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Space Shuttle Depron Foam 64mm EDF - Scratch

Old 10-26-2010, 03:59 PM
  #151  
guapoman2000
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Thumbs up Drag Chute Deploy Improvements

Like to report the installation of a small yet very spring-like tie-wrap within the Engine Nozzle that contains the Drag Chute.

This additional item allows the folded Drag Chute to be gently ejected out from the Engine Nozzle with ease.

I have no plans to Video record any further Test Runs until next week at the earliest.

Carlos
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Old 10-30-2010, 02:23 AM
  #152  
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Default Go discovery! Go sts-133!

Ladies and Gentlemen,

I am sort of Choked up and very sad that Space Shuttle Discovery, one of the best performing Space Shuttles and the one that Brought the Space Shuttle Program back on track twice after the two disasters will fly for the Last time very soon.

I bid God Speed and Blessings to her crew and one of them from Kennedy Space Center! What an honor it is to have someone that formerly worked at our Space Center and go fly Discovery for the Last time.

GO DISCOVERY! GO STS-133!

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjTl8BPk7NQ&feature=player_embedded#![/media]

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Old 10-30-2010, 06:15 AM
  #153  
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Excellent Job on the shuttle..
The following photo is the current Shuttle STS 133 Last flight for Discovery. Now moved to Wed. 11/03/2010
This may help you in final detail work...

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Old 11-05-2010, 12:21 PM
  #154  
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Thumbs up New Videos coming!

Originally Posted by Tin Man View Post
Excellent Job on the shuttle..
The following photo is the current Shuttle STS 133 Last flight for Discovery. Now moved to Wed. 11/03/2010
This may help you in final detail work...
Tin Man,

Thanks for those kind words and glad you enjoyed the build and results.

The Space Shuttle Discovery is presently being prepared as I type this and it is Friday, November 5th, 2010.

I will try to get some new Videos showing the Drag Chute mod with the improve deployment!

Stay Tuned!
Carlos
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Old 11-07-2010, 12:24 AM
  #155  
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Hello Carlos,

Been reading your thread here, Great Work! I ended up ordering the same shuttle from EJF.com myself and plan on building it soon. It arrived yesterday!

Just wanted to double check with you before I started, your CG is 8.5 inches forward of the aft bulkhead, is that still the case?

Also, another question if you don't mind. What are your control throw distance for up and down? I assume you probably also have some expo set on your transmitter?

I especially like your engine nozzels, it really adds to the looks.

Steve

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Old 11-09-2010, 03:26 AM
  #156  
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Default Started Assembly

I decided to get started with what little I can do before getting the landing gear, power system and radio gear.

First night I put the wings on, it was a simple process. Tonight I did some modifications to the 'hatch' or payload bay doors if you like. Because the edges didn't exactly match the width of the body I added a small strip of foam to each side of the hatch and sanded it to blend in with the curve of the hatch. Then so that the hatch would grip the body from the inside I added some ribs. I still have to add some magnets but I imagine with the suction of the fan, when it is running, that hatch isn't going to fly off.

I plan on following Carlos's example about adding an airfoil shape to the upper wing.

I want to thank RW from EJF.com for shipping out the shuttle parts so quickly. I wish things had worked out with the production of a full blown kit but I'm happy with what I got.

Here are a few photos:

Steve
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Old 11-09-2010, 06:41 PM
  #157  
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Default magnets added

Today I added 6 sets of 3.2 mm rare earth magnets from Magcraft.com. They hold very strong, you could pick up the Shuttle by its hatch now!

Steve
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Old 11-10-2010, 09:13 PM
  #158  
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Default Way to go!

Originally Posted by Stevedots View Post
Hello Carlos,

Been reading your thread here, Great Work! I ended up ordering the same shuttle myself and plan on building it soon. It arrived yesterday!

Just wanted to double check with you before I started, your CG is 8.5 inches forward of the aft bulkhead, is that still the case?

