Doculam/PET covering material

[spitfire]

pinch me, I must be dreaming...

a 500' roll for 18 bucks?! and you can paint it with acrylic house paint! you can go to home depot and buy just about whatever color you want!!

click here to go to the ordering place

here is a thread about Doculam

many people have used Doculam and love it... it (from what I have read) paints really nice, and the paint does not come off at all really...

they don't sell Doculam there anymore, but PET (from my research) is the same stuff, only lighter I think...

this is still amazing... I would not be surprised if I was reading something wrong, it just does not seem possible... but a couple people sent me to that link and have had success stories with it... so I guess it is!

anyways, SPIT.

[Nitro Blast]

SWEET BARGAIN!


So is the most common application for us covering balsa, or is this good for foam to?

[Rolling Thunder]

pinch me

slap me

hit me with a frying pan,just get me some

but never built anything I dont know what thickness to get

what thickness is monokote

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by Nitro Blast

SWEET BARGAIN!


So is the most common application for us covering balsa, or is this good for foam to?

it seems to work fine with foam!

here is a link to a thread on rcgroups... sorry, but not much info on wattflyer about it: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=982281

Originally Posted by Rolling Thunder

pinch me

slap me

hit me with a frying pan,just get me some

but never built anything I dont know what thickness to get

what thickness is monokote

not sure what the thickness of monokote is, but I would tend to stay around in the 1.5mil to 1.2mil range for most planes, likes parkflyers and such, I would really only buy anything bigger than that if I was covering something like a telemaster or such... most people seem to be happy with the 1.2-1.5, its what I am planning go with for my future builds...

SPIT.

[capn chaos]

Am I missing something or do I have to order two rolls minimum...I would gladly order 9" or 12" wide but 1000' is likely more than I can use...given my build speed (compared to continental drift).

CC

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by capn chaos

Am I missing something or do I have to order two rolls minimum...I would gladly order 9" or 12" wide but 1000' is likely more than I can use...given my build speed (compared to continental drift).

CC

I am pretty sure you have to order two rolls, but it only says that for the stuff on the lower part... but its probably just like that because... well, because! thats always a good reason!

I would play it safe and order two rolls, I mean, look at it this way, you will probably never have to order any covering again for a LOOONG time!

SPIT.

[capn chaos]

Monokote
clear backing removed...looks like 002 even to me or 2 mil.
So 1.5 mill 12" is likely what I will order.

CC

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by capn chaos

Monokote
clear backing removed...looks like 002 even to me or 2 mil.
So 1.5 mill 12" is likely what I will order.

CC

wow, I didn't expect you to mic it... I was wondering what it was too, thanks!

SPIT.

[Rolling Thunder]

great thanks capn.that looks like just the ticket

now what to build....hmmmm

[capn chaos]

Originally Posted by Rolling Thunder

great thanks capn.that looks like just the ticket

now what to build....hmmmm

Hey...its winter...build em all. I guess Ive got a thousand feet to blow off. Plenty of room for mistakes!! Now to study up on the finishing techniques.
CC

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by capn chaos

Hey...its winter...build em all. I guess Ive got a thousand feet to blow off. Plenty of room for mistakes!! Now to study up on the finishing techniques.
CC

glad to see you got some! would you mind posting some pics on this thread as well as what you think once you get it? I would be glad to add it to the first post to help others out...

Thanks! SPIT.

[capn chaos]

Spitfire,
I would be happy to post pics etc. Not sure how long shipping will take but hope to have "something" ready to use it on before Christmas. Ordered some plans today also and will try to build something along the lines of PD1's little yellow something (new thread Gnascher...PD1 pocket rocket) So much going on...
CC
PS I think it was your Spitire thread that got me started on my scratch ME 109F
Thanks.

CC

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by capn chaos

Spitfire,
I would be happy to post pics etc. Not sure how long shipping will take but hope to have "something" ready to use it on before Christmas. Ordered some plans today also and will try to build something along the lines of PD1's little yellow something (new thread Gnascher...PD1 pocket rocket) So much going on...
CC
PS I think it was your Spitire thread that got me started on my scratch ME 109F
Thanks.

CC

really? thats cool, glad I helped I guess

SPIT.

[Wildflyer]

I would like to know,

What are the heat shrink characteristics of PET?

