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Old 05-09-2011, 06:52 PM   #1
Fishbonez
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Default I got a question Super Cub LP type

Hello all
I was wondering if someone could tell me why my Super Cub LP loves to bank to the right?

Like my golf swing my plane after take off loves to bank toward the right. Sometimes really hard. Now I figure this question would be hard to answer without knowing some of the conditions. So I will try to explain as best I can.

1st- the wind was blowing from the North at 3-3.5 mph at ground level. I assume a bit stronger in the air. Beautiful sunny morning.

2nd - after my preflight checks everything seem Ok to include back rudder centered and flaps level as well, and all was operational as I know them to be. Battery was also fully charged and ACT turned off. (I have had more trouble with that then success)

1st flight took off into the wind gained height and she banked to the right and at first I did not think anything of it. There is a breeze right. After gaining height I quickly could not get the plane from swirling to the right. Numerous attempts to turn left with no success. Cut power and attempted to land before the wind took my plane away (at least I feared it would) Landing was a little rough but no damage. any landing my cub makes with no damage the happier my wallet

2nd attempt after preflight inspection. Took off into the wind and began to gain some height and the exact thing happened only difference was it happened before I gained enough height to control plane and amazingly my super cub decided to cartwheel on the grass. Ouch need new cowl and wing supports.

Could it be my plane is heavy on the right side? wing seems centered. Maybe still to much wind and my inexperience is not allowing to make accurate corrections? On my Sim i practice with a super cub in these types of wind and have little to no problem. Could it be im just a plane dork? I do not know just thought I would reach out to the experience out there and see what you all might suggest. If there is more information you may need I will gladly provide it. Everyones advice here has been priceless and I appreciate all of you
Thanks to all of you in advance
Fishbonez
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Old 05-09-2011, 10:19 PM   #2
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I have noticed when I (a lot of times) apply elevator.I also unwillingly add rudder.Maybe......Maybe,practice pulling "straight" on elevator stick. (Maybe).

"ZZ Rider"
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Old 05-09-2011, 10:40 PM   #3
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Ahh... The "right turn from hell"... It ruined my first 6 flights or so.

In my case, there were a number of reasons for it.

1) Make sure the control surfaces are flush when the sticks *AND* the trims are centered. Don't rely on transmitter trim to make the surfaces flush.

2) I strongly recommend you move the pushrod one step inwards on the rudder control horn. This will increase your rudder throw. I noticed that the rudder didn't have enough authority to get me out of trouble. Increasing the throw takes care of that problem without making the plane "twitchy".

3) As strange as it sounds for a docile trainer, the Super Cub LP has a bit of a tip stall tendency. Under certain circumstances, lack of airspeed will get the plane in a spiral. In my case, the spiral was always to the right. I don't know if that's common to all cubs, though. The solution is always to maintain airspeed. When you fly in wind and turn from flying upwind to flying downwind, there will be a brief moment in the middle of a sharp turn when your airspeed drops dramatically. I've noticed that it caused the plane to spiral a few times. So when you fly in wind, make wide turns!

I hope this helps. I haven't flown my cub in months... I think it's time to take it for a spin again!

AMA #959089
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Old 05-09-2011, 10:44 PM   #4
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Here are a couple of thoughts:
1) Are you able to adjust the trim to counteract the tendency to turn right at all? Does the plane respond, at least a little to the trim?

2) Does the plane turn to the right when power is applied or does it do so with power both on and off?

3) Are the screws that hold the horizontal and vertical stabilizers completely tightened?

4) Have you played around with adjusting the position of the rods to the control horns?

5) Does the rudder have the same travel distance both left and right? (I had to adjust mine a bit out of the box). You can do so by turning the turnbuckle that attaches to the control horn.

6) All the above aside, is there any warp to the wing?

Best of luck! Keep us informed of what you figure out!

All of my landings are three point landings if you count the spinner, too
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Old 05-09-2011, 10:50 PM   #5
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Read about my trials and tribulations with the same problem here:

http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59380

The solution was, as I stated before, to use turn buckles to center the control surfaces, increase rudder throw and maintain airspeed.

I think the most important fix is to increase the rudder throw. It made a HUGE difference in the plane's ability to recover from a spiral.

