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View Full Version : my first ARF. Fokker E-III Eindecker


icaboy
02-10-2007, 04:39 AM
i am currently working on my very first arf. today i purchased a super flying model Fokker III ep-71
http://www.hobby-lobby.com/eindecker.htm

i am very excited about this. i will keep everyone updated on how it goes.
the worst problem with this plane are the instructions. they are terribly translated. for example "cut small hole in rear of fuselage" reads "remove concave from fuselage end" haha... but, i am slowly translating.

has anyone else here flown/built this plane?

this is my list so far.
Fokker III
pixie-7p esc
stock 300 motor
park zone ap-5 transmitter and receiver
hitec hs-55 servos

everything check out o.k? i want to keep the stock motor. i want to learn the reactions of this plane before i beef up the motor. i haven't decided on battery type yet. i have a good niMh charger, so i will stay with that. not ready for LiPos yet.

this is my first arf plane, so any suggestions would be great.

max2112
02-10-2007, 05:07 PM
Welcome to WattFlyer!
I haven't flown this one, but I have a GWS plane based on the Eindecker. Good luck on your project.

As far as advice goes, I would reccomend downloading FMS and fly with it for a while. It is a shareware RC flight simulator. It can help you get used to the perspective changes and the basics of how your plane will react.

Please keep us posted on your progress, preferrably with pictures!
:D

icaboy
02-10-2007, 07:23 PM
thank you! this is an awesome community and i am very happy to be part of it.

i've been using clearview flight sim for a month or so. i already have an airstrike. and believe it or not, it can fly. like a brick, but it does fly. i was told that if i can make the megatech airstrike fly, i can probably attempt something more fragile.

i completed the plane last night. except for the receiver, which hasn't come in yet. i don't think i am going to have the courage to throw this thing in the air after all the time i put into. :confused:

max2112
02-11-2007, 04:19 PM
thank you! this is an awesome community and i am very happy to be part of it.
... i don't think i am going to have the courage to throw this thing in the air after all the time i put into. :confused:

I know how you feel. The maiden flight of my pico had me in a fit. But when that little sunofagun picked up speed and buzzzzed away I was dancing for joy.
:rolleyes: Literally!!
My oldest daughter made fun of me for a week because I tried to dance a little jig and almost crashed!

Trust me, you'll feel great!

icaboy
02-11-2007, 08:36 PM
yeah, i suppose you are right. i think i am going to leave this grounded for a bit until i feel perfect with the groundstrike.... i mean airstrike. i'll be sure to post a video of my first flight.though, videos usually mean mishaps.... we'll see.

icaboy
02-12-2007, 03:57 AM
i have a question here... as my new plane has no rudder control, i realize that the ailerons will control the turns. so.. as one goes down one goes up. i understand that part.

here is the question. i am using clearview flightsim and can't seem to correctly fly the twin stick ( the only plane i can find with a static rudder ) i am guessing that as i turn left i will add up elevator, correct? also, on this plane would you want the ailerons to be controlled by the left/right stick on the left.?

i have a 4 channel tx. here is my thought
x rotation controls ailerons
y axis controls throttle
x axis controls elevator

am i right, or should the aileron be on the x axis???

ha, i know i seem like a newb, probably because i am.
thank you.

max2112
02-12-2007, 07:45 AM
icaboy,
Traditionally, whatever your primary "yaw-changing" device is, it is controlled by your right thumb's X-axis.

Mine goes like this:

Left Y-axis: throttle.
Left X-axis: not used.

Right Y-axis: elevator.
Right X-axis: rudder.
If I were to add alerons, they would go on the right X-axis and the rudder would move to the left side.

You can configure it to be however you like, but that is the norm.

Yes, a little pull-back is required to keep you level in a turn. There are many good articles here that explain stalling and wing speed etc...

Good luck!

icaboy
02-12-2007, 08:38 AM
yes, thank you.

actually i learned this just a bit using my flight sim and reading online. good to get confirmation from you.

how would you compare flying a rudder/elevator plane to an aileron/elevator? as far as ease of flying, i mean. using the flight sim i seemed to prefer the aileron/rudder better, but i am wondering how this would translate to a real world application.

