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Electric Ducted Fan Jets Discuss electric ducted fan jets here including setup tips, power systems, flying techniques, etc.

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Old 12-06-2013, 01:48 AM   #76
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Not getting a cart ahead of our horse... We need to get these two B-47's up on their feet and ROG ASAP to get back on track to success.
Too many delays over the last six months have made it extremely frustrating to get the CAD files straightened out.

Immediately, I am diving into the ABS printer. I need to complete the cockpit with its instrument panel, power quadrant, ejection seats,
steering yoke, windshield, etc. and all the instrument panels.

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Old 12-06-2013, 09:42 AM   #77
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We agree Ed! The lurkers like myself want to see the end results of your project start to come together!!! Time to get building!!!

Take care and thanks for posting at WattFlyer!!

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Old 12-06-2013, 06:16 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by Don Sims View Post
We agree Ed! The lurkers like myself want to see the end results of your project start to come together!!! Time to get building!!!
+1 Now Get to building your Plane and enter it in the $75.00 build contest, you have about 90 Days to GET R DONE Now, Enough With The Chit Chat, We Want to see Results

I may be getting Older, But I Refuse to grow Up I am Having to much Fun to Grow Up LOL
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Old 12-07-2013, 05:44 PM   #79
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Default Printing Cockpit

Chit Chat... : (

Revisiting what we acquired a year ago, I can now spend time printing as much of the cockpit and other details as possible. When
we started we were going to use the F-104 cockpit components for this, well those parts will join with printed components to further
detail the cockpit tub...hopefully...given I can edit all these skins into 3 dim geometry.

I'll take a moment to post the specs and some details for those interested in acquiring a really nice and inexpensive ($1,500) 3D printer
capable of printing 5" x 5" x 5" in ABS plastic. Price includes print control software. File format required is .stl .



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Old 12-07-2013, 06:18 PM   #80
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Default Sum Of The Parts



The B-47's cockpit is wide enough to permit a viewer to see more than is usally visible in a 1/8.7669 model. There is a walkway
to the left of both pilot and co-pilot with instruments across behind and above this ramp.

Walkway permits a large side view of the instrument panel, seats, pilot's and co-pilot's ejection seats, throttle quadrant, rear
cannon control unit, etc. All this in living color.

I will attempt to print each individual component and assemble the parts using Smith's rubberized CA to offset harmonic vibration
that shakes parts loose when glued with hard surface glues.


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Old 01-03-2014, 02:57 PM   #81
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B-47E-IV




WB-47B Weather Bomber

YB-47E

; )

Hope everyone had an enjoyable Holiday. The nicest thing I suppose we all can agree on is worst of
the weather held off until this week. Take care and stay indoors to inspect your systems for those
gremins you never repaired last flying season...making sure when you go back out there there will be
no disappointments due to neglect.

Numb thumbs can be over come with flight sims... Neglect, well it could cost more than the repair.
Lots going on here, will from this point forward try our best to show digital images taken of our work
as it progresses through the finishing out of various sub-systems forming what then becomes a pair
of B-47.

There sometimes seems to be an element of impatience. Scratch building is not for anyone who has
an impatient streak. What has to be appreciated that perhaps has been over-looked is the fact I have
been working on a project tool box with components designed to reduce the time required to go from
your imagination to sky.

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Old 01-24-2014, 12:34 AM   #82
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Default an element of impatience????

Spot on there Ed. Patience is a virtue, but even I, the most patient person on the planet, am finding this build thread character building. If 1% of the population put this much effort and time into a project, we would have world peace, a colony on Mars, and Harley Davidsons that don't leak oil. On 2nd thought, maybe a leak proof Harley is pushing it.

Amazing amount of detail in that cockpit though
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Old 01-27-2014, 02:05 PM   #83
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I have been unable to find a file conversion program to convert SketchUp native files to STL or IGES. Its a royal pain to
have the cockpit all splayed open down to what I need then find that even SketchUp Pro does provide export conversions
to CNC formats.

This is like getting caught in a 3rd grade remedial class loop where for the sake of the teacher's pride and glory you are
not advanced forward after proving you can do all the work and still smile about being held back... (Sound familiar???)

