HELP! Spektrum DX7 radio failure? - Page 8 - WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight

RC Radios, Transmitters, Receivers, Servos, gyros Discussion all about rc radios, transmitters, receivers, servos, etc.

HELP! Spektrum DX7 radio failure?

Old 08-10-2007, 09:50 PM
  #176  
Lieutenant Loughead
UNCLUB OWNER
Thread Starter
 
Lieutenant Loughead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 4,406
Default

I think I may add a new test to my list --> The AR6100 will be powered by a 2s 800 mAh LiPo.

Also, I have a GWS ICS480 BRUSHED speed control I can test with... (Though, I really don't believe I should be forced to diagnose Spektrum's problems!)

I could also range check with no servos connected...

I've read some interesting stories on the internet about SEFF and Spektrum. It seems there were lots of Spektrum related crashes at SEFF, and not a single FM related crash.

One case in particular held my attention --> The DX7 transmitter had enough power to range check an AR7000, but not an AR6100.

What the *&^%$#@!
Lieutenant Loughead is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 09:59 PM
  #177  
rcers
Super Contributor
 
rcers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Trophy Club TX
Posts: 6,314
Default

Ummmmm

Have you used a 4 cell NiCad/NiMh pack - NO ESC in any of your testing? You have got to take the ESC out of the equation.....

Mike
rcers is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 10:09 PM
  #178  
Mike Freas
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Kaeohe Bay Hawaii
Posts: 989
Default

I'm still thinking you got a lemon TX. Is there anyone else around with a DX-7 you could try your RX's with their TX?

I fly with 5 or 6 guys every weekend and only once witnessed a lock out. We found that his ESC/BEC fried while flying killing all power to the RX.
Mike Freas is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 10:10 PM
  #179  
Lieutenant Loughead
UNCLUB OWNER
Thread Starter
 
Lieutenant Loughead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 4,406
Default

Originally Posted by rcers View Post
Ummmmm

Have you used a 4 cell NiCad/NiMh pack - NO ESC in any of your testing? You have got to take the ESC out of the equation.....

Mike
Mike,

The simple answer is NO.

The more complex answer is -- I don't own a 4 cell NiCad/NiMh pack. I've been flying for 3-4 years, and have never needed one.

These electronic systems (battery/ESC/motor/gearbox/prop/servos) have proven track records, with over 500 flights. I switched to from 72 MHz to Spektrum, fly for a few months with NO problems, and suddenly the entire system goes to pot!

In my P-38 crash, I used a SmartBEC. Since I fly electric aircraft, I can not take the ESC completely out of the equation. :o

HOWEVER, I will remove the ESC in my TESTING to see what kind of results I get. Yet, if my Castle Creations ESCs do not work with Spektrum receivers, I won't be very happy about that! (I think I own 6 Phoenix 25 ESCs, 1 Phoenix 45 ESC, 2 Thunderbird 9 ESCs, and 1 Thunderbird 18 ESC!)
Lieutenant Loughead is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 10:11 PM
  #180  
Rabbitcreekok
Community Moderator
 
Rabbitcreekok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: McAlester, Oklahoma
Posts: 8,483
Default

Sorry, I missed that.

Just another suggestion. Would it help to rebind the receivers to the transmitter?
Rabbitcreekok is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 10:20 PM
  #181  
UncleBob
Still Flying G3 ...
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 984
Default

That's just not right. I'd like you to tell us precisely how you determine the range test has failed - I use the very unscientific "waggle the sticks and see the surfaces wiggle" technique. I've NEVER had a range test fail, ever.

I have witnessed a loss of link with the range test (bind) button in at a distance of well over 100', but that's not a failure so much as "as designed" I believe. Even in that case (both the AR6100 and DX7 antenna were in nearly co-linear alignment) just turn the radio to the side or walking 20'-30' to the right made the link re-establish.
UncleBob is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 10:26 PM
  #182  
rcers
Super Contributor
 
rcers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Trophy Club TX
Posts: 6,314
Default

HOWEVER, I will remove the ESC in my TESTING to see what kind of results I get. Yet, if my Castle Creations ESCs do not work with Spektrum receivers, I won't be very happy about that! (I think I own 6 Phoenix 25 ESCs, 1 Phoenix 45 ESC, 2 Thunderbird 9 ESCs, and 1 Thunderbird 18 ESC!)
Well - I have to be honest I no longer use CC controllers (for the most part). I have 1000+ flights on DX6 and DX7 without a single issue.

So we have to look at something here.

By the way I have 6-7 ar6100's including 2 that are "old" versions. Again zero issues.

My AR6100's never range check far. I would forget those results.

Get a Cheap slow stick - fly it stock so you are invested at $30usd plane/motor and a few more bucks for battery. Fly it.