Solid Hit
02-12-2007, 12:37 PM
Icaboy, welcome to WF!

A rudder only plane will have a good deal of dihedral to the wings and that will give you some stability. Typically only trainers are rudder only and they are built for easy of flight. They mush a plane into a turn because they are twisting the airframe from from behind.

Ailerons effect the wings which are basically on the center of gravity (CG). It causes a turn (bank) much sharper then can be done with a rudder only. Coordinated turns require both aileron and rudder inputs. (Truthfully, I believe the average sport pilot uses only ailerons for turns.) Aileron planes are no more difficult to fly but they are typically used on planes that are not as forgiving as a rudder/trainer will be. This is why 99% of your trainers have high wings, lots of dihedral and are rudder only planes.

Leo L
02-12-2007, 01:45 PM
Hello Icaboy,

Welcome to R/C flying. The infamous Airstrike and now the Eindecker! I give you credit.

I had the Airstrike and, like you, I was able to fly it; but it was never a good flyer, being much too heavy and underpowered. I kept burning out motors after about 10 flights, so I eventually replaced all of the electronics and put in a brushless outrunner. With the much lighter components and more powerful motor, the plane was actually very pleasant to fly. There are details of these modifications on another site, RCGroups or RCUniverse, don't remember which, in the parkflyer section. Do a search. Its well worth it.

I built the Eindecker a few months ago, but so far have had only two flights with it due to the cold and constant wind. I don't like flying in wind, and I don't want to trim out a new plane in windy conditions, so the plane waits for fair weather. I made several changes to the plane: I added a third servo and made it a 4-channel plane. I also added a steerable tail wheel; used a brushless outrunner and LiPo battery. On my first flight I had radio interference which caused loss of all functions, resulting in a crash. Most of the damage was to the front of the fuselage which I was able to repair with epoxy and tape. The second flight was terrific. The plane is very light and responds very quickly to control inputs, so be very careful to use very small amounts of input. I never handlaunch and this plane doesn't need to be. The landing gear is excellent for taking off and landing on pavement, packed dirt or even very short grass. The foam is very easily damaged, so I would recommend that you ground take off, since you can see much better, and much earlier, if the plane will be doing OK or is having problems. Good luck and let us know how you make out. If you want any details of the modifications that I made to the Airstrike or the Eindecker, feel free to PM.

icaboy
02-13-2007, 04:44 AM
thanks guys. you are all some great help.

i actually just replaced the motor in the airstrike tonight. i used a speed 400 long can... it took (in my mind ) a good amount of modification. but, it seems to pull correctly. i will fly it later this week and see how it does. i am not too terribly interested in modding this plane much. i got it for $60 brand new. i am just going to fly and crash and flay and crash until it's dead.

i am really intersted in the warbirds. actually, i am interested in most types of planes, but especially those circa WWI/WWII. but, i also realize i need to learn all the basics of flight before i cause myself grief from destroying the planes i want.

i would like to see those mods though, just for curiosity.

thanks again, you guys are great.

EDIT: also, i have a parkzone #re672 receiver and matching 4-ch transmitter from a typhoon 3d. can i use that same tx and purchase a different brand receiver (with different crystal) to put in another plane and just swap out the tx's crystal? i am hoping that the parkzone receiver is not proprietary, yet i fear it is.

sorry i ask so many question.

Leo L
02-13-2007, 07:04 PM
For information regarding the Airstrike, go to RCGroups and do a search of the Airstrike forums. When you find the one that is titled "Megatech Airstrike....yeah, another one" by BigDano, check it out for all of the mods.