What is that about "Keep them barefoot, hungery, and poorly clothed"... ? That goes right along with "Vote early...and
vote often today....Ya hear...".

Climbing down off my soap box I will continue with my request for mercy and you kind assistance...

Does anyone have a SketchUp native format (SKP) conversion program that will change a drawing originating in SketchUp
to an .STL or .IGES format? I will gladly pay you for doing this for Sam and I... I have run out of patience and time to
continue digging myself in any deeper.

I have found the following SketchUp Pro attribute "claim"... We are not going to spend $500 on the unknown...this is
insane! If someone has SketchUp Pro and would like to help us with this file conversion it would be very much appreciated.
The regular version of SketchUp does not export to any standard CNC able formats recognized by the cut/print control
programs we own.

AutoCAD does not handle splines so its out, FBX is out, OBJ is problematic, XSI is out, VRML is desirable... STL is desireable

Export 3D models in additional formats:

3DS (.3ds)
AutoCAD DWG (.dwg)
AutoCAD DXF (.dxf)
FBX (.fbx).
OBJ (.obj)
XSI (.xsi)
VRML (.vrml)

One example is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kei0gmOwZ5Q

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Old 01-27-2014, 02:22 PM   #84
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How to Convert and Export Google SketchUp SKP Files to STL for 3D Printing


Wiki > How to Convert and Export Google SketchUp SKP Files to STL for 3D Printing
So you designed a nice model in Google SketchUp and you want to make it on your Airwolf 3D printer. Here is the preferred way to export models from SketchUp in STL format:
You will need an STL “exporter” plug in for SketchUp. Here is a link to a free exporter: http://www.guitar-list.com/download-...les-dxf-or-stl . This nifty little plugin will enable you to export your model in STL format. At this site you can download the plugin and read up on the documentation. It is also compatible with: SkeinForge, FreeMill, Vectric Cut-3D, Roland Modela Player, Boxford’s 3D GeoCAM, Carvewright Designer software, DeskProtoLite, MeshCAM Art, Art Cam.


http://airwolf3d.com/wiki/how-to-con...r-3d-printing/




Hope That Helps, Chellie

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Old 01-27-2014, 03:00 PM   #85
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Thumbs up STL Exporting From "standard" SketchUp

Thanks Chellie:

I posted one of the one's I found and am looking for endorsements of it of another. I like the fact
the one you posted does a Cut3D middleware so I can integrate the SKP directly to slicing and dicing
control so everything is in SKP right up until the slice/dice/print/cut physical activity. As I am sure
you are aware of...the least converting...the better. Wow, this even exports to the Sears mill so you
can drive those. Don't know if they are still available... They were beginning to look attractive back
four years ago but no one was developing alterations to "Z" axis control.


Ed

Originally Posted by CHELLIE View Post
How to Convert and Export Google SketchUp SKP Files to STL for 3D Printing


Wiki > How to Convert and Export Google SketchUp SKP Files to STL for 3D Printing
So you designed a nice model in Google SketchUp and you want to make it on your Airwolf 3D printer. Here is the preferred way
to export models from SketchUp in STL format:
You will need an STL “exporter” plug in for SketchUp. Here is a link to a free exporter:
http://www.guitar-list.com/download-...les-dxf-or-stl .

This nifty little plugin will enable you to export your model in STL format. At this site you can download the plugin and read up
on the documentation. It is also compatible with: SkeinForge, FreeMill, Vectric Cut-3D, Roland Modela Player, Boxford’s 3D GeoCAM,
Carvewright Designer software, DeskProtoLite, MeshCAM Art, Art Cam.


http://airwolf3d.com/wiki/how-to-con...r-3d-printing/

Hope That Helps, Chellie

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Old 01-27-2014, 03:34 PM   #86
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Default CADspan Looks Good So Far

Chellie, thanks for the lead into what eventually provided to be more than one solution.

Unfortunately, the lead you provided and its download failed to initiate leaving me a did
not open screen... What appears to be a functionality of a software must be survive
extensive qualification because X to one software can be a less than X to another. This
can be witnessed in the multiple subformats of .tif, .tiff to name but one.