Also, another question if you don't mind. What are your control throw distance for up and down? I assume you probably also have some expo set on your transmitter?

I especially like your engine nozzels, it really adds to the looks.

I wanted to also thank RW from EJF for shipping out the shuttle so quickly and for the quality of it's construction. Too bad it isn't a full fledged kit with instructions but I'm very happy with what I got. I only hope my building skills (and flying skills) can do this Shuttle justice. Between what RW sent me and Carlos's thread I think I will be off to a good start!

Steve
Wow! Steve that is fantastic that you got EJF to ship you this model!

I believe with an Airfoil wing shape the Center-Of-Gravity is more like 8.25 inches from the rear panel AFT Bulkhead.

The first flight using 8.5 inches was a tad too tail heavy and it was scary at best but, I brought her down in one piece!

The subsequent flights I believe I went too much nose heavy at around 9 inches from the Rear panel AFT Bulkhead so, the Center-Of-Gravity is pretty tight in one spot! One of these days I will find it!

After perhaps a couple of flights I finally added expo on those control surface throws. I have lots of throw but, with the expo I can now have a smooth flight on her. Also, I have mixed some negative movement to the Elevon that goes down as the one that turns the model is the one that goes UP, right....so, the one that goes down now has minimum movement and it seems to help greatly in not allowing the model to slow down too much. The Elevon that goes UP has about 1 inch of travel and the Elevon that goes down has nothing more than 1/2 inch.

Go for the Engine Nozzles they are easy to make out of 16oz. water bottles and paint them from the inside!

Hope this helps and keep up the progress!

Carlos
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:51 PM
  #159  
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Default

Thanks Carlos,

All that information will help very very much. I only hope I have as much success as you have had!

Today I put a little bit of lightweight spackel on some of the spots on the body to try to make it as smooth as possable. This lightweight spackel I am using is so light when I went to the hardware store to pick it up the the container felt empty. So I don't believe it will add any real weight.

I did order a fan unit with motor and ESC from EJF. I figured I'd give them the business since they were nice enough to ship me the shuttle with extra wing tops. For the wing tops I went with the 6 mm foam you used for your wing tops so I'd have a fatter wing and more area to sand for the curved leading edge.

The fan unit is a Typhoon 2W-20 EDF motor + HET-75 ESC + EDF 6904 fan unit. With a 4S pack it should give more than 3 lbs of thrust. That should keep the Shuttle in the air. I'll be using a Hyperion 4S 2200 45C Lipo. The Hyperions are a little more in price than some brands and a tiny bit heavier but they seem to have great performance and you can charge them at up to 5C!

Thanks again for all your help. Being that I'm in New England and the flying season is winding down (fingers get numb after one flight!) it will force me to take my time and get this Shuttle 100% before it's maiden flight.

Thanks again,

Steve

Last edited by Stevedots; 12-03-2010 at 10:24 PM.
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Old 11-12-2010, 03:47 PM
  #160  
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Default Scale landing gear?

I tested some Krylon H20 latex spray paint on the extra 'hatch' cover. The H20 paint covers nice and doesn't hurt the foam so that is what I will be painting the shuttle with.

Looking for a little help in finding a scale looking set of landing gear. I will be taking off on a grass runway but it is pretty smooth and short so I think I can get away with something that looks scale. Or maybe wheels that are just a little bit bigger than scale.

Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Here are a few photos of the sanded wing and body. I have some 'airfoil' on the top now but not as much as the real thing. I suppose any airfoil vs no airfoil at all can only help.

Steve
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:49 AM
  #161  
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I am waiting for my 'powerplant' and a few different sets of landing gear. In the mean time I have installed the hinges into the elevons and I mounted the control horns onto the elevons. I used control horns that have back plates and will be mounting the servos into the bottom of the wings. Last step for tonight was to glue the elevon hinges onto the Shuttle wings.

