick, trying to do some of that fancy taxiing. I am new to flying.
A gentle breeze came up and I ran straight into it, just touched the elevator and she came up so nice, about then a gust of wind hit so I hit the down elevator and my plane disappeared beneath the surface of the lake like an Olympic swimmer. It rose slowly to the surface, I waited a minute then tried the motor and it spun to life and I drove it back to me, and took it to the shop to dry out. All seems well. Well all of the blue tape came off and so did all of my tape hinges. We have been using this clear Hockey stick tape to tape down hatches on FE boats and it is super sticky but comes off clean, haven't had a hatch leak even when it was upside down while I paddled out to get it.
I put a coat of WBPU on the hinge areas maybe that will help.
Later;
John

Oh man! I wish I had been there to see that! You didnt happen to get any video did you?

You do know that new flyers are required (by LAW! Really!) to video all their goofs and post them for us to see We promise not to laugh - too hard

Sounds like you got lucky actually. As a boat racer, Im sure you know how much damage a water crash can cause.

I usually use Blenderm medical tape for foamy hinges and its held up well on the dozen or so water foamies Ive done so far. Your splash-in was probably a little too violent. If you were holding down elevator the force of hitting the water may have just ripped them loose.

I have to tell you though that the Polaris may not be the best choice for a new pilot.

It does not have the kind of self righting stability that a good trainer has. Its point and shoot. It goes exactly where you point it and wont save you from mistakes. You need to fly it all the time. Its also very responsive and quick to react to controll inputs.

I would rate it an intermediate to advanced flyer because of those things and its speed.

On the other hand, I cant think of any trainers that could have saved you from diving into the water like that and most of them would NOT have survived it either

[Larry3215]

Just to show you we ALL screw up - here are some shots of what happened to me this last weekend at a float fly. There were probably 30 pilots there watching me plus a large crowd of spectators on the beach.

The spectators got a big kick out of it too. My wife caught these shots

[Larry3215]

Originally Posted by Alpea42

Ha ha ha a Polaris as a submarine. Hmmmm that's mixed up. Yeah Larry we're still tryin to use a motor we already have on James's. The new Chinese motor tho is 1750Kv. The recomended Grayson is about $40 and the new Turnigy is only $18. If it comes close to an Axi 2808 it should do O K. I know you don't care for the Chinese stuff guess we'll see.

Its not so much the stuff (although you're right about that) as the people who are selling it. Its the way they do business and that the money is going directly over seas.

I realize Ive lost that battle though so dont let me bother you

Be honest though - you know it wont be close to the Axi

[Fviking]

Hi Chellie;
Lovely to hear from you.
The goal for that boat was 50mph, it has trim tabs set just right, and on that run the strut was very close to perfect. I can get it to settle down, but at the cost of speed, the more boat in the water the more drag the slower it goes. Basically all I want in the water is the prop and the rudder and perhaps a tiny bit of the hull by the transom to keep it straight.
I made 49.4mph on another run, fall was upon us and testing stopped.
John

[Fviking]

Hey Larry;
I haven't mastered the stick radio yet and you expect me to run the video camera too ???
If you look at my videos on Utube in one I am driving my RC boat riding in my son's boat, and recording with the video camera at the same time, Not Bad !?! But that was a wheel radio.
I have been flying for a few months and graduated to aileron planes some time ago. The trouble is all the available fields are covered with kids playing some type of ball gave untill almost dark every night except Sunday night. But I live on a lake looks like a big flat open space with trees on 2 sides Perfect for flying,or fast electric boats. The Polaris looked to me like the answer to my prayers, part boat, part plane a no brainer.
Tube Channel "Fviking1" there will be plane videos soon.
John

[CHELLIE]

Originally Posted by Fviking

Hi Chellie;
Lovely to hear from you.
The goal for that boat was 50mph, it has trim tabs set just right, and on that run the strut was very close to perfect. I can get it to settle down, but at the cost of speed, the more boat in the water the more drag the slower it goes. Basically all I want in the water is the prop and the rudder and perhaps a tiny bit of the hull by the transom to keep it straight.
I made 49.4mph on another run, fall was upon us and testing stopped.
John