However I found:

CADspan menu accompanys
the converter. Thankfully I found CADspan worked with absolutely no problem downloading. I
will work through it and report on it late tomorrow or day after.

Information Page

CADspan Plugin User Guide

Info and Tutorial Videos


SketchUp Demo File

Help Page


Chellie, thanks for the lead into what eventually provided more than one solution.

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Old 01-27-2014, 04:51 PM   #87
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FWIW.. Autocad recent versions does handle splines. So using AutoCad as a way of converting might be possible.
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Old 01-27-2014, 06:07 PM   #88
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Default Thanks But...

Originally Posted by JetPlaneFlyer View Post
FWIW.. Autocad recent versions does handle splines. So using AutoCad as a way of
converting might be possible.
Thanks for your suggestion but we are already knee deep in our solution and only wanted to convert some SKP cockpit
renderings to STL for printing, not redo our entire project for sake of its cockpit... ;^)

For those who are unaware of such things...CAD programs do not share common protocols where they can be used in an
interchangable manner. Each has its own file extension and in most cases do not include many alternative extensions to
share with other programs.

AutoCAD in particular has been problematic with respect to this as they created a universe within which they early on
(30 years ago) force fit their customers into "in their opinion at the time" to protect market share. This however did not
prove to be the case as CAD moved to the micro CPU where portability became key to using what for the most part had
only been a pre-engineeering release development tool for industry.

Today there are many versions and types of CAD hosted on everything from an IBM async host to an Android workstation
version intended to best utilize corporate communication pathways...private and public alike with Cloud Communications
Pathways.

However, for the most part over the last 30 years of CAD/CAM there has evolved an extremely small number of CAD/CAM
programs capable of a team work force to effectively contribute to a single project from multiple locations...in real time or
offline to update when convenient.

I have noticed there is a severe case of "Oh yea....CAD or CAD/CAM" being passed back and forth as an inexpensive way
to scale model or model design in general. I am here to clear this up....that is BS. Utilizing CAD and CAD/CAM is expensive
for any modeler at this point in scale modeling. (January 28, 2014).

The only people taking exception to that will be people who either already know 2D-3D CAD and 3D CAD/CAM. So what
are the rest of us to do when we see these technologies used to provide astounding results and solutions to otherwise a
very difficult modeling issue. Unless you are blind you have quickly recognized drawing is a downtime and CNC machining
is a time saver. Why can't we go from existing drawings to CNC machining...as a 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 or maybe 8 step process?

Four years ago when I began this project I took the above as a personal challenge and task to resolve for John Doe R/C'er.
Over the closing phases of this B-47 project you will be introduced to a "Tool Kit" for solutions utilizing CAD in its multiple
mechanical configurations to achieve CAM. These to include CNC Milling, Hot Wire, Laser Scanning and Cutting for as little
as $2.5k's and no more than the high $8k's. This is cheap folks... Alternative systems would start at $4k and go to $16k
and still not achieve a complete scale modeling package par to what CAD2SKY puts together.

Look at it as an investment in your scale r/c modeling. An initial investment of say $3k and an additional $3k for two more
years and you would be completely armed to make a scale replica of any "plastic model kit" on the market...at what ever
size you desire with .002" accuracy. ;^)

Anyone who has read the three segments of our B-47 project understand our concepts and how we have enhanced CAD/
CAM functionality as a "tool" with which a scale modeler can qucikly create a scale model, a competitive flying scale model
in 1/3 the time previously required. CAD2Sky Copyright 2014 BuyAero.com is your solution...proof is seen in the B-47 we
will compete with when completed.

Ed

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Old 01-29-2014, 08:48 PM   #89
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Default Slice & Dice Preview



Sketchup enabled with CADspan permits saving the skp file as a printable stl as long as there are no holes in the image file.
Sketchup's slice view enables you to preview or inspect the image for holes which will show up as darker red voids, these
should not be confused with intentional empty space as found within closed shapes as seen above.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvdUb...layer_embedded

This images does have holes, not many, but it does have them on other side of the cockpit tub. For the moment I am ignoring
them as I was to see this file as a solid or as solid as it can be printable stl the obvious point of this in the first place. Some
errors are acceptable if they do not detract from the final printed object. Remember everything weighs X.



