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World Models P-51D Mustang "EP" 49 inch Wing Span

Old 12-07-2008, 11:49 PM
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Default World Models P-51D Mustang "EP" 49 inch Wing Span

Okay, back in November 12th, 2008:

http://www.airborne-models.com/html/...?ProductID=134

I got a telephone call from David, the owner of HOBBY TOWN USA in Melbourne, Florida who ordered my World Models P-51D Mustang "EP" from Airborne-Models in Livermore, California. It came in four days after he ordered it.

I came running after work and was completely impressed as this is a truely "Electric" designed model of the P-51D Mustang. Does it miss certain scale details? But, of course, however, you can easily make up by slightly modifying the Tail wheel which I am going to do and other minor aspects.
I actually did not purchase this model because of it's scale detail but, rather it's Light construction and strong assembly up front where it counts unlike some E-Flite models that have honeycomb Frontal Fire walls. This Mustang has a solid Plywood mount with screw retainer inserts already drilled in for the World Models recommended Plastic Mount for their Outrunner Brushless motor.

I have taken a few pictures of a weigh-in session that I quickly made as I was assembling the model short of glue and inserting a power system and radio gear.

The first couple of pictures shows the wing assembly with the Plywood joiner and retracts+wheels (This is how the models comes right out of the box) and it's weight was:

11 7/8 oz. = Wing assembly + Retacts + wheels + Wing Joiner
Now I assembled the model with the FUSE, Cowling, tail group, pilot figure, canopy and wing assembly and that tipped the digital scale at:

1lbs. - 8 1/2oz. = Wing assembly + FUSE (empty weight)

3 3/4 oz. = hardware bag and underside scoop piece.

Therefore, for a total Empty Weight of : 1lbs. - 12 1/4oz.

I am so glad that I ordered and bought this fine model from my Hobby Shop near work and also glad that I fit checked (Assembled the model as much as possible to see the quality and let me tell you it is super quality, Top Notch!!)

One word of caution, when placing the wing assembly on the Fuse you need to gently work it as it is a nice tight fit, procession fit and the wing would seem at first like it was not jigged correctly to fit the underside of the FUSE but, I assure you if your work the screws that hold down the wing assembly down at the rear, the wing assembly will eventuallly come flush with the FUSE!! Have patience!!!

OH YES, NOTICE THERE ARE NO DECALS APPLIED TO THIS MODEL OUT FROM THE BOX!

Pictures attached:
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Old 12-07-2008, 11:51 PM
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Default Hobby town usa!!!

Not only was HOBBY TOWN USA happy to order this fine model for me...they gave me a 10% discount and the total therefore was

$139.99 less 10% = $125.99

Local Tax: $7.56

Grand Total: $133.55
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Old 12-07-2008, 11:54 PM
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Default Power System Selection

My Hobby Zone Super Cub with ailerons and the model that has presently the E-Flite 480 (1020Kv) brushless outrunner and hooked up my Astro Flight WATT Meter and this is what I got.

Wide Open while swinging the APC "SLow Flyer" 10 X 7
30.4 AMPs / 312 Watts / 10.7 Volts under load


Some of the other members were surprised and several items blow off from the setup table when I measured this AMP Draw at the RC Club!

Recall my estimated flight ready weight of the model to be 2.8lbs.


312 Watts / 2.8lbs. = 111.4 Watts / lbs.

Stay tuned.

Last edited by guapoman2000; 12-08-2008 at 04:40 AM.
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Old 12-07-2008, 11:57 PM
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Default E-Flite 480 (1020Kv) Motor weigh-in with Mount

I have ported over a picture of a weigh-in session for the mighty E-Flite 480 (1020Kv) brushless outrunner motor!

The plastic mount weighs 15 grams or almost half of an ounce.
Motor is therefore, 3.54oz there abouts.

My Good friend Gerry (Simano) was the one who suggested this power system as I told him that I wanted something scale and lightest Wing Loading as Possible.
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:05 AM
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Default Power System Installation Pre-OPS

Well, I was surprised to find a bunch of AXI motors, specifically the AXI 2820/10 that tips the digital scale at 5 3/8oz without bullet connectors, however, it delivers even more KV (1100Kv) :o .

