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Old 11-24-2013, 09:06 AM   #1
nz builder
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Default What aileron trainer is the best?

Im keen on getting myself a 4 channel plane as Ive mastered elevator rudder planes. I was looking at a Trojan (either FMS, Parkzone) but would be happy with a high wing plane if it has ailerons. Any suggestions would be great people.
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Old 11-24-2013, 09:32 AM   #2
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I prefer the Parkzone T-28, but the Ultra Micro due to its slower speed and light weight. You will crash, so you may want one that crashes well.

GB
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Old 11-24-2013, 12:04 PM   #3
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There is no single best choice. There are several that have proven to be good choices for different people but bad choices for others and that includes the T-28s in their assorted sizes.

The ultra micro can be good if you have predictable weather conditions that commonly allow you to fly it outdoors or an adequate location to fly it indoors. We can't reasonably expect the outdoor flying conditions needed around where I live.

THe larger versions can tolerate variable winds better and they can handle higher average wind speed, but they require more room to fly.

The Dynam Tiger Moth is a good choice for many people. Its slower and a little less responsive than the similar sized Trojans. It is also more stable.

Piper Cubs tend to do really well. Dynam has a 4-channel Cub in the same series as the Tiger Moth. I have several planes from that series, but not the Cub (yet). It should be more stable than the Tiger Moth.

For over 20 years the most recommended trainers were the PT-40 and replicas of that very old design. There are still a lot of great models available that show this heritage. This includes the E-Flite Apprentice.

There are literally hundreds of good choices out there.
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Old 11-24-2013, 12:28 PM   #4
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The question is what RET trainer do you have now ?

I had great success with student flyers years ago when I showed them how to modify their existing RET trainers to 4 ch.

The familiarity of the model in the air ... the comfort zone helped the transition a lot.

Here's a video taken by Cine 8mm back in 1980's ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0CBjJjzYu0

After the sport scale D7 ... there is a trainer so modified - showing that it will do just about anything you want ... you can see in the video that the dihedral is still there ... All I did was add strip ailerons to it ...

Yes - the handsome geezer with the Nieuport is me - many years ago !!


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Old 11-24-2013, 05:29 PM   #5
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My flying buddy learned on a Seagull Innovator. It's a basic trainer but has ailerons and it quite aerobatic if you want it to be. He has the PZ T-28 too, and that's also a nice model, but the Innovator is better to fly IMHO.

But each will have his own preferences.
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Old 11-24-2013, 09:59 PM   #6
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Your request for suggestions is limited.
Do you want to build ? Do you want ARF ? Do you want wood w/plastic covering ? Do you want foam ? Do you want Big or Small ? What wingspan ? Electric or gas ?
There is a lot out there and it is difficult to suggest the "just right" airplane, for you, unless more info is presented.
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Old 11-24-2013, 10:11 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by nz builder View Post
Im keen on getting myself a 4 channel plane as Ive mastered elevator rudder planes. I was looking at a Trojan (either FMS, Parkzone) but would be happy with a high wing plane if it has ailerons. Any suggestions would be great people.
GWS E-Starter is my choice, had one for 7-years and still luv it , their on sale dirt cheap at Heads Up RC , floats are only 10 buck's ,
http://www.headsuphobby.com/GWS-ESTA...y-GWS105-B.htm

bubsteve


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Old 11-25-2013, 05:14 AM   #8
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Thanks for all the great suggestions. Im looking for a bind and fly type plane and something that can take a few heavy landings. Im not keen to have a plane that can appear as a dot within seconds. The trainer that I had was a micro 3 channel similar to the Champ.
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:39 AM   #9
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I have a pz t-28 and a maxthrust riot, both are meant to be'trainers.' However, the riot is much easier to fly, more stable, yet you can do a lot of aerobatics. Its also better quality in terms of strength and build.....
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Old 11-25-2013, 08:09 AM   #10
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The Riot looks great, maybe a bit on the high side of my budget.
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Old 11-25-2013, 10:29 AM   #11
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The ultimate follow on model is the WOT4 ... but this is a UK model that for some strange reason never made it across the water. There is now the WOT4e .. an electric version that owes it's pedigree to the original glow WOT4.
So if you get the WOT4e ... then go for it - it will do everything you can ask and more.

But if you want scale looks - and lets be honest Foam has brough that even to beginners models ....
Then the Skyartec 182 is a good candidate. Hobby King do it as the 182 Deluxe ...

I bought one thinking it would be a typical sunday sport job ... how wrong I was ...

It can fly slow or be as agile as you want ... it suits less and most experienced pilots ...

Here's a vid of it doing it's thing : (All stock out of box !)


And here on a rough field site :


It may be a Cessna ... but there must be a reason for all the Cessna models out there ... it's successful not only in full size - but also in model.

Back-up is good with dealers in USA and UK to service for spare parts ... plus the excellent service provided by Skyartec factory direct.

Hobby King sells parts and the whole as RTF or ARF - its the Deluxe 182 with flaps ... about $50 ARF ... $35 for kit ...

I've been flying RC for more years than I care to remember ... and this baby is one of my all-time favourites.

Nigel

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Old 11-26-2013, 03:37 AM   #12
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Yes ive been looking at Cessna types. Some of them look like value for money. I want one with fairly light wing loading if possible. The Skyartec plane looks good, Ive also seen that FMS do a similar one.
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Old 11-26-2013, 05:02 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by nz builder View Post
Yes ive been looking at Cessna types. Some of them look like value for money. I want one with fairly light wing loading if possible. The Skyartec plane looks good, Ive also seen that FMS do a similar one.
Pal I fly with has the FMS one ... flies well.