Ok, I was just wondering I had a real 18 FT Southwind cabin cruiser, and it had a small out board engine on it, and the bow was always running high in the water, and it was slow, i made some trim taps for it out of aluminum, and that really helped it, in the ocean, it was fast, even the daycruisers, with there v 8 motors, could not keep up with me Ok I had a V Hull, that helps in the ocean vs a flat bottom i had a lot of fun with that boat, went deep sea fishing in it, and the dang sharks are as long as the boat was, one time my friend was sitting on the bow of the boat, with his feet over the edge, he caught a big fish, and the fish pulled him into the water that was funny, he did not drink so much beer after that, he caught the fish too Take care, Chellie

[CHELLIE]

Hi Larry, I hate that when that happens, in front of a lot of people I had my Giant Bi Plane at The Western States Electric fun fly, and I pined my ailerons on the lower wing, so they will stay straight during storage, Yes, I for got to remove the pins try to fly the plane with the ailerons pined, 2 1/2 mins of shear terror, I made a soft crash landing, broke off the tip of a wing, thats about all the damage, except for a brused Ego Take care, Chellie

[Alpea42]

I was spotting for her and the part I'll always remember was the pilot next to us called out , "DO YOU NEED HELP!!!"

[Larry3215]

LOL

Reminds me of the first time a little girl at the grocery store asked me if I needed help getting my one bag of groceries out to my car!!!

It actually doesnt bother me much any more crowd or no crowd. That part of my ego took so many hits over the years it shriveled up and died

[Fviking]

Hi Chellie;
Absolutely correct trim tabs will to that.It would have been easier to adjust your outboard so the prop was closer to the transom, if you had any trim left. Usually just pull a rod out of the motor mounting bracket and move it to a lower hole ( one nearer to the transom ). So the prop kind of tucks under. I hate to see boats run like that, we call it Maximum wake and Maximum fuel consumption . The 18' flats skiff I had when I lived in Key West had power trim on the motor And power trim tabs sweet ! She would to 44mph, in anything over a foot of water on plane.
I am putting a new drive motor in "Viking 1", just playing, I think I will turn it into my daily runner, The fifth hull I pulled from that mold is much lighter I may rig that for speed. I did a wild paint job on it, I am just waiting for nice weather to clearcoat it. Rain rain go away, and stay away for a while !
John

[Fviking]

Hi Larry;
I did it again, turned my plane into a submarine, and got away with it. I managed some fast taxiing, that's fun. I think I'll hook up the rudder and throttle to a wheel radio and just have fun taxiing Yea Right.
**"I usually use Blenderm medical tape for foamy hinges and its held up well on the dozen or so water foamies Ive done so far. Your splash-in was probably a little too violent. If you were holding down elevator the force of hitting the water may have just ripped them loose."*** I put blenderm on my hinges and they seem to have survived the dunking today.
***"I have to tell you though that the Polaris may not be the best choice for a new pilot. "*** Now you tell me. I went to the lake and got the plane into the air, it did a steady 30' climb all the way across the lake, just before the tree line I got it into a high alfa stall and headed for the water from tree top height ( that's 90 to 100' here) CRASH. That was the strangest flight I have ever made !! That plane did things I have never seen before ! Broke the tail Pilon off at the wing, the epoxy is setting now.
This Spectrum DX6i when you put -Expo on the controlls, WOW what a ride I'll try +Expo tomorrot, maybe that will help
John

[Fviking]

I MEAN - NEGATIVE MEANS LESS RIGHT?
And + means more doesn't it. So - Expo is less control--right Wrong !!!!!!!!!!
No Video that would have been worth a good laugh.
John

[Alpea42]

My son says you use + expo on spectrum. You want the sensitivity to be less around the center of the stick, but to move more at the extremes.We use about 60-75% on models where we have a lot of travel. It makes for smoother control. Maybe you need to try flying subs. Our Polaris is flyin great now http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgKlzslCu0E And just to confess I screw the pooch occasionally watch this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEt1t...eature=channel

[Larry3215]

LOL Great story!

Im not sure how the Spectrum tx's work on that. With Futaba you dial in - expo to tame things down. Spectrum may be just the opposite. If you had it backwards then yeah, you would have had a wild ride for sure!

If your going to stick with that plane, let me make a few suggestions.

1)RTFM on the Spectrum manual and adjust the expo to tame down the controls around center stick - elevator and aileron for sure. Id recommend you start about 50%. You can probably leave rudder alone.
2)Adjust the surfaces so you have no more throw on elevator/aileron than Steve recommends - maybe even a bit less. Rudder again can be left as is or if anything get it to maximum. You need lots of rudder to turn on the ground/water.
3)Make sure the CG is exactly where Steve recommends. His CG is very safe and still allows the plane to fly well.