I am keeping this motor as a BACK-UP just in case the E-Flite 480 does not provide the correct Center-of-Gravity for the model.
Also, I found a larger capacity Castle Creations ThunderBird 54 AMP Brushless ESC and it tips the digital scale at 1 1/2oz. and I am going to use this one for the Mustang for forward weight to help out the Center-of-Gravity as much as possible.

Okay, going back to the E-Flite 480 Brushless Motor, I happened to find the plastic motor mount custom made for it in my supply box and it seems to be perfect for the Mustang

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...rodId=EFLM1915

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...rodID=EFLM1916

So far, I am excited that it will keep this model very light. Notice that I am using an aluminum hollow tube for measuring the Plywood firewall clearance to the edge of cowling. Also, noticed that I am doing this with the entire motor, prop adapter and spinner all installed to make sure that there will be no surprises or mis-steps.

The plastic spinner is so large and not the best balanced but, not bad either.

Some progress pictures.....I am off to HOME DEPOT for some mounting machine screws with plastic anchor sleeve at the nuts.
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:07 AM
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Default Servo Selections

I am using the Hitec HS-81MG (MG=Metal Gear) for both the rudder and most importantly for this Model the Elevator as the Elevator has both rods going the both halves of the Elevator and is coupled within the FUSE with a Plastic sandwich plastic plate.

I am using the Park Zone long lead Servos that come with the T-28 Trojan for the Ailerons as they seem to be very rugged and I have crashed my T-28 Trojan twice and those servos keep on ticking.
The Retracts,

For the Retracts, it will be another HS-81MG
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:10 AM
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Default A few Building Tips!!!

Whatever you do, please do not start assembling your model until you all ready these instructions carefully.

1. Each hardware bag has a NUMBER STAMPED on the outside of the bag and corresponds to a STEP NUMBER within the assembly manual !!! ( I mistakenly used the Elevator control screws because I was not paying attention!) The Aileron control horn screws are a little longer 12mm instead of the 10mm for the Elevator halves.

2. I certainly installed all Control horns on all control surfaces before hinging any control surface such as the Elevator halfs to the Horizontal Stabilizer etc....etc... Why? because you will have a very hard time trying to screw in those little screws if you install the control surfaces first!

3. I do not have CA and all I have is 5-minute epoxy, a personal habbit but, I do not like those CA hinges as I have seen a few come out to a couple of RC Club members, either they did not wick the CA in far enough or the CA was dry and they thought it went in anyway. Therefore, for added strength, I use computer Floppy material and carefully use 5-Minute epoxy to secure and wipe any excess so, it won't create any permanent adhesion to the control surface onto the fixed stab area. Also, done correctly these Computer Floppy material allows the control surface to move with little resistance and saves on servo juice! You guys that are comfortable using the CA then, disregard.

4. I belive this one is very IMPORTANT! The aileron bag of hardware comes with these tiny "BALSA" blocks so, you can secure the Ailerons servos onto these tiny "BALSA" blocks assuming you glue them to the underside of the aileron cover. I don't know about you all but, I certainly do not want to risk a SOFT "BALSA" block to be the one that withstands the pressure of aileron movement during DYNAMICE FLIGHT plus, you need to screw in a tiny screw into the "BALSA", Oh, I am sure you need to pre-drill the hole so, the Screw will not split the "BALSA" as you screw the retaining screws to hold down the servos. The actual screws to secure the Servos onto these "BALSA" blocks are not supplied. Therefore, I used HARDWOOD and had to saw ... saw to size, glued them on the underside of the Aileron cover doors and used these custom HARDWOOD blocks to screw in the aileron Servos!!! I certainly do not want anyone to lose their model because they went with what was supplied!!! :o

5. By using the Long Lead Park Zone (T-28 Trojan) analog Servos, I was able to feed the long lead cable harness through the wing without the need to mess with that string inside the wing. I did not mess with the string so, It will fly with the model. Also, I have lots of slack of the long lead aileron servo cables and I bought the little pig tail Y-Harness that is used for the Park Zone T-28 Trojan. This setup saved me from buying two aileron extensions and keeps the model light as you do not have two plastic connectors.

6. Make sure you break out a pair of fresh Epoxy bottles, especially when you are ready to glue the Wing Halves!!! This is pretty important as a brand new Epoxy bottle will quickly cure and provide a very strong bond.