As you can see in the first photo I have some dents in the bottom of my wing from the clothes pins I used to hold the layers of foam together. I will use some more of the light weight spackel and do some more filling and sanding before I do the finished paint job. But for now I still have more work to do before I worry about paint.

Steve
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Old 11-23-2010, 05:53 PM
  #162  
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Default Depron Shuttle By A Different Path....Way... :^)

Pardon this moment of distraction to share something of a vision for anyone who's interested in expanding their Depron horizon...or more appropriately
a composite build with Depron and high density XPS.

There are varying degrees of detailed card stock models available online. There is an astonishing number which are absolutely free...or astonishingly
inexpensive to acquire via download of the .pdf drawings.

These are really intersting in as much as they not only provide a paper doll pattern with which to cut and form the model, but when printed on paper
then clear laminated and adhered to the constructed model provides not only a scuff resistant surface, but the entire (typically scale) paint scheme... Below is but one of multiple pages which can be enlarged to for either a template or depending on the size desire, the actual skin of the model. As I
said, there are many shuttles out there at various densities enabling the images to be enlarged to over a six foot wingspan...;^)


I know there will those who scoff and see this as a less than way of achieve smooth and proportional shapes without having to use hot wire...
imagine that... it works and that is all that matters. Also, it is considerably lighter weight than a hot wired model.

Note Enlarged Card Stock Models Overhead.... ;^) Plot At FedEx Kinko's

Gee, what if I wanted to enlarge the image and make a giant scale whatever... It is only limited by the dpi of the original .pdf image. Most are
higher density aka dpi than the one I am posting here. I grabbed it off its creators web site by downloading it to create some eye candy for this
thread. You can down load it free of charge at:

http://www.delta7studios.com/images/columbiamod.pdf

It took about 10 seconds of Google search to find this specific free card stock model if the shuttle. I know of several others with a much higher
dpi...aka enlargement capable image. Yes, with this process you could construct a five or six foot wingspan shuttle...perhaps larger given
you spend a few minutes to search.

Most intricate card stock models...as I showed in the Avro Vulcan thread..need no addtional internal structure support because they incorporate
multiple spars...you an laminate these with carbon fiber veil to accomplish what is necessary...cheaply.

I now return control of this thread back to its author(s).

Just a thought... ;^) Happy Holidays...
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Old 11-23-2010, 08:41 PM
  #163  
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Exclamation Different Types Of foam.

Flite-Metal,

Thanks so much for that information on foam types and Free Downloads of Card stock plans.

For those interested in the different foam types that are known most in the RC hobby circles (I do realize that many more are being experimented with as technology improves and considering no environmental impacts) then, go to:
http://www.skyhighhobby.com/rc/all-about-rc-foam

My main goals in creating this Thread was to be able and improve an existing project from EJF and a private individual who developed a production based model out of Depron Foam.

As you may have read in other threads, EJF (Robert) did provide some insight into the reality of marketing and material selections and project results ($$$) for this project.

I am happy to say that because of this thread some additional interest has resulted and focal point into "a" Space Shuttle RC Flying model and I welcome someone with the equipment and drive to make a larger Space Shuttle model out of some type of foam.

Per the above referenced web site, XPS Foam is a closed cell structure used in many insulating applications where Air tight and water tight requirements exist and it is relatively light. With any foam type the need to investigate carefully the best practice adhesives, shaping tools, and other structurally aspects need to be invested in order to provide a sound Project using these new materials even though it is still considered FOAM.

Carlos
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Old 11-24-2010, 05:27 AM
  #164  
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I installed the tube for the rear of the EDF. I also added two pieces of bass wood to screw the EDF onto. Originally I thought about mounting the EDF flush with the rear bulkhead but for two reason desided against it. One, Carlos moved his forward to get it closer to the CG and Two, I want to be able to remove it in the future if needed without cutting apart the rear of the shuttle. I also had to add some wire to the motor for it to reach into the 'payload bay' area.

