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Old 02-14-2012, 09:11 PM   #1
CNY_Dave
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Default Adding flaps with full-length strip ailerons

I have a 5lbs trainer and just like to mess with things. I can open up a few flying areas if I can get it to land a bit shorter (takeoffs are just fine, 3-6 feet and it's up).

Was thinking of adding simple flaps that would be just ahead of the 1-inch wide strip aileron, yes a ton of drag (which might be good) but acceptable if I get a bit of lift and can slow the landing speed.

I'm probably just bench-racing as the aileron authority at low speeds is crap (but I might extend them near the ends), anyone ever play around with cheesy flaps like this?

I might get more from retractable slats, but this'd be a lot easier and lighter.


Dave
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:46 PM   #2
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I have flaps on several of my planes. They are fun to play with but not very effective. If you get too slow with flaps down you can't recover. Maybe what you really need is a drag chute.
Henry
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Old 02-14-2012, 09:55 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Henry Sistrunk View Post
I have flaps on several of my planes. They are fun to play with but not very effective. If you get too slow with flaps down you can't recover. Maybe what you really need is a drag chute.
Henry

The thought had crossed my mind...

It'd be nice to be able to reverse the motor too.
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Old 02-15-2012, 12:38 AM   #4
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Spoilers might be what you work.
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Old 02-15-2012, 02:17 AM   #5
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if you have full length ailerons on the wing controlled by a center servo you could. cut the ailerons in half.. turn the inner ailerons into flaps, and then add aileron servos out further in the wing, and run the outer strips that way...


of course you will need to change the servo linkage setup on the central flaps.
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Old 02-15-2012, 04:27 AM   #6
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Well since we're just bench racing, err flying here.

Since it's a trainer, I bet it has a bunch of dihedral in the wing. Would explain the lack of aileron authority at low speeds. They're fighting the dihedral's self righting when they are trying to bank the plane.


So remove the dihedral, now you'll have overly responsive ailerons that can be shortened and still give good response. The excess are now your flap candidates.


But after all that, it's no longer a self righting trainer, you now have a "point it and that's where it's going to stay until you change it" bird. No more help staying wings level, it's all you.

Will up your abilities as now you will be flying the bird all by yourself, the plane isn't going to be helping you anymore.

When I die, I want to go like my Grandfather did, in his sleep...... Not screaming like the passengers in his plane.
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Old 02-15-2012, 06:06 AM   #7
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Check recent posts.. the subject has pretty much been don't to death in the last few days: http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65698

IMHO, on that plane, don't bother.

Steve
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Old 02-15-2012, 03:37 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
Check recent posts.. the subject has pretty much been don't to death in the last few days: http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65698

IMHO, on that plane, don't bother.

Steve

Well, flaperons have been done to death, anyway.

This isn't nearly as much about 'I want to make this trainer better' as it is 'I want to screw around a bit and learn some kitbashing skills'.

"I bet I can make simple flaps that stay on the fuse and use a single central servo"..., that type of thing.
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Old 02-15-2012, 04:03 PM   #9
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Why discourage experimentation? If the OP want flaps done to death or not just do it. See for yourself if it has any benefit.

A.M.A Park Pilot Partner / Wattflyer Mentor
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Old 02-15-2012, 06:05 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by newjak View Post
Why discourage experimentation? If the OP want flaps done to death or not just do it. See for yourself if it has any benefit.
I didn't try to put him off. if you read the posts i made on the other thread i said try it by all means but IMHO for this type of plane it doesn't usually work very well... Full length 'strip' flaperons that is, separate inboard flaps is another thing altogether.
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Old 02-25-2012, 11:35 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by CNY_Dave View Post
I have a 5lbs trainer and just like to mess with things. I can open up a few flying areas if I can get it to land a bit shorter (takeoffs are just fine, 3-6 feet and it's up).

Was thinking of adding simple flaps that would be just ahead of the 1-inch wide strip aileron, yes a ton of drag (which might be good) but acceptable if I get a bit of lift and can slow the landing speed.

I'm probably just bench-racing as the aileron authority at low speeds is crap (but I might extend them near the ends), anyone ever play around with cheesy flaps like this?

I might get more from retractable slats, but this'd be a lot easier and lighter.

Dave
What you are talking about is a split flap. The only problem is, you don't want to put them in front of the ailerons, or you loose your ailerons for that part of the wing that you put the flap on. It will mess up the air flow there and the ailerons won't work in that part of the wing. Now if you really want to have some fun and put flaps on, then you can do that, just not the way you want to.

Cut you ailerons off completely and start from scratch. Now take a piece of wood that is the same thickness as your ailerons were and you can make some flaps and new ailerons out of it. Get a sort of hard balsa and make you flaps about 2 inches wide and half the span of your ailerons. make the ailerons go the rest of the way and cut a taper on them so they go to the old width as the ailerons at the tip. Your gonna need two more servos to do this right, but then you can have a great handling plane in the end. Make the flaps go down about 50 to 60 degs max and you can almost slow that thing down to a stop. You don't HAVE to taper the flaps and ailerons like the old ailerons, but you can if you want to make them look nice. Just taper the TE a little and that should be good enough. Cover them to match your covering and then have at it. You will have a ball with flaps and enjoy flying is tighter fields with it too.

Ed
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