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Power Systems Talk about motors, ESC speed controllers, gear drives, propellers, power system simulators and all power system related topics

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Old 07-12-2018, 06:11 PM   #1
msethhunter
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Default YS1.10 to electric?

This electric stuff is mind boggling. I have a The World Models Dago Red P51 that is a 40-46 size airplane. I've powered it with a YS1.10FZ four stroke engine and it is fast. Probably in the neighborhood of 120-130 mph. I am looking to convert to electric, but to be honest, even after reading this thread, I am totally lost! I want it to do the similar/better performance. I've been trying to figure this out for months now, been asking questions, and haven't been able to source any help. Someone, anyone, point me in the right direction!

Thanks.
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Old 07-13-2018, 04:31 PM   #2
ron_van_sommeren
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What e-flight knowledge/experience do you have?

Don't do the IC↔electric equivalency, cc's and ci's don't convert very well into watts. Mass and type of plane are leading.

Simplest way, copy: search for similar/same plane and see how it was 'electricuted'.

Quote from
www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?2083459-brushless-motors-kv&perpage=20#post27290157
While an absolutely critical part of the system ...
... Kv is actually the item one should choose last.
  1. Decide your peak power requirement based on the weight of the model and how you want to fly it.
  2. Pick a preferred cell count (voltage) and pack capacity for how to deliver the power.
  3. Pick a prop that will a) fit on the model and b) fly the model how you want - often as big as will fit is a good choice, but if high speed is the goal, a smaller diameter higher pitch prop will be more appropriate.
  4. Look for a size class of motors that will handle the peak power - a very conservative guide is to allow 1 gram motor weight for every 3 watts peak power.
  5. Then, look for a motor in that weight range that has the Kv to achieve the power desired with the props you can use - a calculator such as eCalc allows very quick trial and error zooming in on a decent choice. For a desired power and prop, you'd need higher Kv if using a 3 cell pack compared to a 4 cell pack. Or for a desired power and cell count, you'd need higher Kv if driving a smaller diameter high speed prop compared to a larger prop for a slow model.
The reason I suggest picking Kv last is that prop choices have bounds - the diameter that will physically fit and the minimum size that can absorb the power you want. OTOH, combinations of voltage and Kv are much less constrained - at least before you purchase the components.

So Kv is not a figure of merit, in that higher or lower is better, it is simply a motor characteristic that you exploit to make your power system do what you want, within the constraints you have, e.g. limited prop diameter, if it's a pusher configuration, or if you already have a bunch of 3S packs and don't want to buy more, and so on.

Minor lay-out changes by RvS

Vriendelijke groeten Ron
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Old 07-13-2018, 05:09 PM   #3
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Default

Originally Posted by ron_van_sommeren View Post
What e-flight knowledge/experience do you have?

Don't do the IC↔electric equivalency, cc don't convert very well into watt. Mass and type of plane are leading.

Simplest way, copy: search for similar/same plane and see how it was 'electricuted'.

Quote from
www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?2083459-brushless-motors-kv&perpage=20#post27290157
Thanks for all the links, this is the info I've been looking for. Looks like I've got some reading to do.
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Old 07-13-2018, 07:50 PM   #4
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Okay, so I think I'm starting to get my head wrapped around how to select a motor. Let me know if I have this right.

KV= approximate rpm per volt no load
As voltage goes down, amp draw goes up, so if prop size stays constant, but cell count goes down, the ESC would see a harder load?


If a motor recommends a certain prop size, what will the effect be if I drop it significantly? An example would be if the motor recommends a 16x4, but I elect to use a 12x14, what will the net effect be? I am doing this to get a crap ton of speed out of a .40 size reno racer. I get batteries, I've been using LiPo's for years in my cars (I race). I get ESC's, and I get batteries. But the way we select motors is completely different (usually dictated by the class we are running).

Seems like I'd want, with what I'm trying to do, a motor appropriately size with as high a KV as possible. So this is what I'm thinking. (Yes, I know it's cheap stuff, but this is a learning curve that I'm not ready to drop money on the good stuff until I get my head wrapped around it with some experimentation).

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/propdriv...___store=en_us

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/propdriv...___store=en_us

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/zippy-co...___store=en_us

Also, seems like APC has discontinued the 12x12 and 12x14 props. Those seemed to give the best speed for what I was doing, but I always had to deadstick land because they produced to much idle thrust. I still have a few, but I can't find a manufacturer who's making something close.
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Old 07-13-2018, 08:40 PM   #5
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Default

I keep it real simple. 57" WS? weighs in at ~ 7lbs? Similar in size to my 46 size Phoenix Tucano.

If it were me, I'd be looking at either a 46 or 60 electric motor. The kv is up to you . If you want alot of torgue stay in the 380-450 kv range. Less torque but more speed go higher , up to around 650kv . Rimfire, Power-Up ( headsuprc) or Eflight are all good ones. 80-100 amp esc. 6S Lipo 4000-5000mah lipo 50C . Remember, you're ultimately getting the power through the lipo. See what size lipo you can get inside the cabin.

As far as props,you should be able to find square props like a 12 x 12 Check Apc's website:

https://www.apcprop.com/product/12x12e/

https://www.apcprop.com/product/14x12e/



Best of luck !

Hawk
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