AMA #959089
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Old 05-09-2011, 10:53 PM   #6
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just my little two cents.....make sure your thrust angle is correct and that your plane is balanced, a little tip from chellie, add a little finishing nail to left wing, see if that helps too. my high wing trainer was doing the same thing you are describing, adding the nail helped. Start with small nail of course.

have a good one
cr
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Old 05-10-2011, 12:31 AM   #7
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If you are able to trim it in flight to fly straight and this leaves the rudder clearly off center look for twist in the wing.
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Old 05-11-2011, 12:18 AM   #8
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I experienced this when the vertical stab wasn't aligned perfectly with the fuselage. You may need to check that it is installed correctly with no warp...
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Old 05-11-2011, 01:53 AM   #9
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Thanks all,
I will check into all of these options. Unfortunatly due to work and some strong winds 10+ mph I cant doing any flying until probably this weekend. I will be sure to post what I find out
Thanks to all of you for your input
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Old 05-11-2011, 03:20 AM   #10
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1 lack of air speed causes lack of control. Try flying straight ahead and landing to prove there is no problem with control surface. More height and speed necessary for smooth controlled turn.

2 first flights must be with zero wind

3 good luck



Clint

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Old 05-11-2011, 04:58 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Turner View Post
If you are able to trim it in flight to fly straight and this leaves the rudder clearly off center look for twist in the wing.
I believe Tuner has it correct. If your foam wing assembly has a twist (in RC modeling it is know as Wash-In / Was-Out) such that if one side has an unequal amount then, it will explain for the unsolicited Right turn, assuming your visual trim settings were neutral with respect to Rudder and Elevator.

Thread Explaining Wash-Out / Wash-In:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=390841

For Wash-Out explaination:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washout_%28aviation%29
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:18 AM   #12
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Hi all,
Again I wan to thank all of you for your help. I have not been able to go do any flying this week due to weather but was sitting around thinking about twisted wings and things and thought would it benefit anyone if I took pictures of my cub and posted them, If I can figure out how to do it correctly, would that help you all to help me to see if something in my tail wing or main wing is bent? Just curiouse
Thanks in advance
Fishbonez
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:41 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Fishbonez View Post
Hi all,
Again I wan to thank all of you for your help. I have not been able to go do any flying this week due to weather but was sitting around thinking about twisted wings and things and thought would it benefit anyone if I took pictures of my cub and posted them, If I can figure out how to do it correctly, would that help you all to help me to see if something in my tail wing or main wing is bent? Just curiouse
Thanks in advance
Fishbonez

Fishbonez,

I have a small Great Planes Fokker DVII scale airplane. Even though I maintained it as light as possible, I really was not the one who built it. An ARF with high quality covering and premium balsa / light plywood still the RC Modeler has option to keep the model from doing ugly things like Tip Stalling on you should you need to come in Dead Stick for whatever reason, such as your Flight Battery dumps on you and need to come in slow and low.

Here's a couple of pictures showing what I did to provide WASH-OUT on the wing tips (just the top wing) for better handling and allow slower flying speeds at level flight. This allows the wing root to stall first and the tips to stall last so, you can continue to keep the model flying level flight slower and longer.
















The main thought is to keep both sides the same so, you don't have an issue with the model stalling when turning or not gaining altitude because of an en-equal WASH-OUT amounts.

In your situation you are looking for en-even / un-equal twist along the wing length and WASH-OUT or not enough.

Carlos
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:51 AM   #14
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Thanks guapoman,
I think I am slowing figuring the whole wash out thing. Will have to check my plane after work with a ruler.
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:54 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Fishbonez View Post
Hi all,
Again I wan to thank all of you for your help. I have not been able to go do any flying this week due to weather but was sitting around thinking about twisted wings and things and thought would it benefit anyone if I took pictures of my cub and posted them, If I can figure out how to do it correctly, would that help you all to help me to see if something in my tail wing or main wing is bent? Just curiouse
Thanks in advance
Fishbonez

Try a simsple glide test If it glides straight when driving straight ahead or dead stick it suggests this is a problem with lack of speed when turning stalling the plane causing classIc nose up attitude when turning. Get your nose down and your speed up.



Clint

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Old 05-13-2011, 02:54 AM   #16
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I'd actually be suprised to find out that there was a warp to an HZ SC wing. But, def. not ruling it out.