Other ISSUES:

I finally took out my brand new Spektrum DX-7 Transmitter from it's box and charged the Transmitter battery plus I took out one brand new Spektrum AR-7000 receiver. I inserted the Bind Plug at the BATTERY port on the AR-7000, made sure the Transmitter was OFF, and connected the Flight battery then, I turned on the Transmitter while holding the Bind button at the rear of Transmitter and all came to Life! Well, the only thing I had connected to the Receiver was the motor and it spinned in the correct direction!!

Going to continue working on this model!!

I am not used to working with tiny screws, and hardware!

All these RTF Foamies pretty much have spoiled me!
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:17 AM
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Default Motor Mounting

A few Pictures of the progress.......dang small screws!

Big Gorilla Hands are not a good combination with tiny screws!
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:24 AM
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Default Motor Mounting Continued!

More Pictures!
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:34 AM
  #10  
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Default Model Assembly Pictures!

Model's Assembly Pictures.
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:39 AM
  #11  
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Default Retract Servo Installation

I spent about 3 hours trying to get those retracts working. First I found one Hitec HS-81 for the job and it looked new so, I went for it and installed it. Fortunately, I did not install it permanently as I quickly got the AR-7000 receiver with it's pig tail receiver in tow and decided to make sure I can work the correct placement per the diagram in the instructions.

Well, I had to rebind the Spektrum system as it saw that I had a new configuration than before, no problem and it got back to life very quickly. However, I Flipped the Landing Gear Switch and NOTHING!!! I quickly got another servo and removed and replaced the connector at the Labeled "GEAR" and I Flipped the Switch again and the 2nd servo spinned! I must have selected a DEAD servo to begin with!

Anyway, the 2nd servo is a Hitec HS-82MG (Metal Gear) and it work great, however, here we go again, I set up everything like in the Diagram and Flipped the Switch and it wanted to go Gear Down direction (The Gear was already Down!!!). It took me a while perhaps almost one hour to figure out that all I had to do was to reverse the freaking servo from the fancy DX-7 menu.

Speaking of Gorrilla Hands / Fingers, I had the hardest time placing the retract servo screws (standard Hitec securing screws) within the retract compartment. Everytime I did the freaking screw fell inside the wing and had to fish it out. One time, I thought the screw was going to fly with the model in a permanent manner!!! I finally got out the screw and was able to get both servo screws within the holes I made using the cordless drill and I celebrated!!!!

A few pics AND MOST IMPORTANTLY I AM UPLOADING A VIDEO OF THE RETRACT FUNCTION!!!!
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:42 AM
  #12  
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Default Video Of Retracts!!!

RETRACT ACTION!


[media]http://www.vimeo.com/2258359[/media]
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:48 AM
  #13  
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Default Final Retract Setup & Main Gear Doors

Guys,

I believe that the wing assembly is finally complete and with the FINAL retract configuration plus I have the nice Main Gear Doors on cure!
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:54 AM
  #14  
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Default Mustang Completed!!!

Mustang is complete!!!

Warning:


Please take care in working the Plastic Clevis parts with the push rods before installing them within the model. These Clevis parts were a Royal Pain in the Rusty Dusty as twisting them "or" screwing them onto the Push Rods were a nightmare!


Some pic's!
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:59 AM
  #15  
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Default What's the FULLY FLIGHT READY WEIGHT???

Guys,

The push rods were too long at the servos so, I used my Bolt Cutters and cut off the L-Bend and instead I used Dubro's Quick Disconnect securing method.

Here are proof pictures showing you all that my new World Models P-51D Mustang "EP" tipped the digital scale at 1lbs. - 12 1/2 oz. "or" 2.75lbs.

A far cry from the expected using the World Models recommended power system with 4-Cells and the heavier motor that they say can be as high as 3.8lbs.
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:06 AM
  #16  
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Default My Finished P-51D Mustang by World Models!

My finished P-51D Mustang by World Models :p
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:07 AM
  #17  
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Default Video of completed P-51D Mustang!

Anyway, here's the VIDEO I promised after I completed the Model!

[media]http://www.vimeo.com/2262085[/media]
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:18 AM
  #18  
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Default IT's A GO FOR MAIDEN!

IT's A GO FOR MAIDEN!!!!

My buddy Gerry will meet me at the RC Club right at 0700 hours and will bring his Video Camcorder, at least I will bring mine in case he forgets!
I have corrected the wobbly Spinner and thanks to GWS parts, most specifically Propeller inserts that saved the day!

