Charging a TX Battery?? - WattFlyer RC Electric Flight Forums - Discuss radio control eflight

Batteries & Chargers Discuss Li-P, Li-Ion, NiMh, Nicad battery technology and the chargers that juice 'em up!

Charging a TX Battery??

Old 07-08-2006, 08:30 PM
  #1  
alienx
Super Contributor
Thread Starter
 
alienx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Secaucus, NJ
Posts: 1,894
Default Charging a TX Battery??

I have a 600 mah NiCad in my futaba. It is a Sanyo brand. I've been charging it with that stupid 15 hour wall charger. I was wondering if I should be using my Triton instead.

I was hoping to be able to charge it quicker. But the battery says right on the label:

60mA - 15 hours
180mA Quick Charge - 5 hours

So is this the fastest I can safely charge the battery (5 hours?). And if I charge it quicker, will it ruin the longevity??

Thanks for the feedback. Andy
alienx is offline  
Old 07-08-2006, 10:30 PM
  #2  
Neocold
Stryker Rookie
 
Neocold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sac, CA
Posts: 50
Default

There is always a way to charge a battery faster.

Most of the time you have to short a diode in the TX with a small piece of wire so that the quick chargers will work. Here is a link to how to do it on my TX.

http://www.siriuselectronics.com/diode_sheets/hitopt6.htm

Simply go to Google.com and search [*Brand Name* *Model* diode] so mine would be Hitec Optic 6 Diode

If you can’t find it post your model here and I will see if I can find it.

After bypassing the diode all you have to do is buy or make a plug for your charger. I can also help with this if needed.


EDIT: Typo
Neocold is offline  
Old 07-08-2006, 10:35 PM
  #3  
slipstick
Super Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: N.Staffs, UK
Posts: 2,350
Default

But bear in mind that
a) most Tx batteries are not fast charge cells so somewhere around 1 to 1.5 hours is as fast as you can get away with without seriously degrading the lifetime.
b) many Txs have very thin internal wiring/PCB tracks so you can't use much current without damaging the Tx itself. Or you can take the battery out to charge it.

Steve
slipstick is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 12:16 AM
  #4  
alienx
Super Contributor
Thread Starter
 
alienx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Secaucus, NJ
Posts: 1,894
Default

Oh, I always take the battery out and use the wall charger on just the battery. So I guess I don't have to short anything?? Does that mean that I can just charge using my Triton at some higher rate? How do you know what rate you can charge a Nicad at? Obviously, Lipo is at 1C. But I have no idea what is appropriate for a Nicad.

Incidentally, the TX is a Futaba 7C.

Thanks.
alienx is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 09:37 AM
  #5  
slipstick
Super Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: N.Staffs, UK
Posts: 2,350
Default

When I occasionally need to fast charge my Tx batteries at the field I stick to around 1C. Those AA NiCds really don't like fast charges. Just once I tried a little over 2C and the shrink wrap on the batteries started blistering . I can take a hint .

I find that charging at 1C for 20-30 minutes gives me plenty of juice for another couple of flights (and I can nearly always find someone to chat to for that long ).

Steve
slipstick is offline  
Old 07-12-2006, 09:23 PM
  #6  
jonnyjetprop
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 708
Default

I'm using a Hitec 340 charger for my transmitters and receiver packs. I charge at 1C and have done so for many years with no problems. I think, but I'm no expert, that this type of charging is better than using a wall wort and overcharging the packs.

John
jonnyjetprop is offline  
Old 07-12-2006, 09:31 PM
  #7  
alienx
Super Contributor
Thread Starter
 
alienx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Secaucus, NJ
Posts: 1,894
Default

Originally Posted by jonnyjetprop View Post
I'm using a Hitec 340 charger for my transmitters and receiver packs. I charge at 1C and have done so for many years with no problems. I think, but I'm no expert, that this type of charging is better than using a wall wort and overcharging the packs.

John
I guess my frustration is that, if I remember correctly, at .6 amps, the pack takes 15 hours to charge (regardless of charger I believe). And .6 amps happens to be 1C for this Sanyo. So I guess my Triton may be a better charger, but 15 hours at 1C is 15 hours at 1C, right!?
alienx is offline  
Old 07-12-2006, 11:03 PM
  #8  
Nitro Blast
Community Moderator
 
Nitro Blast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sunny San Diego Ca
Posts: 4,052
Default

Originally Posted by alienx View Post
I guess my frustration is that, if I remember correctly, at .6 amps, the pack takes 15 hours to charge (regardless of charger I believe). And .6 amps happens to be 1C for this Sanyo. So I guess my Triton may be a better charger, but 15 hours at 1C is 15 hours at 1C, right!?
Maybe my math is wrong, but your Triton will charge that at 1C in 1 hour

Capacity is Miliamp Hours right? 1500 miliamp cell charged at 1500 maH for one hour is its capacity. If you charge at .5 C then 2 hours.