Note the red encircled new SketchUp menu icons representing the CADspan control functions to heal the holes (missing solid
geometry). If we are as fortunate as I think we are...we are well into closing up CAD2SKY Toolbox Level I.

Questions?

If you are a SketchUp user you really need to share the wealth... Now is the time for your contribution to not only our B-47
project, but to the growth of WattFlyer's competitive flying scale modeling forum. We need to see more electric scale models
in competition. Trade that dead weight of fuel for batteries and larger airframes

How many of you have or know someone who has a CNC mill or printer?

The degree of detail is endless, whether you were to print instrument panel smooth faced and glue bezels and instrument faces
to it, or print the entire instrument sans the smooth instrument face.





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Old 01-30-2014, 02:50 PM   #90
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In the use of CADspan it is either a free plug in to SketchUp with basic functions or
a composition service capable of literally delivering either a computer file for CAD or
a printed image for your project.

You do not have to own a 3D printer...they do In either case, if you use services
of LGM aka CADspan, you can do it on a project by project basis...even a daily rate.

Below are current rates for services as of Jan. 30, 2014. They provide turnkey quotes.







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Old 01-31-2014, 08:45 PM   #91
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I am building an index of stl components to print. Glued together looks like the single
file image above. Acetone is used to join/melt parts together. This is of no difference

Testing the printer performance per cubic inch by cubic inch permits you to know the
capability to achieve what you need at X % of the whole component...in our case its
the entire cockpit.

The above index will establish how much can be printed "together" at a single printing
and end with that part retaining its dims properly to permit it to be joined with all the
others to create the whole component.

Sound stupidly simple or simplistic? If so, hope you have tons of $ to throw at printing
ABS parts. If your use of a 3D printer is in the realm of DIY as a hobby then spend to
your heart's content.

Many of the parts in our cockpit just might be printed in corn starch...then coated with
a polymer similar to that being sold by Wow Planes as a sealant for hot wired foam. The
answer to this is "after" analysis is completed...aka we are through our learning curve.

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Old 01-31-2014, 10:29 PM   #92
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Default LABS, After All This Time...Enjoy



This will visually explain the LABS (Low Altitude Bombing System) maneuver.

Note:
Change in heading on film (to port) is typical of near-stall at apex of maneuver
where airspeed can be as little as 85 mph through maneuver apex. In the film
frame above change is seen to the pilot's left with a continued full throttle dive
to increase distance between weapon detonation and the airframe after release.



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Old 02-17-2014, 07:16 PM   #93
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Default 3D Printing, Where The ABS Meets Your Specification



Basically when you open up your Up!3D printer you will find these elements need to be assembled in a precise, yet simple
process to calibrate easily in order to provide consistent X,Y,Z travel of the print nozzle as it traverses the perimeter of
the 5.5 cubic inch. print field in which your parts are printed.


There are multiple colors (aka weights & strengths) of ABS plastic on reels in the form of monofilament. The printer will also
print cornstarch. While you may look at the printing material as overhead vs. investment in
durability this is a critical area
unless you have a design you can request a seller to print a portion of in both medium for destructive analysis before you
purchase.


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Old 02-17-2014, 08:05 PM   #94
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Old 02-17-2014, 08:14 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by CHELLIE View Post
Now Hear This, Now Hear This, Happy 1 Year Anniversary Its been 1 Year Already, And No Airplane / Jet To Much Chit Chat and no Results Time to Get off the Old Behind and Build something Forget about the CNC and get to work Building the Old fashion Way / Old School That is All.

No Chellie, it's been over four years since the project started: http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52194

maybe I'm just impatient but i gave up on ever seeing anything built years ago. I genuinely hope I am wrong.


FWIW...The real B-47 took about three years from concept to maiden flight
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Old 02-17-2014, 08:20 PM   #96
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I may be getting Older, But I Refuse to grow Up I am Having to much Fun to Grow Up LOL
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Old 02-17-2014, 10:12 PM   #97
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Default showing grave poverty of thought...

