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Converting PZ Spitfire to brushless

Old 08-07-2008, 11:50 AM
  #76  
DetroitHawk
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Originally Posted by AETCBoom4 View Post
Me... Pulls around 400watts with a 38 amp draw on an APC 9x9E prop. I get about 10 minutes flying time .
Are you sure about those numbers, that doesn't seem right for a motor of that high Kv running under 40 amps.

Why use the stock gearbox? I sold the two i had because so many people were having problems with them breaking under sthe stock setup, i can't imagine this would be any better for them. Some people suggested they were designed to break to save the motor in a crash. As if they would have that insight, more likely and easy answer for a problem
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Old 08-07-2008, 03:52 PM
  #77  
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Originally Posted by DetroitHawk View Post
Are you sure about those numbers, that doesn't seem right for a motor of that high Kv running under 40 amps.

Why use the stock gearbox? I sold the two i had because so many people were having problems with them breaking under sthe stock setup, i can't imagine this would be any better for them. Some people suggested they were designed to break to save the motor in a crash. As if they would have that insight, more likely and easy answer for a problem
Numbers are correct per wattmeter. If one uses a larger prop say a 10x8 and a less efficient prop design, then the numbers go way up.

I used to have problems with the stock gear box also. My problems were because I would belly land the plane and have an incomplete flare on landing. Changing landing flare technique solved my problems. The gearbox doesn't respond well to smacks on the nose when hitting the ground. It has been over a year since I've had problems, so I must be doing something right.

Is the Align conversion the most power efficient? Probably not, but with the right batteries, throttle management, and right prop, it is a quick and easy upgrade. The performance is outstanding for only an evening worth of work to include CFing the wing.
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:45 PM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by AETCBoom4 View Post
Numbers are correct per wattmeter. If one uses a larger prop say a 10x8 and a less efficient prop design, then the numbers go way up.

I used to have problems with the stock gear box also. My problems were because I would belly land the plane and have an incomplete flare on landing. Changing landing flare technique solved my problems. The gearbox doesn't respond well to smacks on the nose when hitting the ground. It has been over a year since I've had problems, so I must be doing something right.

Is the Align conversion the most power efficient? Probably not, but with the right batteries, throttle management, and right prop, it is a quick and easy upgrade. The performance is outstanding for only an evening worth of work to include CFing the wing.
Fair enough, 38 amps does push most 2100 lipos to their limit even with a 20c rating. that 9x9 prop is huge for the RPM that it is turning. Just seems like 38 amps would be on the low end of what i would have expected for that prop.

I noticed your CF rod is on the bottom of the plane, i placed mine on the top side because when pulling up out of a dive i assumed it would help hold the shape, from the bottom it seems like the rod could come loose and pull free when doing that. (which is also whi i avoid throwing the stick forward for inverted loops with my bird)
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Old 08-07-2008, 10:24 PM
  #79  
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I finished my Brushless modification today, took her for a quick flight [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWMHx5KOYFc[/media]

Spec is a a 1200kv 16A outrunner, 40A ESC, Great Planes motor mount, Eflite prop adapter and a APC 9x4.5 Prop. 3s Lipo equals 190watts at 16A.

Ok so it's no sport flyer but I like it now, sorry for the poor FCO quality, need to figure it out.
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Old 08-07-2008, 11:29 PM
  #80  
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Hi Tony.
Upload your vid to vimeo. A far better host.

Here's a few pics of your Spit in action. Nice upgrade.
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Old 08-08-2008, 08:38 AM
  #81  
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Hehe, Nice pics Paul thanks.
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Old 08-11-2008, 09:22 PM
  #82  
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Well the cheapo motor I bought from Giantcod seams to be made out of chocolate, the motor shaft has snapped on landing and bent on another landing, neither landing was classed as heavy. Anyway, I decided to buy one of these.

http://www.horizonhobby.co.uk/aeroon...2accessfs.html

I think it's a little OTT but she will go like stink lol.
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Old 08-13-2008, 01:22 AM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by radweld View Post
Well the cheapo motor I bought from Giantcod seams to be made out of chocolate, the motor shaft has snapped on landing and bent on another landing, neither landing was classed as heavy. Anyway, I decided to buy one of these.

http://www.horizonhobby.co.uk/aeroon...2accessfs.html

I think it's a little OTT but she will go like stink lol.

link = broken

What other motor did you ruin?
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Old 08-13-2008, 07:48 AM
  #84  
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Sorry about the link, it's a Eflite Park 480 1050kv about 280watts. It's a little too large for this airframe lol
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Old 08-13-2008, 12:31 PM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by radweld View Post
Sorry about the link, it's a Eflite Park 480 1050kv about 280watts. It's a little too large for this airframe lol

it's got alot of torque for the weight of your plane, just not a lot of speed.
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Old 08-13-2008, 02:12 PM
  #86  
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Originally Posted by DetroitHawk View Post
it's got alot of torque for the weight of your plane, just not a lot of speed.
I've fitted a 10x7, it blew everything off the table when I bench tested it lol. Weather is still rubbish here, I can't wait to fly it.
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Old 08-13-2008, 06:57 PM
  #87  
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Originally Posted by DetroitHawk View Post
it's got alot of torque for the weight of your plane, just not a lot of speed.
I agree with Detroit, every plane that I've had that carried a 480 1020KV, I replaced with another outrunner. The motor has torque but the plane lacks speed. I've used GP Rimfire 35-30-1250KV and the Turnigy 35-36C-1100 KV with good success in my GWS P-40 and PZ T-28. Prop to use is a MAS 10x8E.
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Old 08-13-2008, 10:56 PM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by AETCBoom4 View Post
I agree with Detroit, every plane that I've had that carried a 480 1020KV, I replaced with another outrunner. The motor has torque but the plane lacks speed. I've used GP Rimfire 35-30-1250KV and the Turnigy 35-36C-1100 KV with good success in my GWS P-40 and PZ T-28. Prop to use is a MAS 10x8E.
I find a good balance at around 1500Kv with the 8inch props, they get enough prop pitch speed to rip the wings off the plane. LOL

this PKZ Spitfire was alot of fun to fly but i don't think i would of wanted to go any faster with this kit. While i haven't used any radar to clock this plane when i used the 7x9 prop but 90+ mph would be about right, i took it down in crazy dives going downwind where i am sure this plane was going at about as fast as the airframe would allow.