I bet it works - and I suspect you won't find any more issues.

I see you have checked with the 7000 RX have you tested with a 6000?

I just can't figure it out.....

What I do know is Horizon. They are good guys - including their techs in service. They certainly don't want to rip you off and I am confident the system performed well for them. They don't want you unhappy - or you leave them and never come back. We have long memories.

Test with the slow stick - even if it locks out you are out very little.

Mike
rcers is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 10:28 PM
  #183  
rcers
Super Contributor
 
rcers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Trophy Club TX
Posts: 6,314
Default

One other idea - maybe it is environment - have you tried your checks at different places - somewhere miles away from home or field where you are testing?

Mike
rcers is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 10:36 PM
  #184  
Mr. Baggins
Goofball
 
Mr. Baggins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: God's country
Posts: 1,353
Default

I think this is the first thread I have read all the way thru in a very long time. Riveting stuff.

Sorry about your problems with the radio LL
Mr. Baggins is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 11:33 PM
  #185  
Lip84
Member
 
Lip84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 440
Default

Originally Posted by rcers View Post
One other idea - maybe it is environment - have you tried your checks at different places - somewhere miles away from home or field where you are testing?

Mike
I think he said he tried it at two locations 4+ miles apart.
Lip84 is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 11:37 PM
  #186  
Lieutenant Loughead
UNCLUB OWNER
Thread Starter
 
Lieutenant Loughead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 4,406
Default

Guys -- please read the entire thread before saying things like "have you tested in different places", and "I see you have checked with the 7000 RX have you tested with a 6000", and "Get a Cheap slow stick - fly it stock so you are invested at $30usd plane/motor and a few more bucks for battery. Fly it." Those answers are already in this thread. (...and all results were BAD!)

Originally Posted by UncleBob View Post
That's just not right. I'd like you to tell us precisely how you determine the range test has failed - I use the very unscientific "waggle the sticks and see the surfaces wiggle" technique. I've NEVER had a range test fail, ever.
LOL -- yeah, that's exactly what I do. I move the aileron/elevator stick in a constant circle, to verify control surfaces are constantly moving, and I start backing away. When I get a failure (control surfaces stop moving for 10+ seconds), I stop, and measure the distance back to the receiver.

Originally Posted by UncleBob View Post
I have witnessed a loss of link with the range test (bind) button in at a distance of well over 100', but that's not a failure so much as "as designed" I believe. Even in that case (both the AR6100 and DX7 antenna were in nearly co-linear alignment) just turn the radio to the side or walking 20'-30' to the right made the link re-establish.
Two things here:
1) My radio system is failing at 25-30 feet.
2) My radio system does not re-establish the link for 10-25 seconds after the link is lost. The Spektrum tech says this can only happen if the transmitter is turned off, and has nothing to do with the receiver.
The Spektrum tech just called me back and asked me to use a 6-cell NiCad battery to power the receiver (no BEC or ESC at all). I guess I spending MORE money on testing, since I have never had a need for a dedicated battery for the receiver...

EEEEWWWWW -- NiCad!
Lieutenant Loughead is offline  
Old 08-10-2007, 11:59 PM
  #187  
UncleBob
Still Flying G3 ...
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 984
Default

Originally Posted by Lieutenant Loughead View Post
The Spektrum tech just called me back and asked me to use a 6-cell NiCad battery to power the receiver (no BEC or ESC at all). I guess I spending MORE money on testing, since I have never had a need for a dedicated battery for the receiver...


EEEEWWWWW -- NiCad!

I'd think a 2s LiPo should be within spec, and .... if not then why not use a dedicated BEC?

Whatever, hope you get it figured out.
UncleBob is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 01:50 AM
  #188  
Twizter68
I can't see my plane.....
 
Twizter68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Mahboula, Kuwait
Posts: 1,376
Default

LL, check and see if the coax is creased (you should be able to see it) in the hinge point where your antenna bends....even a slight crease can cause problems in coax of this diameter.

As to fiberglass.....been flying glassed, covered, wooded planes (even .60 size!) on my DX6 with no problems.......do you know anyone who has one and will let you borrow an AR6000 rx for a few tests? The only times I hear of problems with the DX system, it's always the -7 and the 6100 rx....never heard of a problem with the 7000 rx, or the DX7 and AR6000 rx's.....I have a DX7 on the way, but do not plan on getting any 6100 rx's, simply because of the problems I've been reading about.

On that note, I fly with a bunch of guys who use the DX7/AR6100 combo, and have never had a glitch.....

If you do call Spektrum back, tell the Lvl 1 tech you will only speak with a senior tech or engineer.....
Twizter68 is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 01:56 AM
  #189  
Twizter68
I can't see my plane.....
 