The Typhoon transmitter and receiver are excellent no frills units. I have a Typhoon and I purchase receivers for all of the planes that I am modifying/building. My Eindecker and Airstrike have Typhoon receivers in them.

icaboy
02-14-2007, 01:11 AM
My Eindecker and Airstrike have Typhoon receivers in them.

can you buy the parkzone receivers seperately? i would love to be able to do that. or can i buy different receivers and have them work with my parkzone transmitter? (assuming matching crystals)

Balil
02-14-2007, 02:36 AM
icaboy as far as the grief of crashing a bird goes, its part of the hobby. if you obliterate the plane, get another and start over til you get it right.... there is no telling how many times ive bought replacement parts for my p-51 mustang because of either dumb thumbs or rx interference.

Leo L
02-14-2007, 06:52 PM
Icaboy,

Yes, you can buy the receivers separately. Go to Horizon Hobby's web site (or any other that carries the HZ/PZ planes), select the plane (Typhoon) and go to the spare parts section. Buy the receiver ($29) that has the same channel as your transmitter.

icaboy
02-14-2007, 10:58 PM
AWESOMENESS! thank you leo... thank you.
i never even thought to do that. you rock.

i am going to try out my new motor in my airstrike this weekend. if the winds will stay down.

thank you all for the great help.

leo, do you feel that the stock Eindecker motor has enough power? also, what is your battery setup?

Leo L
02-15-2007, 03:46 PM
I never tried the stock motor; I just went directly to the brushless. I'm using a 3-cell LiPo 1000mah. i found the battery access hatch to be a pain to use, so I cut away the bottom of the fuselage directly infront of the landing gear. I epoxied and screwed a velcro strip (red to match the plane) to the plywood reinforcing sections and use the velcro to secure the battery. The battery's wire is visible below the fuselage, but its no big deal.

Based on how easily the plane takes off, I imagine that the stock motor/gear box should be adequate. With my set-up, I didn't go above 50% trottle, even on take-off. I'm using an 8x4 prop (stock prop from the parkZone J3Cub), but I think that I'll be trying out some other props to see if I can give up some of the power for longer flight times.

icaboy
02-15-2007, 10:21 PM
I never tried the stock motor; I just went directly to the brushless. I'm using a 3-cell LiPo 1000mah. i found the battery access hatch to be a pain to use, so I cut away the bottom of the fuselage directly infront of the landing gear. I epoxied and screwed a velcro strip (red to match the plane) to the plywood reinforcing sections and use the velcro to secure the battery. The battery's wire is visible below the fuselage, but its no big deal.

Based on how easily the plane takes off, I imagine that the stock motor/gear box should be adequate. With my set-up, I didn't go above 50% trottle, even on take-off. I'm using an 8x4 prop (stock prop from the parkZone J3Cub), but I think that I'll be trying out some other props to see if I can give up some of the power for longer flight times.

yes... i noticed that the battery access is quite small and cramped. cutting away that bit is a good idea, thanks. i am using NiMh so.. my plane will be heavier and with a weaker motor.. still, though, surely it will be more graceful than the airstrike.

so.. putting the battery that far forward had little effect on your cg? getting the proper cg is something i am fretting over.

Leo L
02-19-2007, 04:29 AM
I added a second servo in the rear, for the rudder, and I added a steerable tail wheel, all of which helped offset the up-front weight of the battery. I had to add two 1/4" nuts at the tail skid area to finalize the balancing.

icaboy
02-19-2007, 05:13 AM
uggg... i "tried" to maiden mine today. straight to the ground and broke my motor mount. :(

i really, really need to get with someone to watch over me in person. i added a tail wheel, though not steerable.. and i have a very heavy NiMh 6 cell pack in the plane... probably my downward problem, though i THOUGHT i had the cg correct..

did you modify the motor mount in any way? mine seems really weak.

Leo L
02-19-2007, 01:23 PM
Sorry to hear about your crash!

A couple of thought while you re-build. Go with at least a seven cell NiMh or a 2-cell LiPo. The ParkZone battery for the J3Cub/SuperDecathlon is a very nice unit. The CG should be at the "hump" in the wing. It's actually easier to check the balance of the plane if you hold it upside down.