Anyone correct me if I am wrong but that has been my understanding and practice.

Isnt your wall charger putting .06 maH? that would be a safe, 10~12 hour charge.
Nitro Blast is offline  
Old 07-12-2006, 11:44 PM
  #9  
alienx
Super Contributor
Thread Starter
 
alienx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Secaucus, NJ
Posts: 1,894
Default

Originally Posted by Nitro Blast View Post
Maybe my math is wrong, but your Triton will charge that at 1C in 1 hour

Capacity is Miliamp Hours right? 1500 miliamp cell charged at 1500 maH for one hour is its capacity. If you charge at .5 C then 2 hours.

Anyone correct me if I am wrong but that has been my understanding and practice.

Isnt your wall charger putting .06 maH? that would be a safe, 10~12 hour charge.
My mistake. You seem to be correct. I misread the battery. It's 60 Ma, not .6 amps. So if you move the decimal 3 places, the wall charger is at .06 amps or 10 hours.

I'm going to get a futaba lead and put some banana plugs on it to use my Triton.

Thanks for checking my math.
alienx is offline  
Old 07-13-2006, 01:56 AM
  #10  
Neocold
Stryker Rookie
 
Neocold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sac, CA
Posts: 50
Default

Just cut your wall wart lead off, plug in the wall wart, and using a voltmeter determine which is the positive lead (current is low so you wont get shocked). Then put your choice of plug on the thing and connect it to your triton. If you still want to be able to use your wall wart as well just put a plug on it as well so you can connect the lead.

Feel free to ask ?'s if needed. Also, yes, 1C would = 1 hour.
Neocold is offline  
Old 07-13-2006, 02:09 AM
  #11  
alienx
Super Contributor
Thread Starter
 
alienx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Secaucus, NJ
Posts: 1,894
Default

Originally Posted by Neocold View Post
Just cut your wall wart lead off, plug in the wall wart, and using a voltmeter determine which is the positive lead (current is low so you wont get shocked). Then put your choice of plug on the thing and connect it to your triton. If you still want to be able to use your wall wart as well just put a plug on it as well so you can connect the lead.

Feel free to ask ?'s if needed. Also, yes, 1C would = 1 hour.
That's a good idea. It has a red stripe on one lead, so I would think that is positive?? If not, the positive lead should read some positive number of volts while the negative lead is dead???
alienx is offline  
Old 07-13-2006, 07:27 AM
  #12  
Neocold
Stryker Rookie
 
Neocold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sac, CA
Posts: 50
Default

Yes, it should be positive but to be safe check it. A voltmeter should have red and black leads (positive and negative respectively). Touch the leads to the spiced wall wart and when the voltmeter reads positive (to the right) you have it.

Just to make sure you got it, each lead from the voltmeter goes to a separate wire. The voltmeter should be on DCV 10. See the picture below.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	voltmeter.jpg
Views:	152
Size:	18.6 KB
ID:	14025  
Neocold is offline  
Old 07-13-2006, 11:29 AM
  #13  
alienx
Super Contributor
Thread Starter
 
alienx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Secaucus, NJ
Posts: 1,894
Default

Thanks. Gonna try this. Then I don't have to miss a day of flying because the battery is charging!!!
alienx is offline  
Old 07-13-2006, 03:18 PM
  #14  
pilotpete2
Pilotpete2
 
pilotpete2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NorthEast Kingdom, VT
Posts: 518
Default

Originally Posted by alienx View Post
Thanks. Gonna try this. Then I don't have to miss a day of flying because the battery is charging!!!
Fast charging (1C) is not the way to go, only should be used on a "need to" basis at the field, for Nicds used in radios a timed slow (C/10) charge that drops to a C/50 trickle (Ace Digipulse ) is the best way to get the longest life out of your batteries and always be ready to fly, been doing that since the late 80's. Peak detect charging at 1C will not result in as "full" a charge as slow charging and will result in out of balance cells, slow charging will ensure a full charge on all cells.
Pete
pilotpete2 is offline  
Old 07-13-2006, 07:21 PM
  #15  
radralph
My first Build
 
radralph's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Vancouver WA
Posts: 450
Default

