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Old 01-21-2015, 11:55 AM   #1
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good grief, I had no idea finding metric drill bits would be such a PITA. Well, I do live in East BugSplat, NC which lacks shopping venues. Downtown old timey hardware store and Lowes are it and they didn't have metric bits. Amazon is my friend, bits inna mail.

Why metric? Decades ago when I flew CL, competition FF, and later RC, I discover the ol' clse only counts in hand grenades and horseshoes rule applys to propellers. Yes indeed, when you need a prop tp to be spin true and balanced at a gazillion RPM ou must drill the prop hole to match the shaft with precision. No sloppy fits.
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Old 01-21-2015, 12:13 PM   #2
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Old 01-21-2015, 12:26 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by carpetbagger View Post
good grief, I had no idea finding metric drill bits would be such a PITA. Well, I do live in East BugSplat, NC which lacks shopping venues. Downtown old timey hardware store and Lowes are it and they didn't have metric bits. Amazon is my friend, bits inna mail.

Why metric? Decades ago when I flew CL, competition FF, and later RC, I discover the ol' clse only counts in hand grenades and horseshoes rule applys to propellers. Yes indeed, when you need a prop tp to be spin true and balanced at a gazillion RPM ou must drill the prop hole to match the shaft with precision. No sloppy fits.
I hear you $5.99 metric drill set 19 pieces, I am going to buy a set too

http://www.agrisupply.com/product.as...FQphfgod8TMA1w


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Old 01-21-2015, 01:23 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by carpetbagger View Post
.............. Yes indeed, when you need a prop tp to be spin true and balanced at a gazillion RPM ou must drill the prop hole to match the shaft with precision. No sloppy fits.
Please do not use a drill to make your prop shaft hole ... It's the quickest way to ruin a prop .... even with a Pillar Press drill stand - you cannot guarantee the hole drilled.

What you need is one of these - a tapered Carbon Steel hardened reamer :

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Tapered-Re...item5b0af59a2e

[img]
[/img]

With careful use these will create exact matching shaft hole enlargement and centred exact.

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Old 01-21-2015, 01:33 PM   #5
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$5.99 for 19, that's a deal! I have 8 coming, 3mm - 10mm, no fancy holder, about twice $5.99. Some kind of hot lick Austrian company makes them. Amazon Prime so I get free 2 day shipping. Now I can have a snug prop fit on the 5mm and 7mm spinner collets and all the other metric motor shafts in my hanger.
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Old 01-21-2015, 01:47 PM   #6
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Nigel - two problems with the reamer. I don't do eBay (paypal suckage) and I don't do tapered reamers. Back in the day I had 4-step straight reamer for imperial size shafts which was cool, and I recall working on home built aircraft where FAA required perfectly sized straight reamers for critical holes.

Never had a problem drilling prop shaft holes to size. I use good quality drill bits and "shave" my way to finish dimension by stepping up drill size til I get where I want to be. Slap it on the balancer and give it a spin = no wiggle.
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Old 01-21-2015, 03:34 PM   #7
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No problem ...

I just have a box with dud props in from my silly days of drilling ...

Just a comment - regarding stepped or tapered ... with model props using shaft ring adaptors ... APC themselves putting out literature about reaming and which side to do it from etc. etc. - bit academic isn't it ?

Personally I prefer the tapered - because of the slight variance found in shafts and the need to account for that. Lets be honest - at end of day the shaft hole is NOT the thrust bearing factor - its the centering factor only. The real meat of the prop fixture is the wound up against the back thrust plate.

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Old 01-21-2015, 06:27 PM   #8
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I stick to dedicated prop reamers myself. Tower Hobbies prop reamers

Though Nigel makes a good point about tapering. Sometimes my props are really tight on the shafts. Too tight!
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Old 01-21-2015, 09:19 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by carpetbagger View Post
good grief, I had no idea finding metric drill bits would be such a PITA. Well, I do live in East BugSplat, NC which lacks shopping venues. Downtown old timey hardware store and Lowes are it and they didn't have metric bits. Amazon is my friend, bits inna mail.

