Wattflyer RC Network: RC Universe :: RCU Magazine :: RCU Forums :: RCU Classifieds :: RCU User Reviews :: RCU YouTube
Home Who's Online Calendar Today's Posts RealTime Post Spy Mark Forums Read
Go Back   WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight > Electric R/C Airplanes > ParkFlyers
Register Members List Wattflyer Extras Articles Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Social Groups

ParkFlyers Talk about all backyard and parkflyer aircraft here

Thank you for your support (hide ads)
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-22-2013, 11:17 PM   #1
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default Park sized "Fun Cub" ? ( Graupner Stinson Voyager )

I have a Park250 2200kv 55W outrunner and rest of electrics that I'm not using.
I'd like to have something like a Multiplex Fun Cub, but smaller. I'd set it up as a bush plane.
Tough and inexpensive would be ideal.
Help with finding an airframe ?
I thought I had a candidate in the HK J3 for $35 but the reviews don't look good (tail heavy).
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dproduct=16341
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2013, 01:36 AM   #2
fhhuber
Super Contributor
 
fhhuber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,086
Thanked 209 Times in 200 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (1)
Default

Tail heavy is usually the fault of the person setting up a plane that came as an ARF or kit.

It might require a little effort with some to be able to move equipment to get the CG correct but its certainly possible on a foamie ARF such as the one from Hobby King.
Its just hard to go wrong with a foamie cub as long as CG is correct, weight is reasonable and you have sufficient power.

Even the Harbor Freight Cub will fly fine if you just put a decent RX in it. The TX and RX that come with it are trash.

I can easily believe HK to have recommended an inadequate motor... I never believe their recommendations for equipment.
fhhuber is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2013, 01:45 AM   #3
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Well I haven't found any other options.
Do you think it might be worth putting my gear in that plane ?
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2013, 02:32 AM   #4
fhhuber
Super Contributor
 
fhhuber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,086
Thanked 209 Times in 200 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (1)
Default

Not familiar enough with that plane or your motor to know if they are a good match.

The wrong motor will make any aircraft unpleasant to fly... or potentially even unflyable.
fhhuber is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2014, 01:39 PM   #5
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default Graupner Stinson Voyager

Well I stumbled onto a Graupner Stinson Voyager at Graves RC.
It might have been the last one out there ? Got it yesterday.

http://www.gravesrc.com/ProductDetai...R6252&CartID=1

https://shop.graupner.de/webuerp/ser...11&language=en

I'm a bit of a newb, and more of a BNF/PNP guy, so this will be a challenge.
Not sure which glue is best for this foam. I think I should add main wing struts ?
I hope to put tundra tires on it and would also like to get/make floats for it (mainly for snow). Maybe even cut in some flaps ?
The motor bay is designed for a Speed 300 can, so I guess I'll have to rig a motor mount for my Park250 BL outrunner and try to keep the CG where it needs to be.
Any tips/advice appreciated !
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2014, 03:41 PM   #6
solentlife
Super Contributor
 
solentlife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Ex UK Brit now in Latvia west coast - Ventspils
Posts: 5,905
View solentlife's Gallery47
Thanked 231 Times in 228 Posts
Club: Founder Member Ventspils RC Club. Ex Waltham Chase and Meon Valley Soaring.
Awards Showcase

Scratchbuilders Award  Scratchbuilders Award  Outstanding Contributor Award  125mph Speed Demon 
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (15)
Default

Tips ?

Keep it simple and I'd leave of the floats and flaps until you are sure it flies and has the power to cope with extras.

Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
- Subscribe my Youtube: "solentlifeuk"
solentlife is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2014, 04:02 PM   #7
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Makes sense. Getting ahead of myself/too excited.
Thanks.
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2014, 05:31 AM   #8
JDMJim
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Illinois
Posts: 132
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Buy a MPX Funman
JDMJim is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2014, 12:27 PM   #9
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Originally Posted by JDMJim View Post
Buy a MPX Funman
The FunMan and FunCub are just what I'm looking for except that a 30" wing span is much more portable so here I am with the Graupner Stinson.
Hopefully I can keep it healthy for a while as it's discontinued and I haven't seen much for parts available. I haven't started the build yet.
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2014, 02:35 PM   #10
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Still debating on the motor for this.
The cowl is hollowed out/formed for a 24.4mm diam. brushed can Speed 300 to be glued in. I believe the side/down thrust is molded/built in.
I think I’d like to use the brushless Park250 2200kv “bell” motor (22mm diam bell) I have.
I’m thinking I would rig a 24.4mm +/- “tube mount” for the bell motor that I’d glue in the mold for the Speed 300 can and that would automatically give me the side and down thrust as designed into it. Make sense ?
It seems like it would work but I’m also wondering if the Park250 2200kv is enough motor. Should I have a lower kv ? Just looking for scale/sport power.
I could enlarge the cowl opening for a larger bell motor, if needed.
WWYD ?
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2014, 06:01 PM   #11
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,169
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