I've got a 900 mah nicad and a 2300 mah nimh pack that I use for my surface transmitter and I have always charged them at 1.2-1.5 amps with peak detection on my intellipeak charger. The batts are actually running better now than they were 2 yrs. ago.
radralph is offline  
Old 07-27-2006, 03:30 AM
  #16  
t. edwards
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Lake Geneva, Wisconsin
Posts: 87
Default

I use a Hobbico Mk2 for my tx batteries (and all my nimh and nicads). Have 2 CellPro 4S chargers for my lipos. Tom
t. edwards is offline  
Old 07-27-2006, 12:48 PM
  #17  
flypaper 2
Super Contributor
 
flypaper 2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Kingston Ont. Can.
Posts: 1,237
Default

I use a very old Hobbico Quick field charger bought around 95 or so. Does the futaba without removing the diode. Runs at home from a power supply. Now using it on the DX6 Spectrum with a 1800 ma NIMH with no problems.
flypaper 2 is offline  
Old 08-22-2007, 05:37 AM
  #18  
Radbuster
Park Flyer
 
Radbuster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Cambria, California
Posts: 118
Question Fast charging led to TX failure?

Originally Posted by alienx View Post
I have a 600 mah NiCad in my futaba. It is a Sanyo brand. I've been charging it with that stupid 15 hour wall charger. I was wondering if I should be using my Triton instead.

I was hoping to be able to charge it quicker. But the battery says right on the label:

60mA - 15 hours
180mA Quick Charge - 5 hours

So is this the fastest I can safely charge the battery (5 hours?). And if I charge it quicker, will it ruin the longevity??

Thanks for the feedback. Andy
My Futaba 4VF is similar. I was on the road without the charger and used a 500mA transformer to keep flying. The quick charge (about 3hrs) worked fine and I stayed with it; charging about once a month for the last 3 months. But last week the TX failed the range test (after behaving really badly in the field.) It's about 8 years old so I'm just going to replace it. But did the 500 mA charging lead to it's demise?
Radbuster is offline  
Old 08-22-2007, 05:33 PM
  #19  
Rodneh
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 753
Default

Your transmitter batteries will last lots longer if you use the wall wart that came with the system. True, you need to charge overnight before flying but you will not harm the battery by leaving the charger on for 24 hours in case you forget to unplug it. Fast charging most transmitter batteries will reduce their lifetime. Even when you fast charge, you need to put more in than you took out. The charging is not 100% efficient so you need to charge at least 120% of what you took out; if charging at 0.1C put back 160% to insure that all cells get fully charged and equalized. Sure, some cells will reach full charge before the others (all cells will not have the exact same capacity ) but, at the lower rates (0.1C) the oxygen recombination of the first charged cell(s) at the positive plate will be at a low enough rate so as not to excessively raise the temperature and hurt the seal or capacity. Back before fast chargers were on the market, most receiver and transmitter packs would last for years. Now why do you suppose there are so many early failures now? Even with the improved manufacturing techniques, fast charging is not the most healthfully way to charge your batteries and it will accelerate your failure rates.
Rodneh is offline  
Old 08-23-2007, 07:34 PM
  #20  
BobbyDog
Crazy Canuck
 
BobbyDog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
Posts: 437
Default

That 600mah NiCd Tx battery drove me crazy too, I have the same Tx. I bought a 2650mah NiMh from www.superbatterypacks.com I think it was. Pretty cheap and it lasts for hours without charging. I fly almost every day and charge once sometimes twice a week. One of the best purchases I've made!

I have read somewhere that the high capacity NiMh (over 1600mah) have a very thin special alloy in them that doesnt allow fast charging. I also read that fast charging (180ma) the lower capacity NiMh cells is fine. It just shortens the cells life a little. You decide if its worth it. Good luck!

Bob
BobbyDog is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
SUPERSPORT
RC Radios, Transmitters, Receivers, Servos, gyros
11
04-18-2008 06:41 PM
Higbe33
Beginners
37
04-11-2008 05:33 AM
borgy
Batteries & Chargers
1
02-06-2008 11:51 PM
Fly Time
Batteries & Chargers
8
10-30-2007 03:45 PM
Ribcracker
Batteries & Chargers
3
12-22-2005 11:26 AM

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Quick Reply: Charging a TX Battery??


Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.

Page generated in 0.08962 seconds with 17 queries