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Old 04-14-2014, 12:37 AM   #1
CHELLIE
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Build Review $100 Semi Scratch, Twin Build Contest

Hi Everyone Lets get this Contest Started This will be a Semi Scratch Build Contest, where Plans and Short Kits will be Allowed to get more People Involved in building a Aircraft, The judging will be based on Performance and looks of the build, Good luck to everyone That Participate in the Build. Here are the Simple Rules.

Contest Starting Date, 4 - 13 - 2014, Judging will last for 2 weeks after the contest, 1st and 2nd place Winners will receive Build Award Icons and some Wattflyer Logos

1. plans are ok to use.

2. pre cut short kits are ok as opposed to a full kit

3. all building materials are ok to use, as not to limit availability of material to be used in countries where some materials may be limited

4. 150 days to get her Done Sept 30 2014 will be the finish date, close enough

5. Twin powered Aircraft.

6. $100.00 build limit, not to include power system or electronics

7. Enter ---- $100 Twin Build Contest then the Name of your plane, so i can Find it, and list it During Judging, Good luck to Everyone

8. Ok To Frankenstein old Aircraft parts for up to 50% of the Build




$100 Twin Build Contest XF5U

$100 Contest entry : Twin Pusher "Sport Scale" TU-144 Concordski








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Old 04-14-2014, 02:35 AM   #2
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In the US , we have a popular TV show called " Shark Tank" where would be entrepreneurs try to convince a wealthy panel of celebrity judges to invest in their idea or new start-up in exchange for a portion of the company. Most of the time the judges will one by one say: " I'm out " and state a reason.

As tempting as this contest is and considering my love for twins, I'm afraid that with all that I have going , I have to sadly say: "I'm out"

I'll be watching with great interest as usual and wish everyone the best of luck !
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Old 04-14-2014, 01:24 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by dahawk View Post
In the US , we have a popular TV show called " Shark Tank" where would be entrepreneurs try to convince a wealthy panel of celebrity judges to invest in their idea or new start-up in exchange for a portion of the company. Most of the time the judges will one by one say: " I out " and state a reason.

As tempting as this contest is and considering my love for twins, I'm afraid that with all that I have going , I have to sadly say: "I'm out"

I'll be watching with great interest as usual and wish everyone the best of luck !
Like most of such TV shows ... X factor incl - they started in UK ... died a death and then sold onto you guys ...

It was called Dragons Den in UK I believe ... which tried to take Alan Sugars investor program a few notches further on ...

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Old 04-14-2014, 02:06 PM   #4
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mmmmm looks like my Tu144 can fit into this ?

Twin Pusher prop powered Tu144 (Concordski) ....

6mm Depron job based on plans / design by myself (ideas, inspiration, builder. flyer) and Don (DEG) who's the CAD guy puttin all on paper for me !!

I assume even though a lot of preliminary plans work pre-dates start date - that this is OK ? No building in any way has started yet and won't until I gert home from Ukraine, Crimea in about 4 - 6 weeks time.
If OK - then I will change my Tu144 thread title to reflect the contest ?

Nigel

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Old 04-14-2014, 06:12 PM   #5
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I've been toying with an idea for a couple months now. This might just give me the motivation to "Get er done!"


Now I just need to go back through some drawings and see if I can find where I left off.

Cheesy poofs are what Yankees get when they eat Southen Food!! bub, steve
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Old 04-14-2014, 08:35 PM   #6
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To be honest ............ $100 would cover ENTIRE modell incl. motors, ESC's and batterys ... but not radio.



Nigel

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Old 04-14-2014, 08:36 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by offtom View Post
I've been toying with an idea for a couple months now. This might just give me the motivation to "Get er done!"


Now I just need to go back through some drawings and see if I can find where I left off.
And pray what is that ? Teasing us ??

Nigel

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Old 04-14-2014, 09:19 PM   #8
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Ok. I'm in. This gives me the excuse to build that flat foam XF5U from the Park Pilot magazine plans. I'll start the thread when the foam arrives.
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Old 04-14-2014, 10:10 PM   #9
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I have a set of plans for an electric Free Flight Airco DH10 I have been sitting on, just not thrilled about hand cutting 96+ wing ribs by hand. I also have some plans for a foam F18. I have been wanting to try to work with foam. I need to see how well I can get 2 small EDF's in it.

I'm either going to get good at flying em, or get good at fixin em!
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Old 04-15-2014, 02:19 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
mmmmm looks like my Tu144 can fit into this ?

Twin Pusher prop powered Tu144 (Concordski) ....

6mm Depron job based on plans / design by myself (ideas, inspiration, builder. flyer) and Don (DEG) who's the CAD guy puttin all on paper for me !!

I assume even though a lot of preliminary plans work pre-dates start date - that this is OK ? No building in any way has started yet and won't until I gert home from Ukraine, Crimea in about 4 - 6 weeks time.
If OK - then I will change my Tu144 thread title to reflect the contest ?

Nigel
Sounds like a Nice Build

Originally Posted by offtom View Post
I've been toying with an idea for a couple months now. This might just give me the motivation to "Get er done!"


Now I just need to go back through some drawings and see if I can find where I left off.
Cool Glad to have you in the contest

Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
To be honest ............ $100 would cover ENTIRE modell incl. motors, ESC's and batterys ... but not radio.