High shrink or low shrink?

Will it stretch to go around wingtips?

If it shrinks tight, does it stay tight? ( org. monokote did not )

Is it tear resistant?

Will it stick to framing? Or do we have to use a preapplied glue like with mica film

Price does look very interesting, could buy a roll, and split it up with local club members.

Does any one remember a material that was called ---- Fascal ?
It was about 2’ wide, on a heavy paper backing, clear, silver, gold and maybe others, shrank hard and tight, best way was iron edges, then hold 18”-24” over a heating element on high of an electric stove.

Unbelievably strong, I landed? My controline fast combat straight down into a well used soccer field, at 140MPH, It sheered the nylon prop off flush with the washer behind the prop nut, blew the needle valve out of the spray bar, broke the bellcrank mount, and drove the alum. Bellcrank half way through a spruce spar.

The covering never broke in any place! Or did it allow the plane to distort and break. The plane just bounced about 2 feet off the ground, I did not expect anything larger than a toothpick would be left.

Fascal was used to print items like gross weight stickers, I would sure like to get some more of it

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by Wildflyer

I would like to know,

What are the heat shrink characteristics of PET?

High shrink or low shrink?

Will it stretch to go around wingtips?

If it shrinks tight, does it stay tight? ( org. monokote did not )

Is it tear resistant?

Will it stick to framing? Or do we have to use a preapplied glue like with mica film

Price does look very interesting, could buy a roll, and split it up with local club members.

Does any one remember a material that was called ---- Fascal ?
It was about 2’ wide, on a heavy paper backing, clear, silver, gold and maybe others, shrank hard and tight, best way was iron edges, then hold 18”-24” over a heating element on high of an electric stove.

Unbelievably strong, I landed? My controline fast combat straight down into a well used soccer field, at 140MPH, It sheered the nylon prop off flush with the washer behind the prop nut, blew the needle valve out of the spray bar, broke the bellcrank mount, and drove the alum. Bellcrank half way through a spruce spar.

The covering never broke in any place! Or did it allow the plane to distort and break. The plane just bounced about 2 feet off the ground, I did not expect anything larger than a toothpick would be left.

Fascal was used to print items like gross weight stickers, I would sure like to get some more of it

from the research I have done, it seems that it does not shrink as much as others, but it stays tight, so theres a good trade off there... and yes, its just plain iron on, no prepping! just grab an iron and start shrinking!

SPIT.

[Nitro Blast]

<--- Subscribed!

[capn chaos]

Well,
Here's the tally, Not sure what to do with all this stuff so if someone is just dying to try out one roll of each let me know. Was just going to order 12" wide but then 9" will do most of what I need to do. So ordered both.
If I live to be one hundred I will have to use 50 feet per year. PM me and I will ship will have to work out shipping costs but so far it costs 4.00 per roll.
2 x 9"
2x 12"
16.04 shipping

CC
item#item descriptionunit priceu/mqtycostadjust quantity hereFILM0011.5 mil PET 9" x 500' Film on 1" Core$9.65 ea.2 $19.30 change qty
then clickFILM0021.5 mil PET 12" x 500' Film on 1" Core$11.55 ea.2 $23.10 change qty

then clickContinue to ShopRefresh DisplayGo to CheckoutEmpty your CartOrder Subtotal:$42.40

• Shipping summary

• 
  Box 1: 19.00 lbs. Shipping: $16.04
  Click here to change shipping options.
• Texas deliveries subject to $4.82 sales tax.
• Shipping weight: 19.00
• Shipping cost is estimated.

[capn chaos]

the PET film arrived about 10 days ago and did manage to play with the stuff before work schedule, holiday schedule, etc slowed things to a crawl. I tried it on a horizontal stabilizer built for my Dyanflite Talon slope plane and it did behave well. Above post is confirmed that the shrink % is less than most other coverings so initial edge tension is crucial. It is opaque before heat is applied and then turns perfectly clear. Very light weight and tricky to handle because of that but first use was acceptible. I was in a hurry (see above schedule issues) and would like to use the covering when there are no time constraints hanging over me. Just thought I would check in with the input.
The film I bought was 1.5 mil compared to 2 mil for monokote. Seems punture resistant but once a tear is started it zippers to the edges without much effort. Seems ok when blunt force (trauma) is applied. just stay away from sharp objects. I will post some pictures when the dust settles around here. Also will read more on the finish I would like to paint parts and leave parts clear also. I understand masking is an issue so will work with striping tape in some transition areas.
Any suggestions on finishing is appreciated....
Just 49.6 feet to go to stay on schedule (see previous post)

CC

[Nitro Blast]

How hot did you need to get it to make it clear up?