Originally Posted by Brian VT View Post
Still debating on the motor for this.
The cowl is hollowed out/formed for a 24.4mm diam. brushed can Speed 300 to be glued in. I believe the side/down thrust is molded/built in.
I think I’d like to use the brushless Park250 2200kv “bell” motor (22mm diam bell) I have.
I’m thinking I would rig a 24.4mm +/- “tube mount” for the bell motor that I’d glue in the mold for the Speed 300 can and that would automatically give me the side and down thrust as designed into it. Make sense ?
It seems like it would work but I’m also wondering if the Park250 2200kv is enough motor. Should I have a lower kv ? Just looking for scale/sport power.
I could enlarge the cowl opening for a larger bell motor, if needed.
WWYD ?
The weight of the plane is stating 30oz...seems to be a misprint. If it is 12oz with a 7 cell, it would be around 10, maybe less, with a 2 cell. I would say a Park 300 would be better, it's always better to have more power than needed, rather than never enough power, at least that is what I feel. You would have to go through more trouble mounting, but I would personally go through the trouble of doing that. As you already have the 250, maybe going to the smaller Hobbyking Mini J3 would be a better choice, as well as cheaper. As Nigel stated, you have to keep it simple, for the 250 could be borderline power for the larger plane.

Basing it off the Tuff Trainer I once had, the weight and size is similar (other than the exaggerated wingspan). The Tuff Trainer was using a 2822 motor, or something along those lines, with 3s power. That gave it ample power for anything. While you would be getting more RPM out of the Park 250, it will prefer a smaller prop, probably 6-7 inches, and if the weight is not kept down, heat will build up fast on the Graupner. With the Hobbyking, it is smaller plane, and thus will not push the motor as much, and I feel it would be much more suited to a 6 inch prop. Even looking at the motor that is with the cub, it is roughly the same as the 250, though less kV.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2014, 02:53 PM   #12
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Good stuff. Thanks.
Yeah, Graves' site is a misprint. Graupner site says 330g.

Well I think I'm gonna use the guts from my Edge 540QQ that I've been scared to fly due to my lack of skills and maybe sell that airframe or store it for when I'm more confident.
It's a Park 280/1800kv on 3S. It has a 6.8x3 prop. on it but I'll probably start out with a 6x4 since the motor shaft is only @ 4 1/2" from the ground (even after I added bush wheels). Or maybe try a 5" or 6" 3-blade.
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2014, 03:27 AM   #13
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

I took the Park 280 from the 540QQ. I glued the motor's X mount to the the face of a tube (plastic electrical conduit). The tube is a bit smaller than the channel for the stock motor. I'll wrap the tube with double-sided tape and the fit is then perfect. The 22mm motor has good side clearance too. The other motors I had considered would have required enlarging the cowl opening.







Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2014, 03:04 AM   #14
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

I'm getting there. :o Looking for some opinions on motor location.
I like the look of having the front of the motor flush to the front of the cowl but then it looks to me like the prop. is too far away from the cowl.
If I slide the motor back to have the prop. closer to the cowl then I have a hole/gap back to the motor.
Which do you think looks better ?

Fore:




Aft:


Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2014, 03:30 AM   #15
Turner
Super Contributor
 
Turner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 1,346
Thanked 130 Times in 128 Posts
iTrader: (1)
Friends: (3)
Default

Can you reduce the distance between the motor and prop? Maybe shorten the shaft or use a different prop adapter?
Turner is online now  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2014, 03:32 AM   #16
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,169
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

The motor further back looks better to me, although you should maybe think of cg, further forward will help tail heaviness without more weight.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2014, 12:56 PM   #17
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Thanks for the replies.
I don't see any way to shorten the shaft, unfortunately.
CG is certainly the main concern but I wanted to ask opinions on appearance 1st.
The only spec. I have for cg is to not fly with it more than 50mm and it's pretty close to that now with a 3S/800mah lipo. Maybe I can get away with moving the motor aft if I add a prop spinner or maybe I can get away with a 3S/500mah or even go to 2S ?
Many unknown variables will make for a nervous maiden flight.
Any more advice is always appreciated.
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2014, 02:16 PM   #18
Turner
Super Contributor
 
Turner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 1,346
Thanked 130 Times in 128 Posts
iTrader: (1)
Friends: (3)
Default

You really won't notice the prop to cowl distance once in the air. I would mount it forward, especially if that helps get the CG right.
Turner is online now  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2014, 03:43 PM   #19
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,169
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