I have some landing gear I think I'll be using. They aren't exactly scale but concidering I'll be taking off and landing on grass I think they will work out without looking too big for the overall look. At least the nose wheel has duel wheels.

Steve
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Old 11-24-2010, 06:24 AM
  #165  
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Default Good Progress!

Steve,

Good progress! How you keep it up considering it will soon be Turkey Day and then, you get really sleepy!

I opted to get the Fan unit forward is because I did not know if the 64mm EDF was going to be enough and thank goodness the unit is enough to propel this 2lbs. model into the air in a scale like manner. Had I opted to go with a larger fan unit, the need for larger batteries would have been needed and the model would really be a TON TOSSY.

Keeping this model as light as possible is the major task while I was trying to improve the airfoil and looks of the main gear.

Keep up the good work!
Carlos
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Old 11-24-2010, 03:56 PM
  #166  
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Thanks Carlos,

I will have my fingers crossed when I finally weigh the shuttle. I also plan on haveing some expo programed into my radio for the first flight. I have a ducted fan jet that, at least when I first got it over a year ago, felt extra loose in the roll. Now not so much since I'm used to it but I'm going to start with the same expo setting I used for that with the Shuttle.

Have a Happy Thanksgiving!(substitue the popcorn for turkey!)

Steve
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Old 11-24-2010, 10:41 PM
  #167  
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Steve,

Yes correct, you will need Expo otherwise that Space Shuttle will be Rocking side to side until your brain and fingers get into sync!

May you have a good Thanksgiving yourself too!

Warm regards,
Carlos
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Old 11-30-2010, 10:48 PM
  #168  
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Default Main Gear Base

Did some work on the base of the main gear. I probably over engineered it but when mounting on foam I think more is better. First I cut the lower skin of the wing. As it turns out adding an upper layer to the wing worked out because it gave me extra room to install the base. First I added a piece of wood and epoxied it to the inside of the bottom skin. I used a Kelly clamp with a screw into the wood to hold the wood up against the inner wing bottom. Then I epoxied some thin plywood over that that piece of wood and over foam I had added as a rib for the wing. After that I added four pieces of carbon fiber rod to spread the load. I used a similar layout when adding retracts to my Parkzone T-28 and have had some 'firm' landing with that and it is still solid. Lastly I screwed in the base of the landing gear on top of the carbon fiber using some servo screws I had on hand. Later I'll fill in the carbon fiber slots with light weight spackel before painting. I moved the gear forward of the stock position to help with rotation at lift off. It had the added benifit of my carbon fiber overlapping one of the wing spars. I don't think this gear will be going anyplace....even with some of my landings!

I hope to get more work done this week to make up for the Holiday keeping me out of the workshop. Or maybe I should say "Vehicle Assembly Building"?

Steve
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Old 12-01-2010, 05:55 AM
  #169  
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Default Nose Gear Base

Making more progress today. Did the nose wheel base. Pretty much the same as the main gear. I wanted to be able to unscrew the base and drop the nose gear out of the shuttle if I ever have servo problems.

I haven't screwed it in yet because I have to wire up the ESC (deans connectors to battery) and then hook up the reciever to then center the servo for the nose. You can see the servo/gear mount that will be mounted servo side up on the inside of the nose.


Steve
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Old 12-01-2010, 10:54 PM
  #170  
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I still have a lot of work to do but just for the heck of it I checked what I was pulling for watts after wireing up the ESC and reciever to center my servos.

With the 70mm Typhoon Brushless EDF 2W-20-75A Drive Set that I got from EJF and using a Hyperion 4S 2200 45C Lipo, charged to 80%, I got a static test of 874 Watts according to my Watts up meter.

I forget the watts to lbs formula but it doesn't seem like power will be a problem. The only problem I see is my thumbs!

I still have to glue the elevon servos in place now that they are centered. Install the nose gear guts then layout the ESC, reciever and Battery in the inside of the body while checking the CG. Then check my elevon throws. After all that will come the paint and decals.

