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Old 10-12-2013, 12:54 AM   #1
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Default planet 5 radio 2.4ghz.

Hello folks,
Can any fellow member advise me if the Planet T5 basic radio system is suitable for electric flight, or it's range to limited ?
Thanks all the best, John.
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Old 10-12-2013, 01:59 AM   #2
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Really hard to say. It is not even clost to mainstream sadly. My guess is it would be safe to 1k feet more more but I would do some testing and see how far you get on the ground.... Sorry not much help....
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Old 10-12-2013, 02:37 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by murphy View Post
Hello folks,
Can any fellow member advise me if the Planet T5 basic radio system is suitable for electric flight, or it's range to limited ?
Thanks all the best, John.
I found an ad for the T5. they advise that the range is "around" 100 meters(about 330ft) I would use it for outdoor flight. It would be more suitable to indoor use.

http://www.alwayshobbies.com/model-boats/radio-control-equipment/transmitters-$4-receivers/planet-t5-2$34ghz-transmitter-$4-receiver-set-mode-2

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Old 10-12-2013, 04:48 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by murphy View Post
Hello folks,
Can any fellow member advise me if the Planet T5 basic radio system is suitable for electric flight, or it's range to limited ?
Thanks all the best, John.
For about twice that amount, you can buy an entry level Spektrum DX5e. This radio is full range.
http://www.horizonhobby.com/products...ly-md2-SPM5510

As for the most popular Radio Control radio brands, take a look:
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71276

If you want to take a chance on very low cost receivers, those Orange Spektrum compatible receivers are being used for some of the lower cost model airplanes.

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Old 10-12-2013, 06:28 AM   #5
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The Planet range was sold in the Shop that is now closed in Riga ... they advertised them as full range ... but I don't know anyone who used one.

Better to go for a 9x or other known radio ...

Personally - I have a Park Fly radio from my RTF in my collection ... but I don't use it anymore .. preferring to have the security of full range. With 2.4Ghz being virtually unnecessary to have frequency control ... there's no real reason to have limited Tx power nowadays ...

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Old 10-12-2013, 08:03 AM   #6
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I agree with Nigel,

If you are on a very tight budget there are cheap systems out there that are proven pretty reliable and have full range, like the 9x systems that you can get from Hobbyking, or their Orange transmitters.

If you want a system that also comes with decent after sales service then look to the mainstream manufacturers. Spektrum for instance who do have some budget priced systems in their range, but they don't have the feature set that the 'off-brand' products have at the same price point.
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Old 10-12-2013, 07:09 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
I agree with Nigel,

If you are on a very tight budget there are cheap systems out there that are proven pretty reliable and have full range, like the 9x systems that you can get from Hobbyking, or their Orange transmitters.

If you want a system that also comes with decent after sales service then look to the mainstream manufacturers. Spektrum for instance who do have some budget priced systems in their range, but they don't have the feature set that the 'off-brand' products have at the same price point.
I raised the question with Spektrum awhile back on now many lines of code their DX8 transmitter has. Response, some 200KLOC that's 200,000 lines of code if I understand it right.

Now you know where those $$$$ go in these name brand RC radio systems.

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Old 10-12-2013, 08:58 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
I raised the question with Spektrum awhile back on now many lines of code their DX8 transmitter has. Response, some 200KLOC that's 200,000 lines of code if I understand it right.

Now you know where those $$$$ go in these name brand RC radio systems.
Fine but FrSky still is amongst the leaders in hopping about the freq and staying clear of control loss and they are well under pricing of Spekie ... lines of code are great as long as the spots it hops about are enough !! AND we cannot forget that despite Spekies upgrade to 'X system from its '2 ... there are still many older '2 systems out there AND being sold on owner to new owners ... etc. etc. with all the problems of lost signal lock and it's long time to re-acquire etc. etc. Not everyone can afford to change their radio like others ...



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Old 10-12-2013, 10:38 PM   #9
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I used DSM2 for years and continue to when flying with some older receivers, I've never had a problem with it. My flying buddy uses my old DX7 (DSM2) and he's never had a single glitch either.
Technology moves on and DSM2 has been surpassed, but I don't think there was fundamentally any realworld problem with DSM2 other than the limit on models in the air at the same time, which would only apply as big meets. It was certainly a huge improvement over the link security of 35/72MHz systems.
Bottom line, if it was that bad it wouldn't have become the most popular system in the world, would it?