4)This is the most important one of all - don't fly at full throttle! If your weight is even half way close to recommended it will take off and fly easily at 1/2 throttle. It will probably stay in the air at even lower throttle settings. If you have to use more throttle to get it off the water, imediately back off to 1/2 stick and fly it as slowly as you can. It will still be moving right along but far slower than at full throttle.

The slower it flys, the longer you have to make corrections and keep it in the air. The faster you fly the faster you get into trouble

Use slow, easy, gentle, stick movements. If you yank the stick, the Polaris will do exactly what you tell it to do and it will be all over the place.

5)Take off and land directly into the wind. Preferably - do not fly in any wind at all.

6)Get a different plane to learn on

Sense you live on a lake and at the risk of bragging, Id recommend building one of my Capricorns.

They are hands down the best handling, easiest to fly hydro/water/all terrain plane around. They will fly at a walking speed and they have built in hands off stability. Properly set up, you can get up hi, cut the throttle and set your tx down on the ground and it will land itself. They are easier to build and repair than a Polaris too.

They dont LOOK nearly as cool as a Polaris and they dont fly nearly as fast, but they will do maneuvers a Polaris cant do. Once you get the hang of it, you can fly one indoors or out or in hi winds or in half a basket ball court. Once you get a little more used to it you can increase throws, move the cg back and it will do some amazing stuff.

[Larry3215]

Forgot the link.

http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26120

[Fviking]

Hey Alpea42;
Your son is correct on the Spectrum more is less
I had the expo turned up by 50% it was like trying to ride a bucking bronco.
I re read the manual, Thanks for the heads up.

Larry3215;
I destroyed a couple of high wing trainers and have built others, They are nice if the Tree Monsters don't get them and the slowstick is a Hoot. I was making foam floats for one of my high wings when I discovered the twinkle and then the Polaris. I'll drag someone off their front porch tomorrow if the wind is down to Video this next flight. It should be easy after today. Right
Steve recomends 40% expo and the throws are as he recomends, I have already learned that lesson, And the CG is right where he says too.
I get so excited on take off that I forget to throttle back, but I am working on it.
Thanks for the words of wisdom. I have foam! I think I'll look at your Capricorn
John

[Larry3215]

Good luck and may the wind gods and the submarine gods be with you!!

[Fviking]

Hi All;
I have out done myself. This trip to the lake was short and Not sweet.
I think I shot myself in the foot again. I wanted this to be nice and smooth, so I put a gyro on the ailerons, that thing was so sensitive that the pounding across the water screwed it alllll up and when I hit up it said " Inverted ? " and that was the end of that flight.
Good News;
My son got the whole thing on Video. I have uploaded it to the tube and you all can get a chuckle here;

Polaris Nonflight

Enjoy!
I shall try again, everything seems to be working OK believe it or not.
John

[Alpea42]

John, you are making this way harder than it should be. But it is entertaining . Looks like the gyro flipped it over. Mine takes off in 20 yards and with 1/2" up and down travel on the ailerons and about that on elevator. And about 1" each way on rudder and balanced at the step in the hull. It flys steady and predictable you don't wanna bank too steep when you turn and you have to pull a little up elevator in the turn and when you're done turning you have to give opposit stick to straighten back to level. But really these fly fairly easily. If I were you I would find an open grass area to practice over. The crashes into water are eventually gona ruin your radio gear.

[Larry3215]

Ouch! Thanks for the video though

Looking at the video, it looks like it was trying to roll to the right earlier in the run when you first gave it full throttle. Some gyros cant take much vibration.

I wonder if maybe you had it oriented the wrong way and it was reacting to pitch instead roll? Did you have the label pointed towards the nose? Might have just had the direction reversed too. Those are very easy mistakes to make.
So far it looks like your Polaris is taking the punishment very well

Did you treat your electronics with CorrosionX or are you trusting to the hull integrity?

[Fviking]

Hi Alpea42;
You got it ! When I watched it that is the same thing I saw. I am pretty sure it was the gyro mis behaving.
'
Hey Larry;
It was the gyro. I had the label so you could read it from the starboard wing. Worked beautiful in the shop. When you tilted the plane the aileron would go up on the wing I moved up. I guess those things are not for seaplanes.
I did the ESC with conformal epoxy and the receiver with Corrosion block I ordered some corrosion X last night from OSE.
John