Why metric? Decades ago when I flew CL, competition FF, and later RC, I discover the ol' clse only counts in hand grenades and horseshoes rule applys to propellers. Yes indeed, when you need a prop tp to be spin true and balanced at a gazillion RPM ou must drill the prop hole to match the shaft with precision. No sloppy fits.
Grizzly also has metric drill bits. Here is their "quality" bits versus another Grizzly set for $14 or so.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Metr...-25-pc-/T26516

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Metr...-25-pc-/T26515

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Old 01-21-2015, 10:02 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by xmech2k View Post
I stick to dedicated prop reamers myself. Tower Hobbies prop reamers

Though Nigel makes a good point about tapering. Sometimes my props are really tight on the shafts. Too tight!
Tks X ...

That tight fit - one turn of my taper jobbie and it's a perfect slide on fit.

Ever over done a prop ? Or want to fit a previous reamed prop to a smaller shaft ? Easy ... my taper jobbie will open it up to take a prop shaft adaptor ring ... Most rings are NOT a standard shaft size on the OUTER diameter. So the prop to take it needs to be reamed to fit.

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Old 01-22-2015, 05:36 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by carpetbagger View Post
Nigel - two problems with the reamer. I don't do eBay (paypal suckage) and I don't do tapered reamers. Back in the day I had 4-step straight reamer for imperial size shafts which was cool, and I recall working on home built aircraft where FAA required perfectly sized straight reamers for critical holes.

Never had a problem drilling prop shaft holes to size. I use good quality drill bits and "shave" my way to finish dimension by stepping up drill size til I get where I want to be. Slap it on the balancer and give it a spin = no wiggle.
Exactly, patience does wonders, using every available bit size as you go. I've found with softer plastics like GWS props that reversing the rotation direction and milling down a short depth before drilling clockwise helps also, as it starts the boring process concentric versus having the bit "bite" first at one spot, which tends to take the hole a hair off center.
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Old 01-22-2015, 05:58 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Bill G View Post
Exactly, patience does wonders, using every available bit size as you go. I've found with softer plastics like GWS props that reversing the rotation direction and milling down a short depth before drilling clockwise helps also, as it starts the boring process concentric versus having the bit "bite" first at one spot, which tends to take the hole a hair off center.
Add to that, one of those desktop drill presses is far better than a hand held drill.

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Old 01-22-2015, 09:32 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
Add to that, one of those desktop drill presses is far better than a hand held drill.
My former hobby den had all the drill presses and jigsaws etc. I still had holes go off centre with the press. To be accurate and not have deflection - I had to bury the drill so deep up into the drill chuck that as short a possible bit protruded.
I had to have a centre post fitted to the base plate to align the bedplate vice and prop before drilling.

Sorry but for me - I have my reamer that does the job in seconds that took minutes of careful setup to try and achieve with a drill.
i have a box of ruined props from drills and NONE from my reamer.

I can't even 'fix' the drilled ones - I've tried with press drill to oversize and insert shaft ring ... but the drill keeps deflecting even on the large glow props .....

Each to their own ...

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Old 01-22-2015, 03:37 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
My former hobby den had all the drill presses and jigsaws etc. I still had holes go off centre with the press. To be accurate and not have deflection - I had to bury the drill so deep up into the drill chuck that as short a possible bit protruded.
I had to have a centre post fitted to the base plate to align the bedplate vice and prop before drilling.

Sorry but for me - I have my reamer that does the job in seconds that took minutes of careful setup to try and achieve with a drill.
i have a box of ruined props from drills and NONE from my reamer.

I can't even 'fix' the drilled ones - I've tried with press drill to oversize and insert shaft ring ... but the drill keeps deflecting even on the large glow props .....

Each to their own ...

Cheers
Nigel
Perhaps a reamer in your drill press?

I've used those step drills which work really well.