Anyway, Speky has been DSMX for almost three years so I'd be real surprised if you can find a new Spektrum DSM2 Tx for sale anywhere. The Hobbyking Orange Tx's still use it though.
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Old 10-13-2013, 06:15 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
I used DSM2 for years and continue to when flying with some older receivers, I've never had a problem with it. My flying buddy uses my old DX7 (DSM2) and he's never had a single glitch either.
Technology moves on and DSM2 has been surpassed, but I don't think there was fundamentally any realworld problem with DSM2 other than the limit on models in the air at the same time, which would only apply as big meets. It was certainly a huge improvement over the link security of 35/72MHz systems.
Bottom line, if it was that bad it wouldn't have become the most popular system in the world, would it?
I agree that majority of time no problem ...as with many other sets. But it has a reputation of being slow to re-lock on after loss of signal. The change to 'x not only increased the sopts used in hopping but also corrected this fundamental flaw. Yes in my opinion it is a flaw when you think that near all other radio brands did not have such delay in re-lock.

As to being most popular system in the world ? mmmm I'll leave that one in the "questionable arena" .. cannot find any real statement proving that. Perceived I believe.

Anyway, Speky has been DSMX for almost three years so I'd be real surprised if you can find a new Spektrum DSM2 Tx for sale anywhere. The Hobbyking Orange Tx's still use it though.
I didn't mean New sets being sold out of shops / dealers BUT I bet there are a few online clearing them of shelves still ...
What I meant is the selling on the 2nd hand market ... people who buy latest radio ... sell on the old ... or people that leave the hobby ... sell on the old etc. etc.
How many times do you read on forums : Go buy a DX6i ... anf the newbie comes back and says .. I got a great deal of xxxxx for a DX6i ... usually 2nd hand ... from another guy.

You yourself say you still use a DSM2 set ...

Bit like cars ... all talk about ABS, auto lock 4wd diffs, winter buttons ... etc. etc. but an awful lot of older cars out there without ...



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Old 10-13-2013, 08:20 AM   #11
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Nigel,

The slow re-connection thing was after a brown-out (and we all know that brown outs are caused primarily by inadequate power supply, not the radio system).

Anyway, this slow re-connect was down to the receiver, not in inherent issue in DSM2. If you use one of the newer receivers with an old DSM2 Tx you will get a fast re-connect. As above it's not an issue anyway providing you have a adequate power supply to the system.

FWIW I don't use a DSM2 set any more, my flying buddy has my old DX7 and it's going strong. I've gone to DSMX though the Tx still works in DSM2 mode when I fly one or two of my models that have DSM2 receivers in them. IMHO DSM2 is still perfectly adequate under almost all conditions, the one exception being if you fly at very large events where you might have over 40 2.4GHz transmitters turned on.
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Old 10-13-2013, 08:34 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by murphy View Post
Hello folks,
Can any fellow member advise me if the Planet T5 basic radio system is suitable for electric flight, or it's range to limited ?
Thanks all the best, John.
IMHO, Stay clear from off brand Radios, they will just cause you headaches, spend a little more and buy Radio Confidence, with a trusted radio system, your pocket book will thank you ,

Hitec 2.4 -- 5 channel transmitter and 6 channel full range receiver 89.99

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXAEXR&P=7

http://www.motionrc.com/hitec-optic-...Fa1_QgoddywAzQ


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Old 10-13-2013, 08:55 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
Nigel,

The slow re-connection thing was after a brown-out (and we all know that brown outs are caused primarily by inadequate power supply, not the radio system).

Anyway, this slow re-connect was down to the receiver, not in inherent issue in DSM2. If you use one of the newer receivers with an old DSM2 Tx you will get a fast re-connect. As above it's not an issue anyway providing you have a adequate power supply to the system.

FWIW I don't use a DSM2 set any more, my flying buddy has my old DX7 and it's going strong. I've gone to DSMX though the Tx still works in DSM2 mode when I fly one or two of my models that have DSM2 receivers in them. IMHO DSM2 is still perfectly adequate under almost all conditions, the one exception being if you fly at very large events where you might have over 40 2.4GHz transmitters turned on.
Hi JPF ... I understand that from all the bumf that's flown around forums for ages about it ... to be honest I reckon a lot of the so called 'Brown-outs' are fingers and thumbs and not loss of Rx lock ... basically Pilot error. I know I've been quick to blame gear in past and then found in reality it's me !

My comment was basically that old gear is still used .. I have my old JR Prop 8ch set from 1980's ... best there was then .. 35mhz etc.

Old gear still sold on to others etc.

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Old 10-13-2013, 03:45 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
Nigel,

The slow re-connection thing was after a brown-out (and we all know that brown outs are caused primarily by inadequate power supply, not the radio system).

Anyway, this slow re-connect was down to the receiver, not in inherent issue in DSM2. If you use one of the newer receivers with an old DSM2 Tx you will get a fast re-connect. As above it's not an issue anyway providing you have a adequate power supply to the system.