Check this: Do both wings have the plastic clips to retain the studs that hold the wing struts? Mine only had them on one wing. Wasn't a problem until I augered in last night due to flying at high speed inches off the ground. I tried to do a crop duster turn, but the plane disappeared behind a tree for a second. I couldn't recover in time and broke the remains of the motor mount, and really stretched out the wing holes without the clips.

Clear packaging tape fixes pretty much anything. Before I reinforced the holes, the plane behaved totally differently. After, it flew like a dream, again.

Best of luck. Stick with it-its a GREAT plane!

All of my landings are three point landings if you count the spinner, too
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:57 AM   #17
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Oh-and CBatters has a great point! When gliding, use elevator to control airspeed and throttle to control altitude. The HZ SC will definitely tip stall!

All of my landings are three point landings if you count the spinner, too
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Old 05-13-2011, 03:01 AM   #18
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Thanks folks
definitly keepping all this in mind. Everyones advice in priceless anf I cant thank you all enough. Just wishing the wind and snain (snow/rain) would make for a nice day so ican get out there for hopefully my 3rd successful flight.
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Old 05-13-2011, 03:03 AM   #19
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Unlike "other" RC Foam trainers and a few Warbirds, this model does not have any Spar or re-enforcement within it's wing. (Just place the Super Cub's wing up in the Light and you will see nothing!)

Thereby, the need for the plastic Struts are completely and fully functional and there "is" no option to leave them off, unless you really want some excitement the next time you try and have the model zoom downwards and then, apply just a slight UP elevator... I would certainly assure you all that one or both wings will break.

I usually apply some 2-inch wide, 3M brand, High Performance, Clear Packing Tape (found in Walmart) such that applying the tape underneath and length wise you will eliminate the possibility of any wing failure should the struts fail or not tight enough.

I have seen many foam wings without any spars or re-enforcements warp due to leaving the model in the hot car and under pressure such as a tight trunk or other items left in the trunk or just the position the model was left.

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Old 05-13-2011, 03:05 AM   #20
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Snow and rain??? Good Lord, man! Where do you live???

All of my landings are three point landings if you count the spinner, too
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Old 05-13-2011, 03:12 AM   #21
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[QUOTE=guapoman2000;808164]Unlike "other" RC Foam trainers and a few Warbirds, this model does not have any Spar or re-enforcement within it's wing.

Thereby, the need for the plastic Struts are completely and fully functional and there "is" no option to leave them off, unless you really want some excitement the next time you try and have the model zoom downwards and then, apply just a slight UP elevator... I would certainly assure you all that one or both wings will break.

Should my struts be tight or should ther be some flop to them (lack of a better word) All screws are tight etc.
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Old 05-13-2011, 03:14 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by earthsciteach View Post
Snow and rain??? Good Lord, man! Where do you live???
Gotta love southern wyoming
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Old 05-13-2011, 03:20 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Fishbonez View Post
Should my struts be tight or should ther be some flop to them (lack of a better word) All screws are tight etc.
In the eye holes of the plastic struts, the side you screw em in at the FUSE, I usually take a hobby knife and dig out plastic to elongate the hole such that the strut is screwed in to allow both struts tight and equally, assuming you have placed the wing centered on top of FUSE.

If you allow the struts too lose or flimsy you run the risk of one wing to start breaking and they usually break about 2 inches from the FUSE contact, either right or left wing, depending on which side you leave those struts lose!

Hope this helps!
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Old 05-13-2011, 03:30 AM   #24
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I have a 2nd Hobby Zone Super Cub that was bought completely AIR FRAME ONLY style.

This model was my experimental platform and I used many types of Brushless motors and I am not going to bore you with all the details here and instead, I wanted to point out that this model has crashed many times and one time my friends thought I was going to place it in the trash can because it was so mangled and the FUSE suffered very much breakage after a dive from over 85 feet up and came down nose first.

I have used WHITE glue (you know, the stuff the kids use at school) such that provides excellent bond (takes over night) and does not leave any ugly residue.

Since the powerful brushless motor and having it with Ailerons, I have re-enforced this model using a adhesive, mylar film known as ORACAL, Intermediate 651 and comes in several colors (do a search).

I covered the entire FUSE with egg shell WHITE and some of the wing assembly along with the 2-inch wide 3M Packing Tape underneath the wing assembly "and" still use those white Plastic Struts!

Some pictures:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=1775527










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Old 05-13-2011, 03:31 AM   #25
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Default Video of my 2nd Super Cub with Brushless Power!

Video:

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