Just ignore those last few posts there Ed These misguided, but none the less well intentioned souls, have no staying power, and will hang their heads in burning shame when this project lifts off the runway for a perfect maiden. Don't suppose you have any photo's of your last project, so we can get a glimpse of what to expect ( hint, hint)
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Old 02-18-2014, 04:19 PM   #98
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Default Cavalier

Wow,

Unfortunately, I anticipated this lack of patience and cavalier points of view as we neared this point in this project.
While some might expect a spewing of childish knee jerk reply...I leave the above self proclaimed explainations of the
complainers ignorance for what they are worth...or in this case, not...

cavalier, adjective: Having or showing no concern for something that is important or serious...

Full Definition of CAVALIER : Marked by or given to offhand and often disdainful dismissal of important matters...
<a cavalier attitude toward money>

Pattern, I attribute the above negative posts to a lack of understanding how our model is constructed compared to
typical 4.5 to 5.5 year turnaround for a competitive model constructed the "old fashion" way. To try to relate "old"
with "school" witnesses a total lack of understanding. That's OK, and as I stated earlier in this thread...is something
which has to be accepted by some people as a natural short coming.

Delays witnessed in this project and what we achieved to overcome each are well documented to an excess in vivid
color. So, to complain is to proclaim...

Ed Clayman
"Flite-Metal For The Look Of The Real Thing"
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Old 02-18-2014, 05:28 PM   #99
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Default .STL Continuity & Nurbs Editing

Printing a part properly requires a "closed" geometry. Though .stl files can be solid geometry, they do not have to be "solid".
The unclosed shapes or portions there of are simply not printed. The closed areas around them are. This is a salvation in the
fact we can easily put a foam place holder in these areas one the other components are printed...or milled.



The above image is that of the cockpit sliced vertically relative to its final shape and positioning. It will not necessarily be
printed in this position. It will be printed with the opposite side "face up" leaving exposed spaces and voids (shown in red)
to the rear, or in this case the back side of each cockpit half.

When closed solids are printed the printer software places a virutal solid back or base onto the "to be printed" part(s).


Note the faint red line within the throttle quad of the above image. We need not worry about these because throttles are
being printed indivdually for assembly back into the throttle quad slots for each individual engine plus two master throttle.
Additional thin red lines appear within above drawing. These are edited to become part of the solid model using CADSpan
or the Nurbs editor within the UP!3D software accompanying the printer.

As stated earlier, until tested and proven to provide consistant clean results there is no guarrantee this Nerbs editing will
provide the desired result. AKA, time consuming review.

Ed Clayman
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Old 02-18-2014, 10:22 PM   #100
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Default

Originally Posted by Flite-Metal View Post
Wow,

Unfortunately, I anticipated this lack of patience and cavalier points of view as we neared this point in this project.
While some might expect a spewing of childish knee jerk reply...I leave the above self proclaimed explainations of the
complainers ignorance for what they are worth...or in this case, not...

cavalier, adjective: Having or showing no concern for something that is important or serious...

Full Definition of CAVALIER : Marked by or given to offhand and often disdainful dismissal of important matters...
<a cavalier attitude toward money>

Pattern, I attribute the above negative posts to a lack of understanding how our model is constructed compared to
typical 4.5 to 5.5 year turnaround for a competitive model constructed the "old fashion" way. To try to relate "old"
with "school" witnesses a total lack of understanding. That's OK, and as I stated earlier in this thread...is something
which has to be accepted by some people as a natural short coming.

Delays witnessed in this project and what we achieved to overcome each are well documented to an excess in vivid
color. So, to complain is to proclaim...
No doubt the comments by Chellie and Jetplaneflyer were meant to be taken tongue in cheek, with no offence intended. If you have read some of their posts in the past in other threads, they are both quite experienced builders and pilots, well natured and dedicated to the cause. In a world of "I want it done yesterday", and the ARF culture, builds like this are an increasing rarity. My other interests include classic motorcycle and fire arm restoration, and some of these projects run into a decade of searching for the elusive part, or painstakingly getting one aspect historically accurate. Of course I could just go and buy a replica made in Taiwan, or take a short cut with the hidden details, but that defeats the purpose.

I'm keeping a case of top quality Australian beer ready to open the day she lifts off the runway
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