FWIW I don't use a DSM2 set any more, my flying buddy has my old DX7 and it's going strong. I've gone to DSMX though the Tx still works in DSM2 mode when I fly one or two of my models that have DSM2 receivers in them. IMHO DSM2 is still perfectly adequate under almost all conditions, the one exception being if you fly at very large events where you might have over 40 2.4GHz transmitters turned on.
As for the slow reconnect after a loss of proper battery supply voltage in the original receivers, just contact Horizon Hobby. Don't know if they are still doing it, but I sent all six of my receivers into Horizon three or four years ago for the update in software, both in the transmitter and receivers. HH did it at no charge, including paying for return shipment.

I checked it, the receiver reconnect after a "brownout" applied by my power supply is now about 1/2 second or so.

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Old 10-13-2013, 04:11 PM   #15
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Yes Yes Yes ... but like every other item in the world - there are people still with old versions whatever it is ... some because they don't have access so easy to such as HH ... some because they just too lazy ... some because they don't read forums and don't know about it ...

My point is just because HH updated their firmware ... cured a flaw .. does not mean everyone has availed themselves of the service.

Years ago ... I bought a Sony 8mm Handycam. About 6 months later the switch for camera - off - playback began to play up and was intermittent ... needed to be switched a few times to get desired. So many times the battery pack was flat when I got to location I wanted to video.
I waited till I returned nearly a year later where the shop was ... and I went in as they were the main importers for the region. Guy took one look asked me why I had not come in earlier ... as the switch was a known fault ... and Sony offered a free replacement Gold plated switch - which he fitted there and then.
The point being I knew nothing about that and had waited .. I fully expected to pay for the repair having waited till out of warranty.

Does anyone get my point ?

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Old 10-13-2013, 04:54 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
Yes Yes Yes ... but like every other item in the world - there are people still with old versions whatever it is ...
Yup
And those people that have a very solid battery supply for these receivers don't have to worry about that inadequate battery caused "Brownouts", even with the old original Spekie software.

As for me, I've been using those Castle Creations 10 amp uBEC's with the switching power supply for receiver power. Now that the industry has caught on to the issue with high power servos overloading the receiver DC power source, a number of RC suppliers such as Common Sense, and others, have high power uBEC's on the market. (On my giant scale model with 7 Hitec 645MG servos, I've measured a peak current of 14 Amps on my $$$$ Fluke 87V digital multimeter with its millisecond response peak hold function. Just while moving the transmitter sticks back and forth.)

IMHO, modelers using those four or five cell "AA" Nih batteries for receiver power in these giant scale models are risking their models, since these size Nih cells simply can't handle these high power servos.

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Old 10-13-2013, 09:24 PM   #17
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I work in a field that the WORST case scenario has to be the level that sets the guide lines.

So in the RC world ... if a Rx is based on a two spot freq hop ... then it has to be near worst case. Second because not everyone is using high power uBECs .. Rx power systems to ensure total time power ... - this has to be prime worst case.

Like highways ... speed limits and driving rules set to take into account worst case drivers.

Sorry to keep at this ... but it's great saying upgrades, more Rx battery power .. etc. etc. but there must be lots out there that do not avail themselves of it or even know about it ...

I use FrSky ... with excellent Freq Hopping .. with virtually instant re-lock on signal by Rx ... very low voltage before Rx loses lock ... all tested and listed online ... with no need to upgrade ... no need to have a new version ... and prices that make my pocket happy.

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Old 10-13-2013, 09:47 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
I work in a field that the WORST case scenario has to be the level that sets the guide lines.

So in the RC world ... if a Rx is based on a two spot freq hop ... then it has to be near worst case. Second because not everyone is using high power uBECs .. Rx power systems to ensure total time power ... - this has to be prime worst case.

Like highways ... speed limits and driving rules set to take into account worst case drivers.

Sorry to keep at this ... but it's great saying upgrades, more Rx battery power .. etc. etc. but there must be lots out there that do not avail themselves of it or even know about it ...

I use FrSky ... with excellent Freq Hopping .. with virtually instant re-lock on signal by Rx ... very low voltage before Rx loses lock ... all tested and listed online ... with no need to upgrade ... no need to have a new version ... and prices that make my pocket happy.

Nigel
Yup, always plan for the very worst thing that can happen to your model, as we say in the USA and likely elsewhere, Murphys law indicates a 15 cent part in your model can cost you your model. As an example, never seen one fail, but I'm NOT a fan of those plastic clevis units with the plastic pin through the control horn.