Originally Posted by Turner View Post
You really won't notice the prop to cowl distance once in the air. I would mount it forward, especially if that helps get the CG right.
I agree. While it looks better on the ground with the prop further, it is better to have it further forward and possibly have it a tad nose heavy, which will be easier to fly. It you want to perfect balance, with no nose heaviness, you can easily move the battery back, or add a tiny weight on the tail.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2014, 02:16 PM   #20
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Well it looks done and I thought I'd be done tonight.
I made up some wing struts with wire through coffee stirrers.
I wasn't happy having to take the wing off to stuff the lipo into the fuse amongst all the other guts and not being able to use it to adjust the cg so I rigged a "cargo box" under the belly to hide the lipo there. It was a plastic package that pop rivets came in. I think it fits okay with the "bush plane" look.
I thought I was done until I realized that I should have cut free and hinged the control surfaces. They are already failing. I guess that's my next project before the maiden flight.





Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2014, 03:39 PM   #21
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,169
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

Originally Posted by Brian VT View Post
Well it looks done and I thought I'd be done tonight.
I made up some wing struts with wire through coffee stirrers.
I wasn't happy having to take the wing off to stuff the lipo into the fuse amongst all the other guts and not being able to use it to adjust the cg so I rigged a "cargo box" under the belly to hide the lipo there. It was a plastic package that pop rivets came in. I think it fits okay with the "bush plane" look.
I thought I was done until I realized that I should have cut free and hinged the control surfaces. They are already failing. I guess that's my next project before the maiden flight.





Looks good, I was thinking maybe painting black windows would improve realism. Of course it doesn't matter when flying, but when sitting there, it would look better. Also, maybe "rubber" tires and rims.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2014, 07:10 PM   #22
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

Thanks. I agree that the blue windshield looks odd. Those are stickers that came with it. I'm scared to try black marker on it in case it doesn't "take" and ends up looking worse.

Seems confusing that you quoted my last post and we have to scroll through the pics twice to get down to here.
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2014, 03:20 PM   #23
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

I used Blenderm tape on the ailerons and elevator. I used 2 micro pin hinges on the rudder because there's very little space at the bottom to attach tape.
Ready for maiden and, of course, the wind has been 15mph+ since.
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2014, 07:30 PM   #24
Brian VT
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 31
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (0)
Default

She flies.
I had a friend maiden her today. It did well but needed just a bit of weight in the nose. I'm gonna move the battery/cargo box forward a bit. The wheels rolled fine on a snowy dirt road. 2 perfect takeoffs and landings. I think this is just the plane I was hoping for. A little dihedral is probably the only thing that it would need to be perfect for my present skill level (about a dozen flights with 4ch.).
I hope to have the cargo box moved in time to fly it before dark today.
So...it's got the electrics from an Edge 540QQ, an APC 6x4 E prop., and Nano-Tech 3S/950mah/25-50C lipo.
Brian VT is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2014, 05:11 AM   #25
thepiper92
Warbird Fanatic
 
thepiper92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 1,169
Thanked 24 Times in 23 Posts
iTrader: (0)
Friends: (4)
Default

Originally Posted by Brian VT View Post
She flies.
I had a friend maiden her today. It did well but needed just a bit of weight in the nose. I'm gonna move the battery/cargo box forward a bit. The wheels rolled fine on a snowy dirt road. 2 perfect takeoffs and landings. I think this is just the plane I was hoping for. A little dihedral is probably the only thing that it would need to be perfect for my present skill level (about a dozen flights with 4ch.).
I hope to have the cargo box moved in time to fly it before dark today.
So...it's got the electrics from an Edge 540QQ, an APC 6x4 E prop., and Nano-Tech 3S/950mah/25-50C lipo.
I personally found dihedral annoying, at least on a high wing. I dislike the self correcting. If you flown it fine without crashing, then I see no reason why you'd want dihedral really. Also with dihedral, ailerons don't seem as effective, for the battle against the planes tendency to level. Thats how I feel at least.
thepiper92 is offline  
  Reply With Quote
Reply

  WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight > Electric R/C Airplanes > ParkFlyers

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
T28 Trojan JoeTheFlyer ParkFlyers 1238 07-27-2014 02:30 AM
Park 480 and various prop sizes. Uncle Nutsy Power Systems 20 09-03-2013 07:03 PM
My PPP - park flyers purchasing progression pianodood ParkFlyers 10 09-10-2012 03:57 PM
Slow Stick with a Park 480!??! Mad Joe ParkFlyers 21 02-24-2012 04:22 PM
Spektrum park flyer receivers NJSwede RC Radios, Transmitters, Receivers, Servos, gyros 9 03-02-2011 08:12 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:08 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005 WattfFlyer.com
RCU Eflight HQ

Charities we support Select: Yorkie Rescue  ::  Crohn's & Colitis Foundation



Page generated in 0.65064 seconds with 69 queries