Steve
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Old 12-02-2010, 01:31 AM
  #171  
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Steve,

With that power ... I would most certainly program for expo on those Elevons!!

Glad to learn you are progressing nicely. Take your time and enjoy.

I am watching..

Carlos
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Old 12-02-2010, 02:25 AM
  #172  
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Thanks Carlos,

With the New England weather I am forced to take my time. Which is a good thing because the closer I am to finishing her the quicker I want to fly her.

I am on vacation this week so I think I will have her finished buy the end of the week. After that it will just be the weather as to when I can "launch" or not.

I'll keep the updates coming because I still have a lot of little things to do. Thanks again Carlos, you are the "John Glenn" or "Alan Shepherd" of R/C Space Shuttle Flight! Like I said before I am building following your work.

Steve

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Old 12-03-2010, 05:25 AM
  #173  
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Default Today

Today I got a lot done. Finished up mounting the nose gear. Had to make a mini-pushrod and center it before mounting. I do have it so I can unscrew it from the bottom incase I have a servo problem.

Made a 'floor' for the interior. I wanted to follow Carlos's example of the floor but I made it with two angled sides to hopefully smooth airflow. Had the added benifit of hiding the reciever and servo wires. Both the ESC and the battery are held in place with industrial strength velcro but since I was paranoid of something getting loose and getting sucked into the fan I also added velcro straps. The floor itself is held in position with velcro and although the sides are a tight fit below the magnet supports I'll add some clear packing tape to the top of the sides. That way if I need to get to the reciever or connections I can remove the floor. I also wanted the ESC and battery to be in the airflow.

Tomorrow I will start to make the engine nozzles and mount the rudder, although I may save the rudder for last so it will be easier to paint the black details on it. After that it is just a matter of adjusting the elevon throws then start with paint and decals. The shuttle did come with some self stick paper decals but I have some self stick ink jet paper that becomes water proof after you print on it so I'll scan the decals and re-print them. I also have to make some more decals out of images from on line.

Steve
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Old 12-04-2010, 06:31 AM
  #174  
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Did some work today to fix a problem I noticed with the nose gear. It had a little bit of play from side to side. The 'cheapo' mount only had one area holding the nose gear shaft so I added some epoxy puddy to the wooden base to help reduce the play in the shaft.

Started to work on the engine nozzles also. Following Carlos's idea of using water bottles for the nozzles I was off to a good start. Then I was thinking I'm going to have to cut and shape some foam to hold the nozzles in place. I had an idea, I had some elapor foam wheels that came with my Multiplex Gemini (I replaced them with real wheels) that have been sitting around. I'd never use them for wheels so I thought let me try them. Ended up being perfect mounts for the nozzles. The water bottle caps were even the same diameter as the wheel hubs I removed. All I had to do was sand the mounting side a little bit flatter and a great fit.

I also weighed the shuttle, without rudder, hatch and nozzles but don't think they will add too much weight. Anyway I'm at 2 lbs and 3 ounces with battery. I think the 800 plus watts will be more than enough with that weight.

Steve
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Old 12-05-2010, 08:10 PM
  #175  
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Default Ready for paint

This shuttle has been a lot of fun. It is only the second r/c plane I've made that wasn't a kit or arf with directions. (thank goodness for Carols, Spaceshuttle1, killickb and everyone on the threads for their help and suggestions.)

Thanks to you Spaceshuttle1. If it wasn't for you we wouldn't have something to work on to keep the dream alive. I will for sure be interested in any future Shuttle kit you come up with.

I'm finally ready for paint. Only other thing I did aside from make the nozzels was to add a carbon fiber rod to the inside of the rudder. I know this is a draggy airframe but just incase my 800+ watts pushes this along faster than I expect I wanted to stiffen up the rudder. Plus, like the old "Grumman Iron Works" I have to beef everything up to put up with my flying abilities or lack thereof.

Steve
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Last edited by Stevedots; 12-05-2010 at 08:43 PM.
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