Another club member told me he did his maiden flight on a twin cylinder gasser, landed it, and something inside was loose. He found his LiFe receiver battery was hanging loose at the tail of his model, hanging by the Deans connector. He'd shrink wrapped his Deans connector, that saved his $$$$ model. On my advice, he now has dual LiFe batteries for his receiver power for reliability. And, secure mounting for his LiFe batteries. All because of a 15 cent piece of Velcro.

Murphys Law.

I've checked what it takes to brownout all of my Spekie receivers, its almost exactly 3.2 volt DC, that on a five cell Nih battery that normally runs about 5.5 volts or higher.

I've not tested Futaba receivers or any other similar brand names, since no one in our club is using them. At any rate, IMHO, any receiver power supply that is dropping down to under 3.2 Volts DC is a real reliability problem.

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Old 10-13-2013, 10:41 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
So in the RC world ... if a Rx is based on a two spot freq hop ... then it has to be near worst case. Second because not everyone is using high power uBECs .. Rx power systems to ensure total time power ... - this has to be prime worst case.
DSMX (the Spektrum system for the last three years) doesn't hop between only two frequencies it hops over the full band as well as any other including FrSky. Plus for added link robustness it used DSSS, which to the best of my knowledge no one else has.
The slow re-root and poor low voltage tolerance is also stuff of the past.. time to move on.
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Old 10-14-2013, 02:16 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
DSMX (the Spektrum system for the last three years) doesn't hop between only two frequencies it hops over the full band as well as any other including FrSky. Plus for added link robustness it used DSSS, which to the best of my knowledge no one else has.
The slow re-root and poor low voltage tolerance is also stuff of the past.. time to move on.
Yup
That DSSS (Direct Sequence Spread Spectrum) is what they call wide band modulation, as compared to the narrow band modulation used by the frequency hopping type Spread Spectrum.

The thing about wide band modulation, unless the receiver has the same exact coding that the transmitters DSSS uses (kind of like a digital combination lock) the receiver completely ignores it. Sort of like blocking your water hose with a finger held a foot in front of your water hose nozzle while watering your flower beds. A single stream of water (ie narrow band) is far easier to block than a wide spray of water (ie wide band) while aiming at your plants.

I've looked at the Spektrum DX7 "two channel" broad cast on my 2.4 Ghz Spektrum Analyzer while turning on a Futaba 2.4 Ghz radio. That Futaba radio transmitted its multiple narrow band frequencies all over the DSSS signal. Didn't bother the DSSS Spektrum signal at all. Now, for those guys that fly in those giant scale model fly ins, Spektrum has their DSMX system, that combines the DSSS wide band transmission with the frequency hopping stuff.

You'd better believe there is a lot of high powered mathematics behind this DSSS and DSMX stuff.

As has been pointed out many times both in wattflyer and other web sites, these quality 2.4 Ghz radios are pretty much interference free. Futaba, Spektrum, JR, and so on work very well. They only have problems when flying with perhaps over one hundred 2.4 Ghz transmitters all turned on at the same time. This is one reason Spektrum went to the DSMX protocol.

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Old 10-14-2013, 06:46 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
DSMX (the Spektrum system for the last three years) doesn't hop between only two frequencies it hops over the full band as well as any other including FrSky. Plus for added link robustness it used DSSS, which to the best of my knowledge no one else has.
The slow re-root and poor low voltage tolerance is also stuff of the past.. time to move on.
When I said two spot freq - I was and am fully aware that was the old DSM2 ... and that DSMX uses a lot more over the band ... BUT you imply here that it is any spot of the bandwidth now ... implying near infinite number of spots ... not correct.

I'm not against Spekie or pushing another in its place ... but trying to get people to accept that not everyone has the latest on his bench ... there's still a significant number who still fly FM ...

Unfortunately my initial idea to have this point noted has blown up out of all proportion now ...

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Old 10-14-2013, 06:48 AM   #22
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I defer to RCModelReviews and his testing of systems, along with other online sites ... and rest my case.

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Old 10-14-2013, 08:46 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
When I said two spot freq - I was and am fully aware that was the old DSM2 ... and that DSMX uses a lot more over the band ... BUT you imply here that it is any spot of the bandwidth now ... implying near infinite number of spots ... not correct.
The only thing I inferred (in fact stated) was that DSMX spreads across the entire band as well as any other system. I believe this is true, based among other sources on the RCModelReviews testing?