Both are very good.

Nigel

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Old 11-26-2013, 05:57 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by nz builder View Post
Im keen on getting myself a 4 channel plane as Ive mastered elevator rudder planes. I was looking at a Trojan (either FMS, Parkzone) but would be happy with a high wing plane if it has ailerons. Any suggestions would be great people.
Not cheap as a transmitter/receiver ready to go, but check this model out:
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXCKXB&P=ML

We found one without transmitter or receiver for about $140 or so.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXCKXD&P=7

I picked up one for the local EAA club that is sponsoring RC flying for some kids. This is a nicely powered model that does fly well. It will do loops and rolls and so on, but rolls are VERY slow. (For me anyhow!)

It can either be hand launched, or take off from very short grass. Take off on concrete was on the order of 20 feet or so.

Assembly is just snapping the various foam pieces together. Just be careful of the tail wheel connection to the rudder. This must be done in the proper order, or you've got the rudder installed, and no way to connect the tailwheel. (Don't ask. ) The wing struts are part of the strength of the wing structure. Don't fly without them.

IMHO, a good trainer.

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Old 11-26-2013, 09:14 AM   #15
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AW I love it! I never get sick of Piper Cubs. The yellow paint job can be seen a mile away! I need to find a distributor in New Zealand to buy that plane. A bit of homework to do.
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Old 11-26-2013, 11:11 AM   #16
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I built the HK laser cut kit ... cheap as chips ... but a real pain to build as the instructions are not for the inexperienced !

But she does look nice once 'dolled up' ...







Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
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Old 11-27-2013, 01:18 AM   #17
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Beautiful plane Nigel, I bet she flies as good as she looks. I was looking at more of a foamy as they are easier to glue back together. A foamy cub would be ideal.
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Old 11-27-2013, 04:38 AM   #18
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I really liked my alpha 450 sport. its a generic classic trainer scaled down. with a 48" wing span, it flew like a slow stick. full strip aleroins and lots of rudder throw made it a pretty nimble plane that was easy to get out of trouble with so coupling, it would even knife edge fairly well. I took many, many hard hits with it, only ever knocking the landing gear out once. I got probably 3-400 hours on that airframe alone.

but when I slowed it down, I could drag the tail with the main gear touching. it was almost impossible to stall. just my 2 cents.

slow stock prop reversal. it flies! easily! 543 watt dual motor bipe slow stick. push-me-pull-you. 242 watt 3 channel slow stick. 365 watt mini ultra stick. 415 watt mini contender. 810 watt ultra stick .25e. 220 watt alpha 450 sport (retired).
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Old 11-27-2013, 04:54 AM   #19
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I have experience with the T-28, loved it, crashed it, learned to fly it, and finally moved on. My new flying buddy just moved from a Super Cub to a T-28, and he's enjoying it as much as I did mine.

A pre-flight check is better than a post crash analysis
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Old 11-27-2013, 07:18 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by nz builder View Post
Beautiful plane Nigel, I bet she flies as good as she looks. I was looking at more of a foamy as they are easier to glue back together. A foamy cub would be ideal.
A right PITA to build .. and she has some quirks when flown ... but yes - I'm pretty chuffed with it.

Funny thing is - I stuffed the cowl and it's now taped up and needs replacement. I contacted the factory who produce the kit - they replied literally immediately and apologised that they do not do separate parts - BUT offered to send me one ... problem was price once shipping added ...
They were very friendly and cared about image ... asking how I found the model ... any problems etc.
For a $25 kit - I found that amazing.

Nigel

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Old 11-27-2013, 04:17 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by nz builder View Post
Ive mastered elevator rudder planes.
I cringe when I read that about any plane. Can you pop off some rolling circles for me? How about some 3D flight? I'm a firm believer than nobody has ever mastered any plane. Somebody will always do something above your ability to perform, no matter how good you are. And they would be the first to tell you that they have not mastered the plane.

I'd consider a Multiplex Fun Cub or Fun Man. Tundra tires, good aerobatic ability with knife edge possible in the Fun Cub and probably Fun Man as well, tremendous speed range, great quality.
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Old 11-27-2013, 05:38 PM   #22
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I bypassed the Elevator Rudder step and spent more time on the SIM. I then found a barely used Glassair, quickly got bored with that and went to a PZ T-28. The best low wing aileron trainer -- Ever. You can not go wrong with that model, and I never tire of flying it. Of course you can pop a bigger motor in it, like a power ten and it is even better.

Best of luck in your journey of learning.

Too many hobbies, and not enough time!
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Old 11-27-2013, 06:54 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins View Post
I cringe when I read that about any plane. Can you pop off some rolling circles for me? How about some 3D flight?
With a rudder and elevator trainer

I didnt read that he was claiming to be the best flyer in the world of a 3 channel plane, just that he was looking for a new challenge. Nothing wrong with that, It's just a normal part of progressing in the hobby. Otherwise none of us would have more than one model.
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Old 11-27-2013, 06:56 PM   #24
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Aw JPF .. OP did say "as I've mastered elevator rudder planes" ...

Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
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Old 11-27-2013, 10:37 PM   #25
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Try a Bixler or Hawk Sky or one of the clones. Easy flying yet can do some simple aerobatics, plus they will glide forever if not made to heavy. They take a lickin and keep on tickin. Nice video platform also.

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