Do you think it would be good over depron and other foams?

[capn chaos]

N Blast,
It seems to have a wider window of heat necessary to bond to balsa framing and to shrink. I had kept my iron at typical monokote setting which was fine for bonding to balsa and shrinking. I will try tomorrow to lower the setting and see what is minimal temp. Havent worked with depron so I dont know how temperature sensitive that material is. Will cover a few more pieces and a test panel tomorrow and lower heat settings to try that out. I did raise the iron temp higher to see if the PET would shrink a bit more but did not seem to affect it either way.


Will keep you posted on how it goes as well as pics tomorrow.

CC

[Nitro Blast]

Thanks for pioneering this for us CC.

I for one really appreciate it.

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by Nitro Blast

Thanks for pioneering this for us CC.

I for one really appreciate it.

I do too... I plan on covering all my projects with this stuff...

thanks capn, we a proud to be serving with you .


SPIT.

[capn chaos]

Ooooooookkkkkkk!
Finally got a chance to sit down and play with this a bit more.
First, if you dont like Monokote type shrink covering then you will not like this any better. If you dont mind shrink wrap I think you can learn to like/love this stuff. It is a little more difficult in handling since it is a lighter material and it does not shrink as much as monokote but I did find a way to help both of these (you probably already knew this).
A couple of hints regarding above. You might want to keep the iron away from interior panels while sealing the edges. You will need as much stretch as possible after edges are sealed so premature shrinkage should be avoided.
My first attempt a week ago seemed difficult but then again my flying stabilizer offered some extra challenges. Second try at other side of FS today went smoother and the other two tail surfaces were simple as any monokote job I've done. Results were satisfactory (to me anyway) and the overlapped edges seemed to dissappear. To be continued:

[capn chaos]

Doculam II , the sequel
Tried several setting on monokote iron. First setting was near the low end and registered about 210 on infrared temp gun. It did seal the edges slowly but did not want to shrink the film. (There may be a picture with the edges sealed and the film starting to go clear adjacent). I then set the gun to slightly over the "2" setting or mid temp on my gun. Temp gun was 280 and everything went much better. Sealed on 1st pass and tried to keep hell of iron from getting over the panel. Just used the tip of regular sized iron. Small trim iron, which I used to have would work good for the edge sealing. (maybe in my Christmas stocking). I found that by taking the doculam and sealing one edge to my bench/counter, and the tail surface under the film, it acted as a second set of hands to help pull against a set point. This worked really well and helped speed things up. Also when it was ready to trim, I pulled the rudder against the "fixed" edge and trimmed straight down with xacto knife using form of rudder as guide. Left a perfect 3/32" trimmed edge to seal down and finish.
I later tried a near HI setting on iron (330 degrees) and it still worked fine. No sign that the film was getting to melt down. I believe I picked up some adhesive on my iron at this setting and iron started to drag somewhat.

[capn chaos]

Nitro Blast,
I cant say for sure whether this would be good film for Depron (gotta try that stuff one day I guess). Seems that mid iron range would work best and that's now my default setting.
The only issue with ordering this stuff is there is a two roll minimum. I believe cutting a wide roll and splitting it with club members is problematic since the cut edge would tend to be tender and likely would fuse it self together during the cut process. Splitting a narrow roll length wise would be better (save those christmas paper, paper towel tubes) but would be time consuming. Best done on a cold day in front of super bowl with plenty of beer.
The good news about this stuff is if your'e not happy with first try, tear it off and do it again. ITS CHEAP. No careful measuring to conserve regular off the shelf brands (I paid $28 for a roll of silver at LHS...)
Painting is another issue, will add some weight, but evidently the results are phenomenal.
I have read where Acrylic house paint is used, Krylon Acrylic, Krylon primer.
I believe I will try the Krylon Acrylic and maybe Latex exterior primer thinned with water for a couple of practice pieces. Any ideas would be appreciated.