I had to of course, drill into the Back Plate Spinner that came with the model and one size of the GWS Propeller inserts fitted like a glove without any need for glue!

I just ran up the motor and that Ugly vibration as shown in the Video has gone!

I am heading to the RC Field!!

Carlos
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:23 AM
  #19  
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Default Maiden Flight Summary

Flight Summary:

Got to the RC Club field at exactly 0648am and opened the gate. I called Gerry to know his estimate time of arrival and he told me that he was 10 minutes away so, I used this time to find a good area to take off and land.
As soon as I saw Gerry pull up to the park side, I quickly inserted the Bind Plug and got the process going to bind the Transmitter DX-7 with the AR-7000 receiver and did so without any issues. As a matter of fact, I disconnected the Flight Battery and Reconnected to show Gerry that as long as you keep the Transmitter on the Receiver seems to keep bind.

I had already walked the field before Gerry had arrived so; I selected the patch where I was to place the model for take-off and did so. Gerry was Video recording the entire event from when I picked up the model from the RC Club’s setup table and I placed the model as planned.

A good Pre-Flight Check to make sure all control surfaces were turning correctly and I moved the Throttle forward and maintained some Up elevator and the model started to roll and quickly took off after perhaps 20 feet for a scale run and it started to zoom upwards and I maintained level flight as I wanted a scale look so, gave a little down Elevator and she quickly returned level flight. The model was heading towards the lake and this is expected as this was the direction of the wind during take-off and I started to give her a right hand turn when all of the sudden I lost all control, the motor shut down and nothing….

Fortunately, that last command took and the model did make it to the control surfaces and made the model turn and such that it crashed landed at the beam or soft patch area where water over-flow flows ajacent to the runway field and it was dry but, super soft. The model just came down from 60 feet up in a nose first attitude and the Rudder got off its hinges to my surprise as I know I used good amount of epoxy! Anyway the Cowling’s paint got shattered on both side at the bottom and the Motor’s plastic Stick mount broke off and motor was just dangling halfway outside the cowling. Therefore, the only thing that really broke on this model was the Propeller and Motor Stick mount!

I feel that a combination saved my model from complete destruction and that was Soft Patch of field with mushy ground, the E-Flite Plastic Motor Stick Mount, and let’s not forget LUCK as the model could have easily ended up in the Lake!

Certainly, there is something wrong with the Spektrum Radio gear I have and I am ripping everything out and going back to my Good Old Trusted BERG 7-Channel 72 Mhz FM super narrow band radio system!
Video will be posted after work!

Stay tuned to see that E-Flite 480 (1020Kv) Lift 2.75lbs. of Warbird model!

Carlos
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:28 AM
  #20  
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Default Maiden Flight VIDEO

Came home with a bad headache as I went to two local hobby shops and both were kind to check out my Mustang for me to see what was going on with the overall setup both ESC and Spektrum Radio gear.
Okay, my model suffered from two major problems and here is the skinny and I am afraid that I am completely at fault.

Major Problem #1:

1A. The particular Electronic Speed Control (ESC) that I selected, one Castle Creations Thunderbird 54 has a linear 3.0 AMP maximum output onboard Battery Eliminator Circuit (BEC).

1B. The Mustang has a grand total of Five (5) Servos, three of which are HS-81MG for Rudder, Elevator, Gear and two are Park Zone Long Lead Analog for Ailerons.

1C. The one HS-81MG for the Gear had never been adjusted for "END POINT TRAVEL" to make sure I am not over driving it either in the DOWN or UP position.

Major Problem #2:

2A. Those that alerted me here are correct, even though my Spektrum radio gear is brand new there is something REALLY WRONG with the fact that the Receiver can not keep BIND with the Transmitter. Both Hobby shops were kind enough to determine this irregardless of the situation with the ill fated selection of the ESC.

2B. I verified this by calling the TOLL FREE number on the Spektrum manual for Technical Support in the page that discusses Binding! They already had me in their computer system and the person on the telephone said that a shipping label was being mailed right away so, I can ship both the Spektrum Transmitter and Receiver to them and turn around is about 7 business days. I told him that I am in no hurry as I am going to install my BERG 7-Channel in my new Mustang with battle scars!