Nigel
yes, Being very Generous with the Limit

Originally Posted by xmech2k View Post
Ok. I'm in. This gives me the excuse to build that flat foam XF5U from the Park Pilot magazine plans. I'll start the thread when the foam arrives.
Cool, Sounds like a Neet Build

Originally Posted by BroncoSquid View Post
I have a set of plans for an electric Free Flight Airco DH10 I have been sitting on, just not thrilled about hand cutting 96+ wing ribs by hand. I also have some plans for a foam F18. I have been wanting to try to work with foam. I need to see how well I can get 2 small EDF's in it.
Decisions Decisions LOL

I may be getting Older, But I Refuse to grow Up I am Having to much Fun to Grow Up LOL
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Old 04-15-2014, 03:22 AM   #11
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Gotta get a good 1400 mm span outline of a Batman bat symbol...
The rest will be easy.
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Old 04-15-2014, 04:49 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
Gotta get a good 1400 mm span outline of a Batman bat symbol...
The rest will be easy.
Will this do you?? Should print out full size or if you'd like, I can tile it for you.......


Attached Files
File Type: pdf BatMan.pdf (34.0 KB, 87 views)
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Old 04-15-2014, 03:22 PM   #13
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I'm in. Been toying with the idea of scratch building a Beech Starship twin pusher.
May even attempt the variable pitch cannard.

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Old 04-15-2014, 08:46 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
Gotta get a good 1400 mm span outline of a Batman bat symbol...
The rest will be easy.
That will be a neet Build

Originally Posted by DEG View Post
Will this do you?? Should print out full size or if you'd like, I can tile it for you.......
Thank you DEG for helping out

Originally Posted by Wrongway-Feldman View Post
I'm in. Been toying with the idea of scratch building a Beech Starship twin pusher.
May even attempt the variable pitch cannard.
Looking forwards to seeing this build, Sounds like a Cool Build

I may be getting Older, But I Refuse to grow Up I am Having to much Fun to Grow Up LOL
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Old 04-15-2014, 08:52 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by fhhuber
Gotta get a good 1400 mm span outline of a Batman bat symbol...
The rest will be easy.
Originally Posted by DEG View Post
Will this do you?? Should print out full size or if you'd like, I can tile it for you.......
Should work.

Going to be REALLY simple from pink foam and stuff I have laying around. Estimated cost of $20 (stuff I need to buy) + the scavenged hardware, electronics and EDFs.

And I don't do hand launch.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:04 PM   #16
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I may be getting Older, But I Refuse to grow Up I am Having to much Fun to Grow Up LOL
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Old 04-16-2014, 07:49 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
Should work.

Going to be REALLY simple from pink foam and stuff I have laying around. Estimated cost of $20 (stuff I need to buy) + the scavenged hardware, electronics and EDFs.

And I don't do hand launch.
Interested ... guy I knew built a Batman model years ago ... and it was single tractor prop...

Interested how you will power it ? As a twin ?

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Old 04-17-2014, 11:23 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
Interested ... guy I knew built a Batman model years ago ... and it was single tractor prop...

Interested how you will power it ? As a twin ?

Nigel
Me Too This will be a interesting build

I may be getting Older, But I Refuse to grow Up I am Having to much Fun to Grow Up LOL
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Old 04-17-2014, 06:16 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
And pray what is that ? Teasing us ??

Nigel
I was thinking a JU EF112. I found it on the Luft 46 web page awhile back and it caught my eye. I've been playing around with it in CAD for awhile making plans for a balsa build. That might come up costing more than the $100 allowed for this build, and require a lot more time.

I have plenty of foam and electronics already laying around so some modifications on the plans, and I think I should be able to build it under the limits set.

I have to finish another project first though.

Cheesy poofs are what Yankees get when they eat Southen Food!! bub, steve
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Old 04-17-2014, 08:20 PM   #20
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My plan is pure simplicity...

Twin 70 mm EDFs (because I have them)

Foam batman symbol with some added bits for fuselage and verticals

1/4 inch fiberglass rod (bike pennant) for the main spar.

Play with a smaller flat plate glider to determine starting CG.

Off we go...
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:23 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by offtom View Post
I was thinking a JU EF112. I found it on the Luft 46 web page awhile back and it caught my eye.
There you go making me look stuff up on google again......

I'm either going to get good at flying em, or get good at fixin em!
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:25 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by BroncoSquid View Post
There you go making me look stuff up on google again......
Looks like a low wing C-337...
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Old 04-18-2014, 03:00 AM   #23
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Seems everyone around that time was experimenting with Push - Pull variants ... taking basically airframes and joining together ...

Very few designs of such about today ... apart from Chellie's choice - the Cessna.

I would imagine that the efficiency of the rear motor would be compromised unless careful choice of pitch / rpm to take advantage of air flow from front prop. OK with a model - that's not a real concern - but on full size - I reckon it would be a serious matter.

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Old 04-18-2014, 05:07 PM   #24
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So is the $100 limit for the final build only, or does that include any prototypes and design tests? Seeing as there is not much info and no plans for my build I can see myself going through some test variations getting the incidence of the cannard and main wing just right. Not to mention the cg.
Also sticking to DT foam board. Its all I can afford right now. Lol

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Old 04-18-2014, 07:35 PM   #25
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Incidence of main wing to canard... generally start at +3 to +5 deg on the Canard relative to the main wing. That virtually guarantees the canard stalls before the main wing making the classic nose-drop and self recovery stall cycle of a canard design.
If you don't want to guarantee that cycle you can have them at the same incidence.

Canard CG is also very predictable. You want oz/sq in loading to the the same for both the canard surface and the main wing. That turns it into finding MAC, estimating center of pressure (use 30% MAC) and then using a balance beam calculation to find where CG belongs.
A * B = distance between the 30% MAC of Canard and 30% MAC of main wing
X = Canard area
Y = Main wing area
AX = BY
X = distance behind the Canard 30% MAC line where the model should balance. (often very close to the leading edge of the main wing... if there is no sweep.)
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