Twizter68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Mahboula, Kuwait
Posts: 1,376
Default

...and before you bite me on it, I did not see where you had tested with a 6000 rx. I'm of the opinion the 6100's have unresolved issues somewhere, so I do not trust them. My 6000's have been through the wringer and back without a system failure......even when I have (not purposefully!) drove them in hard due to dumb thumbs.
Twizter68 is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 03:19 AM
  #190  
marchino61
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 261
Default Is RX or TX Failing?

I have read the posts carefully, and as far as I noticed, you were using the same RX throughout.

Have you changed the RX so that you can see if it is the TX or RX failing the range test?
marchino61 is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 04:38 AM
  #191  
Lieutenant Loughead
UNCLUB OWNER
Thread Starter
 
Lieutenant Loughead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 4,406
Default

Tonight's test:


Test aparatus:
AR6100 receiver (originally in the GWS P-51)
#2 Tanic 2220 mAh 3s LiPo
Spektrum DX7 transmitter
WattsUp meter in-line between the Phoenix 25 BEC and AR6100 receiver


Notes:
Transmitter antenna was turned 90 degrees to the left.
Transmitter was turned on before receiver.
All tests were with the Tx BEHIND the aiplane (so the motor was NOT between the Rx and Tx).


Range Test #1, Site #3:
Range test failed multiple times, with a minimum distance of 39 feet.
WattsUp meter measured minimum voltage during test at 4.90 volts.
Each failure required more than 10 seconds to self-correct.
This test was basicly like the previous six tests -- simply to prove that site #3 was just as good/bad as the previous two sites.


Range Test #2, Site #3:
Changed out TRANSMITTER battery.
Turned Rx and Tx off.
Turned Tx on.
Turned Rx on.
Range test failed multiple times, with a minimum distance of 40 feet.
WattsUp meter measured minimum voltage during test at 4.89 volts.
Each failure required more than 10 seconds to self-correct.


Range Test #3, Site #3:
Disconnected BEC/ESC and motor.
Connected 6-cell NiMh battery directly to AR6100 (as suggested by Spektrum)
Turned Tx on -- odd sound and "magic smoke" escaped from HS-55 servo. (Thanks, Spektrum!)
Range test not possible -- no data collected.
Range Test #4, Site #3:
Attached BEC/ESC and motor.
Disconnected the HS-55 servo Spektrum burned up.
Turned Rx and Tx off.
Turned Tx on.
Turned Rx on.
Range test failed multiple times, with a minimum distance of 46 feet.
WattsUp meter measured minimum voltage during test at 4.91 volts.
Each failure required more than 10 seconds to self-correct.

Range Test #5, Site #3:
Disconnected AR6100 (previously used by GWS P-51)
Attached AR6100 (previously used by flat foamie Zero)
Turned Rx and Tx off.
Turned Tx on.
Turned Rx on.
Range test failed multiple times, with a minimum distance of 41 feet.
WattsUp meter measured minimum voltage during test at 4.91 volts.
Each failure required more than 10 seconds to self-correct.

Range Test #6, Site #3:
Disconnected AR6100 (previously used by flat foamie Zero)
Attached AR7000 (NEW)
Turned Rx and Tx off.
Turned Tx on.
Turned Rx on.
Range test failed multiple times, with a minimum distance of 65 feet (a new record!).
WattsUp meter measured minimum voltage during test at 4.91 volts.
Each failure required more than 10 seconds to self-correct.
So -- I think that's going to be it for me. I feel I've been more than pleasant with Spektrum through this fiasco. Spektrum has had my broken radio system for 3.5 weeks, sent it back to me, and it's still broken. At this point, I want my money back for the Spektrum equipment, the burned up servo, the destroyed aircraft, the destroyed battery, and my time (used to debug a system that the Spektrum repair people should have done the first time).

Truly angry,
LL
Lieutenant Loughead is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 04:43 AM
  #192  
simibill
General Factotum
 
simibill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Simi Valley,CA
Posts: 1,166
Default

Well, the best of British luck...
simibill is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 05:28 AM
  #193  
Lieutenant Loughead
UNCLUB OWNER
Thread Starter
 
Lieutenant Loughead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 4,406
Default

Originally Posted by simibill View Post
Well, the best of British luck...
Sorry -- I am not familiar with that saying...
Lieutenant Loughead is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 12:40 PM
  #194  
Twizter68
I can't see my plane.....
 