The only option i did not use was going to a different battery just think what 14.4volts could do!!! THEN the lower Kv motors might be a better option, that is where i am at right now with my next project. The options change when you go to a 4cell
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Old 08-13-2008, 11:32 PM
  #89  
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Check this out might make an easy swap out of the plastic mount to outrunner.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=260263991103
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Old 08-14-2008, 04:38 AM
  #90  
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That seller also has one specific to the Spitfire...that link points to the Super Cub version.

Do the Spitfire and FW-190 have the same gearbox?
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Old 08-14-2008, 04:45 AM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by barmonkey View Post
That seller also has one specific to the Spitfire...that link points to the Super Cub version.

Do the Spitfire and FW-190 have the same gearbox?
The PZ Spitfire, Mustang, FW-190 and HZ Supercub share the same gearbox just different part numbers.
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Old 08-14-2008, 04:56 AM
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Good to know...Thanks for the answer!
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Old 08-14-2008, 05:05 AM
  #93  
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Originally Posted by AETCBoom4 View Post
Check this out might make an easy swap out of the plastic mount to outrunner.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=260263991103
Hrmm silly question maybe but I wonder if there is built-in thrust offset.

Pretty sweet idea for someone who can fabricate aluminum. I'd like to retool the gearbox with an aluminum or even Delrin spur gear, but thats just me.
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Old 08-14-2008, 07:55 AM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by DetroitHawk View Post
I find a good balance at around 1500Kv with the 8inch props, they get enough prop pitch speed to rip the wings off the plane. LOL

this PKZ Spitfire was alot of fun to fly but i don't think i would of wanted to go any faster with this kit. While i haven't used any radar to clock this plane when i used the 7x9 prop but 90+ mph would be about right, i took it down in crazy dives going downwind where i am sure this plane was going at about as fast as the airframe would allow.

The only option i did not use was going to a different battery just think what 14.4volts could do!!! THEN the lower Kv motors might be a better option, that is where i am at right now with my next project. The options change when you go to a 4cell
Well initially my thoughts were to have something similar in performance to my T28, that uses a 1050 ish kv out-runner as well. I also like the larger props simply because they look nicer. Well I hope I didn't make a mistake buying this motor but it certainly seams to have enough thrust on the bench.
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Old 08-14-2008, 09:50 AM
  #95  
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Conditions were great this morning so I tried out the Spitfire with the Park480, as predicted the top speed isn't that impressive but the thrust it puts out is quite amazing, first time I throttle up just prior to launch, the thrust loosened my grip on the plane and I thought I was going to drop it lol. It's got plenty of power but my E-Flite 1800mah 20C cells don't appreciate having 25a taken out of them, I use a ipo monitor and it beeps at me at 3.2v/cell, straight away it started beeping so I throttled back to 60% and completed the remainder of the flight at this power setting.

The Next flights were with some unbranded 30C lipos and these were fine for the duration of the 8min flight, I quite like the scale way the model flies now but I confess to be disappointed that I still don't seam to have unlimited vertical.

The Strange thing I have found is that since the conversion to BL, and I've used two different motors and prop size, my roll rate is half of what it used to me. I can't quite figure out why.

I'm not sure I would recommend the Park 480 though, it's large and heavy and pulls a lot of amps, I might change it out for something else but for now I will leave it in.
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Old 08-14-2008, 11:35 AM
  #96  
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Originally Posted by groundrushesup View Post
Hrmm silly question maybe but I wonder if there is built-in thrust offset.

Pretty sweet idea for someone who can fabricate aluminum. I'd like to retool the gearbox with an aluminum or even Delrin spur gear, but thats just me.
Good point about the thrust angles... I just saw this on RCG and thought I'd pass it on. Not sure about the thrust angles built in.
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Old 08-15-2008, 03:09 AM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by AETCBoom4 View Post
Good point about the thrust angles... I just saw this on RCG and thought I'd pass it on. Not sure about the thrust angles built in.
The thrust angle offset really isn't needed, both of my PKZ war birds i didn't put in the angle the stock one comes offset with and they both flew with no issues to report.
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Old 08-15-2008, 03:25 AM
  #98  
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Originally Posted by DetroitHawk View Post
The thrust angle offset really isn't needed, both of my PKZ war birds i didn't put in the angle the stock one comes offset with and they both flew with no issues to report.
Thanks for the info. The ad mentioned its set for park 480s, I wonder if it can bolt to other motors.
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Old 08-15-2008, 03:27 AM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by AETCBoom4 View Post
Check this out might make an easy swap out of the plastic mount to outrunner.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=260263991103
This part weights almost a full oz! A small piece of aircraft ply will do the same thing with a few holes in the right place. The lighter you can keep your Spitfire the better it will fly.

DetroitHawk is right about the thrust angles. My BL Spitfire conversion is straight ahead and flies great, same for my PZ FW-190.
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Old 08-15-2008, 03:29 AM
  #100  
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Another listing. Could be one and the same.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...2BSI%26otn%3D4
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