SUMMARY:
I DID NOT measure the steady AMP draw with the Full compliement of 5-Servos during static testing and I may perhaps would have seen that any margin from the 3.0 AMP output linear device onboard from the Castle Creations Thunderbird 54 AMP ESC would be on the edge or gone thereby, the first attempt to turn and activate more than 3 servos such as making a turn would have deminished the Voltage levels for the Spektrum AR7000 and produce an UGLY situation that lost of BIND would occur.

The fact that I found the model with the LED LIGHT "ON" Post Crash just tells us that right before impact the Receiver came back to bind with the Transmitter and my Continuous UP Elevator commanding really worked and reason for my model not completely destroyed!!!!! The Video shows the model coming down vertically but, recall that the model went below ground level as it landed in a water run-off area of the field and there is a very big chance that the model regained BIND and started to Level off before impact. Post Crash pictures show this!

So, the Receiver did it's job but, the ESC was overloaded with 5-Servos being activated for flight and this left a very low margin (3.5 Volts) or below for the the Receiver and possible reason for the crash.
The Bind issue is another problem but, this did not have an range issue.

Corrective Actions:
I have purchased one E-Flite 40-AMP Lite Pro Brushless ESC with Switch-Mode BEC and Advanced Programming. This device allows for up to 7 analog or 6 digital standard sized servos with the BEC on any "recommended" input Voltage, up to 6-Cell Li-POLYs!!! The cost $69.99 plus tax.

I will ship the Spektrum Radio gear to Horizon Hobby using the pre-printed mailing label and instructions as soon as it arrives and I will install the Castle Creations BERG 7-Channel Super narrow band 72Mhz FM receiver instead.

Okay,
VIDEO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Please note that this power system is capable of flying this model!!!
A Special Thanks to Gerry (Simano) for taking this Video Footage!!!

[media]http://www.vimeo.com/2271793[/media]
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:35 AM
  #21  
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Default Maiden Flight Pictures, Pre and Post Flight!

Hi guys,

Got these off from my Camera to show you all the action from yesterday's morning with the maiden flight of my Mustang.

A couple of pictures show the Impact area and surrounding arear that the model crash landed.

A few other pictures show the Future for my P-51D Mustang with respect to Electronic Speed and Control and repair parts!
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:41 AM
  #22  
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Default Post Crash continued.

A few more pictures see captions!
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:52 AM
  #23  
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Default Repairs are Complete!

I owe myself a complete flight, Take-Off, performance evaluation, and landing with the E-Flite 480 (1020Kv) Brushless Outrunner and swinging the APC "Slow Flyer" 10 X 7 propeller.

This time some improvements, a much better Balanced Spinner with Aluminum back plate, E-Flite 40-AMP ESC with Switch Mode BEC onboard! Oh, yes, my Castle Creations BERG 7-Channel DSP Super Narrow 72Mhz FM Band receiver! I flew the model with my JR XP 7202 Syth 72Mhz FM Transmitter!

Some pictures of hard work in the Wee hours of the night!
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:54 AM
  #24  
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Default Re-MAIDEN VIDEO!!!!!!!

Okay guys,

Let me fess up here and let me dedicate this VIDEO to my Sky Brother, best Amigo, Gerry (Simano).

Why?

Because it was "Gerry" who suggested to use the E-Flite 480 (1020Kv) Brushless Outrunner. At the time this motor was flying onboard in my Hobby Zone Super Cub with Ailerons (Modified).
Well, I just stood there and stopped to think for a moment and everything else is History!!!

HIP HIP HOORAY TO GERRY!!!!


VIDEO!!!!!
[media]http://www.vimeo.com/2296617[/media]
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:57 AM
  #25  
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Default Flight Re-Maiden Summary!

Flight Re-Maiden Summary:

I was HALF ASLEEP when you interviewed me after the flight and while he was recording with the Video Camcorder.

What I was trying to say in that Video "is" that this model handled very "Light" on the controls due to it's Light Wing Loading. However, it is EVERY BIT OF P-51D MUSTANG as if you apply too rapid Up Elevator for Landing she will do the Nasty on you, Tip Stall.

Had I not moved the sticks the model would have made the best landing ever!

Those Generic 3-Cell Li-POLYs that I am using are really the 2200mAH Cells, I am sure it was a typo on your part Gerry

I like to thank you Gerry for Suggesting the E-Flight 480 (1020Kv) and taking all of my Video footage sessions!!!!
You are a Pal !!
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