Twizter68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Mahboula, Kuwait
Posts: 1,376
Default

Sounds like you've been more than patient with them. You got a lemon radio......
Twizter68 is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 03:50 PM
  #195  
tclaridge
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 96
Default 10 second delay sounds strange, try rebind

LL,
Sorry to hear of your problems. I would like to make a suggestion, but it may not help, but can't hurt. Some failures have occurred because the Rx was not re-bound after some programming was done (this is in the manual, but not obvious). So now I bind, do my programming, and then rebind.
Your situation sounds very odd, because you should not get a 10 second reboot delay just because you drop out of range. I have flown hundreds of flights with my DX7 with 5 different planes (using AR6000, AR61000, and AR7000) ranging from foamies to big electrics. No problems. When I perform a range check and exceed 30 paces, it goes to fail safe, and control returns immediately when the signal is received again. NO DELAY. I have not seen the 10 second delay during flight or range check, ever. So if its not the binding issue I mentioned above, something is broke.
I have heard of other problems with a loose antenna wire or board wire in the Tx, but is has been rare. I would just ask for a new Tx. Given your issues, Spektrum should comply. I have always had good luck with their service. I have been in the hobby for over 25 years, and my DX7 has been an awesome experience. You deserve the same.
tclaridge is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 04:05 PM
  #196  
constantCrash
prefectionist
 
constantCrash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: MN
Posts: 1,919
Exclamation Time to band together.

I think we need a Poll. "Have you experienced a Spektrum failure" Yes: No: Possibly but couldn't tell:" and find out how many people on here have Spektrum gear and how many have problems.

This thread is giving a lot of people reservations about the 2.4 ghz stuff (including me) and will probably put some off to buying it. But it's still tech geek time for 2.4ghz. They've just reached the "Chasm" from tech geek to early adoption so we'll start to see some failures that show what the systems limits are. This is the time that the manufactures need to step up and really handhold the few really bad cases so that they don't destroy their reputation (like this one). If anybody on here is second guessing purchasing spektrum gear I suggest you e-mail them about it pointing to this thread maybe they will respond.

I still think that this case is a "Worst possible" case but I do believe it's real and I'm disappointed in Horizon's handling of it. Would it really be that hard or cost that much to send the guy a shinny new controller with 5 shinny new receivers? They could have turned this from a "I am giving up and what a failure" to "Oh my god Spektrum/Horizon support is the bomb look what they did for me." That is, unless the new TX and RX still fail at which time I would believe that the problem is NOT Spektrum related.
constantCrash is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 07:12 PM
  #197  
rcers
Super Contributor
 
rcers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Trophy Club TX
Posts: 6,314
Default

Guys -- please read the entire thread before saying things like "have you tested in different places", and "I see you have checked with the 7000 RX have you tested with a 6000", and "Get a Cheap slow stick - fly it stock so you are invested at $30usd plane/motor and a few more bucks for battery. Fly it." Those answers are already in this thread. (...and all results were BAD!)
You know what - I was just trying to help - sorry! We all don't have time to re-read the whole thread.

Checking out....

Mike
rcers is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 07:42 PM
  #198  
Lieutenant Loughead
UNCLUB OWNER
Thread Starter
 
Lieutenant Loughead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 4,406
Default

Well, despite my better judgement, I did some more testing this morning... I think I may be on to something. Without going into all the detail:

1) I tried the AR6100 (#1) in a different airplane (a Slow Stick). It failed range test at 44 feet, so it's not the airplane, the fiberglass, or the covering.

2) I tried a brushed speed control (GWS ICS-480) and a brushed motor (GWS 400 speed) in the Slow Stick. I used the AR6100 (#1). It PASSED (no glitches at 90 feet with the bind button pressed in).

3) I tried the Phoenix 25 speed control and a brushless motor in the Slow Stick. I used a 72 MHz receiver (Electron 6). It PASSED (No glitches at 104 feet, with the antenna down).

This leads me to believe there is a compatibility issue with my brushless speed controls and the Spektrum radio system. I am going to rerun these tests at site #1 later today, to verify the results.

HOWEVER, at this point, I am wondering if anyone else has had trouble with any brushless speed controls working with their Spektrum radio systems. I don't have any brushless speed controls which are NOT Castle Creations brand, so I can't try a different brand.
Lieutenant Loughead is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 08:33 PM
  #199  
tclaridge
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 96
Default

LL,
I run all brushless, eflite, castle, and JETI controllers. No issues.
Did you try a fresh rebind before your tests?
tclaridge is offline  
Old 08-11-2007, 10:13 PM
  #200  
Lieutenant Loughead
UNCLUB OWNER
Thread Starter
 
Lieutenant Loughead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 4,406
Default

Honestly, no... I did not rebind. However, I had to rebind all the receivers when I received them back from Spektrum, and I have not touched the trim tabs at all.

I will rebind, and try the test again tonight (when it cools off a little)...
Lieutenant Loughead is offline  

Quick Reply: HELP! Spektrum DX7 radio failure?


Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.

Page generated in 0.16469 seconds with 13 queries