It sounds like you handlaunched. Try groundlaunching and see how the plane behaves. if it starts to take off, level it out and let it settle back down after a few feet in the air. Repeat with longer and longer stretches of flight until you are comfortable with it. With groundlaunches, if there is a problem, the plane won't lift off or you can quickly set it down. With handlaunching, if there is a problem, the plane crashes.

icaboy
02-20-2007, 11:15 PM
Sorry to hear about your crash!

A couple of thought while you re-build. Go with at least a seven cell NiMh or a 2-cell LiPo.

thanks for the help.. actually... i had the cg right. AND i realizedmy 6 cell NiMh battery.. well, it weight 4.6 ounces.... nearly 50% of the stock plane's weight..

i guess i have to suck it up and go with lipo.. grr... or a bigger motor.

as far as ground launchnig, i don't have that great of a flat area... grass is a little tall, which makes me worry about the landing too. this plane seems pretty fragile.

icaboy
02-22-2007, 11:46 AM
i purchased a 7.4 400mah LiPo today, wow... what a difference.. it wants to almost hover. i haven't had the chance to fly it yet, but i can already see a HUGE difference.

Leo L
02-22-2007, 02:03 PM
Good luck and keep us informed of your progress.

icaboy
02-25-2007, 04:04 PM
well, it seems to fly great. i had to hand launch.... sorry :o

i did one turn and decided to land after i noticed my ailerons were reversed. no problem, simple landing. well, i landed nearly perfect, but my motor mount completely fell off.:mad:

it was hot-glued onto the foam fuse. ugg.. i reinforced it with some balsa and used some ca glue. it seems to be much stronger now. bottom line = it shall fly again. and man, did it seem so agile while in the air. i think i am going to like this bird.

icaboy
03-06-2007, 04:24 AM
i re-maidened my fokker ( if that's possible )

it flew SO awesome. i love it. my first landing was picture perfect. i did some rolls and some mild aerobatics... than lost orientation ( it was getting dark ). i cut the throttle and crossed my fingers. it landed correctly and had very minor damage. i am using a 2 cell LiPo and it seems to haul just fine, but i have to keep about 50% throttle to keep it smooth. i love it.

Leo L
03-06-2007, 03:52 PM
I had a couple of more flights with my Eindecker and I must agree with you, its a fun plane to fly. I weighed my plane and with a 1200mah 3-cell LiPo the plane weighs only 15.5 oz. I love the way that the plane looks while flying, but it is rather flimsy and needs gentle landings to stay in one piece.

Anyone out there besides Icaboy and me that is flying this plane?

icaboy
03-06-2007, 09:59 PM
i am using 2 cell and mine weighs in at 11.5 ounces. yes.. .it is fragile. last night i added some carbon fiber support to the fuselage and main wing.

Skyburner
06-09-2007, 01:54 AM
Hey guys, glad you're enjoying your fokker. I just built mine and am waiting for the wind to die to maiden it. I asked my LHS wether it would be good to add another servo for rudder control. They said I wouldn't need it. Can't wait to fly it. Where was your CG? ??

Fr Rob
05-30-2009, 05:38 PM
Good Morning from Arizona,
I am planning on buying the Hobby Lobby Fokker Eindecker E-III on Monday, 1 June, as my next project. Many years ago I had a built up E-III with a glow engine, which was my first airplane when I joined the Arizona Radio Control Society (ARCS) in 1969/70, I don't remember which year, but radio interference caused a really bad crash. I've been in and out of the hobby over the years due to a lot of moving throughout the world. In any case I returned to Arizona on 02/23/09 and rejoined the ARCS. Currently flying a Slow Stick and nostalgia urges me to fly an E-III once again. So . . . if you're interested in an old timer's adventures I would be pleased to join this particular thread . . .

Rob+

billintn
06-02-2009, 08:58 PM
Welcome Fr Rob

I bought an Eindecker for H-L last week and am in assembling it. Looks like we are about 4 years behind on this thread but maybe will get going again. I would like to go brushless with mine so if anyone out there has any experience with that, help and advice are always appreciated.

Bill
O K two years. Math not my strong suit.