Got all available sizes from Harbor Freight.

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Old 01-22-2015, 04:58 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
Perhaps a reamer in your drill press?

I've used those step drills which work really well.

Got all available sizes from Harbor Freight.
I actually plan to fit a new Pillar Drill to my hobby den ... and a lathe.

the idea is my den will be converted to the machine room and models will be done in another.

It will contain my Laser Cutter, Bench circular saw, Jigsaw, Pillar Drill, Lathe etc.

A long term project. I intend to stop my present work and go into own lines at home as well as consultancy to Oil and Shipping Co's.

As to what to fit to the pillar drill to correct the props ... I think a router bit such as used in Dremels or similar would be better. The tapered reamer tends to be too long in length. A stepped reamer will follow the crap drill hole.
Of course if I had the Lathe - then that would solve it easily.

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Old 01-22-2015, 05:45 PM   #16
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a set of decent center drills will cure most, if not all, of drill bit wandering.
Do not "cheap out" on drill bits.

Cleveland, Alpha, Hertel, etc., good buys.
you don't really need anything other than HSS.
If you think you do - or know you do , then you would already know what to buy and avoid
center drills:
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=50&PMCTLG=00

this is what you make the initial "hole" with. then you change to your drill bit.
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Old 01-22-2015, 07:12 PM   #17
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Sorry ... not being awkward - but I don't see why ?

A prop comes with a centred hole already from factory. My tapered reamer sits nicely in that hole and without any fancy drill press or gear - just my crinkly aged hand will produce a still centred enlarged hole in a few seconds ... check balance ... slide on shaft and do up prop nut. I'd probably have the prop on that shaft before you finish with your 'centre drills and stepping up sizes to final' ....

I really don't get it ... sorry. I paid about $12 incl. shipping for my hardened steel carpenters reamer ... but if I lived as most of you guys in better stocked town - I could have bought over local counter ...

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Old 01-22-2015, 07:16 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
Sorry ... not being awkward - but I don't see why ?

A prop comes with a centred hole already from factory. My tapered reamer sits nicely in that hole and without any fancy drill press or gear - just my crinkly aged hand will produce a still centred enlarged hole in a few seconds ... check balance ... slide on shaft and do up prop nut. I'd probably have the prop on that shaft before you finish with your 'centre drills and stepping up sizes to final' ....

I really don't get it ... sorry. I paid about $12 incl. shipping for my hardened steel carpenters reamer ... but if I lived as most of you guys in better stocked town - I could have bought over local counter ...

Nigel
Yeah
A reamer is "Self Centering" versus a drill bit that can and will get off center. Which is why it's wise to drill through the prop multiple times with slight increases in bit size.

Reminds me of long ago at work where we had a very critical hole drilled through a piece of steel. The breaker mechanism put 1200 pounds of spring force on that 3 in by 3 in by 1 in hardened steel block. It had to be drilled and reamed to 0.0005 tolerances. The production line ran into problems with this steel piece, part of a tripout latch on a big circuit breaker.

Didn't take long to find out that the precision reamer was drilling oval shaped holes.

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Old 01-22-2015, 07:31 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by carpetbagger View Post
good grief, I had no idea finding metric drill bits would be such a PITA. Well, I do live in East BugSplat, NC which lacks shopping venues. Downtown old timey hardware store and Lowes are it and they didn't have metric bits. Amazon is my friend, bits inna mail.

Why metric? Decades ago when I flew CL, competition FF, and later RC, I discover the ol' clse only counts in hand grenades and horseshoes rule applys to propellers. Yes indeed, when you need a prop tp to be spin true and balanced at a gazillion RPM ou must drill the prop hole to match the shaft with precision. No sloppy fits.
My good old 1970s USA prop reemer was good for 30 years but i had to buy a metric one not that long ago ,guess wiitch reemer was made better ? lmao You guys in the UK dont count but i bet your 20 year old metric one is better than the new ones also. Thanks China ! lol
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Old 01-22-2015, 07:41 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by road king 97 View Post
My good old 1970s USA prop reemer was good for 30 years but i had to buy a metric one not that long ago ,guess wiitch reemer was made better ? lmao You guys in the UK dont count but i bet your 20 year old metric one is better than the new ones also. Thanks China ! lol
I have two reamers ... one chinese with a nice fancy screw on cover that doubles as handle when screwed on other end .. useless after a few props. The metal edge is so soft ... so now it's my plan 'pricker' for marking out foam under scratchbuilds.