In any case there is FAR more to link security than spreading over the full band. Very importantly Speky DSMX uses two different frequencies at any one instant (each with frequency hopping). So even if one frequency is instantaneously blocked DSMX has another to choose from, other systems drop a frame under the same circumstances. This redundancy is inherited from the old DSM2 protocol.
Speky also used DSSS which adds an additional level of interference filtering. I'm not about to pretend I really understand how DSSS works but it is a genuine technology used in numerous applications, not something that was invented by Spektrum as a marketing gimmick.

Simple frequency analysers as used by RCModelReview donít even begin to identify these features.

Anyway, we are lucky enough to have numerous 2.4GHz systems all of which appear in the real world to offer perfectly adequate link security, which is great. How they achieve it is of little interest to most people.
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Old 10-14-2013, 01:38 PM   #24
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Bruce at RCModelReview has an agenda - without question. I certainly don't invalidate some of what he says - but he has an agenda. That creates a slant to your work. There are forums that present a bit more of what is going on, tons of accusations and real life issues he has caused in his own home land and clubs. Perhaps he is not that persona you see in the vids.

I did the first in print review of the Spektrum DX6. This was original DSM technology that locks onto 2 "channels" in the band and it stayed there. I chatted with the originator of the system (John Adams) a brilliant guy to say the least, to verify some of the accuracy of the article. I did ton's of research and presented some of it there. It is on RCG if you wish to read it. I am proud of it and feel it was very fair and balanced.

I knew guys would be skeptical - I was too! I just didn't want to believe this system would be the future but within a few weeks of testing (I did 4 months!) I knew 2.4GHz was the future of the hobby. I even began to sell all my 72MHz stuff. I knew the system would replace our current technology.

The "others" when the eventually released their systems said that was not very wise to be on just two channels. They, as competitors often do, touted their own technology as better. In fact the only thing I was shocked at - was how LONG it took the competition to roll out their systems, especially Futaba. It just shows there were some "issues" to overcome and it was NOT easy to adopt this new frequency band.

Spektrum made enhancements and introduced DSM2 and got even better. But they still stayed on two channels. In fact it was not until the mega events - stuff with over 250 pilots, with the entire range of 2.4 GHz saturated that the weakness of 2 channels was discovered. By the way - even the hopping stuff had issues - many fail to point that out too.

Then entered DSMX (with channel hopping) in their own flair. I have used it for 3 years now - with excellent results - even at the mega events.

Technology advanced - just as you would expect and we are the benefactors. The competition certainly helped keep the market charged with energy and "My Brand is better than Their Brand" talk and in reality all the major brands simply work.

Do the research - as I did you will be stunned at the power of the 2.4GHz spectrum and the many benefits.

I wish Bruce didn't have an agenda but I feel he does. By the way he now "approves" of DSMX and more robust and OK to be playing with the big boys. I agree it is better but that does not mean DSM2 (I still regularly fly this) is going to cause you plane to fall from the air. If you are flying at SEFF or IRCHA or a few others you might want to consider the update to DSMX.

At any rate - this somewhat off topic post is now long enough.



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Old 10-14-2013, 02:08 PM   #25
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If we all agreed about who's info . review etc. is biased ... unbiased ... an agenda ... no agenda etc. - life would be boring and we would not be individuals.
Second no matter who it is - will always have a bias to one or other in anything they do.

I agree that RCModelreviews does appear to have a certain flavour to his views ... and I like that - not that I agree with it .. but it adds to the read.

I like where last post says ... "By the way he now "approves" of DSMX and more robust and OK to be playing with the big boys" ... because he has never said NOT to use any Spektrum set-up ... he may have knocked DSM2 ... but he's only one of many - and even then not to say its bad or should not be used.

I am also sceptical of EVERY manufacturer or person involved in commercial interests ... as they will always protect their product. Bruce has no interest commercially ... which makes him independent to air his views as he see's fit.

I also know he has issues outside of the online persona ... plenty online about that.

He is not gospel for me ... but a good source ALONG WITH REST that are accessible online to read and digest ... to try and fathom out what to choose / use. I do not adhere to one persons view ... I try to weight up each I find and arrive at what I consider best fair assessment. Wrong or right - that's a difficult task.

World marches on ... I was totally impressed with my JR Propo with all it's bells and whistles back in mid 80's ... and impressed with the 9x and it's myriad of possibilities now ... as well as Spektrum and the others with their functions etc. But I do not consider one so much better than other .. given globalisation of industry and manufacturing now.

You only have to go back a few years ... Acer was one of the biggest manufacturers of components for computers ... most brand names were using Acer parts ... Acer then expanded its small computer side and marched onto the market with complete systems ... with so many so-called experts calling them cheap and chatty ... fact was that they were only using the same gear as they were selling for ages to main stream companies that those same experts were calling better.
Look at Lenovo ... another story ... IBM and it's factory !

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