My reamer that is hardened steel is from UK cabinet maker supplier ... proper tools for proper jobs ! That reamer is so damn hard it cuts anything ... in fact I have to be careful not to put any weight into using it. Just easy easy with it ...
I reckon that baby is going to last many years before I even think about replacing it.
Price ? Same as the Chinese job actually !! But without the fancy handle etc.

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Old 01-22-2015, 10:13 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
I have two reamers ... one chinese with a nice fancy screw on cover that doubles as handle when screwed on other end .. useless after a few props. The metal edge is so soft ... so now it's my plan 'pricker' for marking out foam under scratchbuilds.

My reamer that is hardened steel is from UK cabinet maker supplier ... proper tools for proper jobs ! That reamer is so damn hard it cuts anything ... in fact I have to be careful not to put any weight into using it. Just easy easy with it ...
I reckon that baby is going to last many years before I even think about replacing it.
Price ? Same as the Chinese job actually !! But without the fancy handle etc.

nigel
I buy my drill bits at garage sales and flea markets ,most are older drill bits that were made with good stuff . My old cast iron drill press i bought at a auction near Midway Airport for a 100 bucks and it had American Airlines stamped on it . I was wondering why not to many guys were bidding on it till i tried to lift it and get it down in my basement. lmao joe
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Old 01-23-2015, 01:09 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by road king 97 View Post
I was wondering why not to many guys were bidding on it till i tried to lift it and get it down in my basement. lmao joe
Picked up a Craftsman metal lathe some 15 years ago for $100. This lathe can swing a 12 inch diameter item over the lathe bed. The lathe has worked out very well, and gotten a lot of use. But, it had to be disassembled when we moved 10 years ago. Weighing all the parts, this thing weighed in at some 400 pounds.

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Old 01-23-2015, 06:44 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
Picked up a Craftsman metal lathe some 15 years ago for $100. This lathe can swing a 12 inch diameter item over the lathe bed. The lathe has worked out very well, and gotten a lot of use. But, it had to be disassembled when we moved 10 years ago. Weighing all the parts, this thing weighed in at some 400 pounds.
When I lived in Tallinn ... I bought a Multi-Gym .... had visions of my using it everyday !
Got it into apartment and put it together .... fine.

Year later moved back home to Ventspils and had to move it .... THEN realised how darned heavy that thing really was !!

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Old 01-23-2015, 05:08 PM   #24
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Mine had a 1950s date on it ,goes to show you they dont make tools to last like they use to . My grown kids will get it and other well made tools i own when iam gone and their kids my grandkids will get them later i hope . Just hope who ever gets them they dont use it for a coat hanger and use the darn thing to build stuff . joe
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Old 01-23-2015, 06:27 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by road king 97 View Post
Mine had a 1950s date on it ,goes to show you they dont make tools to last like they use to . My grown kids will get it and other well made tools i own when iam gone and their kids my grandkids will get them later i hope . Just hope who ever gets them they dont use it for a coat hanger and use the darn thing to build stuff . joe
I've had builders on and off at my house for last 9 - 10 yrs and I've lost count of the hand electric gear they gone through. Doesn't seem to matter what make or price either. There really is no quality in any now. Even non-powered tools ...

One time I could buy a chainsaw chain and it would last ages before even hint of sharpening needed ... but now ? I have Stihl and Husqvarna as well as Jonsered gear ... all the same. There really is no difference with the cheap Chinese stuff now ...

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