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Newbie; power system for H9 Funtana X 50?

Old 02-28-2009, 07:33 PM
  #76  
EDFrules
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Hacker Spin 99. Here's a pic. Talked to Shawn Plummer from Aero-Model about it and found out I was about one of the first guys to test a 14s2p A123 pack-doooh! And I kept the voltage at 48v not 50. Come to find out they hadn't really tested A123's(at least that high a cell count) on their ESC's. Called up Castle and that's what they give their engineers to test out ESCs with. Guess they didn't want the engineers to keep handing them back puffed up lipos! Cheaper for testing purposes. But I was told by Castle that the ripple effect will kill the capacitors if they are not designed properly to take this into account. And I quess Castle takes A123's seriously so they seem to have the most experience testing them out. I would have love to have tried the new upcoming SHV series(90v!) and done a 20s1p pack shaving off 8 cells but there isn't a motor that will handle that kind of voltage yet. Guess us electric guys are always pushing the envelope! Maybe you can fix up my burned up Spin 99? LOL Think the cap needs replacing and some burned up wiring. I like the programming box aspect-you can do changes at field instead of hooking up to a PC(laptop if you have one) like the USB connection on a Castle. The 110HV's are great-if your's runs the first time it will probably keep running. They usually blow out on the ground right off as soon as you plug in the packs if there's a bad component. And that's what I was told too, either manufacturer has a good design it's the faulty FET's or caps that are the culprit. Out of say a 1000 component lot purchased-5 will be bad percentage wise. Guess I got one of the bad ones.
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Old 02-28-2009, 08:28 PM
  #77  
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EDFRules
Ouch! 14S2P A123's??? Man oh man, you would never want to accidentally short that thing out. These A123 batteries will win! What are you running, a electric jet??

I did accidentally short out a Dewalt pack last year, it sounded like my 180 Amp welder. Burned a hole right through the side of one of the cells. Ruined that cell. BUT, NO FIRE! Not even much smoke. Still flying the remaining 9 cells.

I'm an old retired Senior Electronics Service tech with 44 years experience in repairing burned up electronic controls for the circuit breakers used in the high voltage electric power substation. Looking at your photo reminds me of repairing controls that got a DIRECT hit by lightning! (I did a LOT of those in 44 years!) Not much left.

By appearance of both ends of your ESC, it looks like a lot more than the capacitors blew. I'd have to see the insides to verify. At any rate, all this electronic stuff has so many parts not available to the common person, the only place they can be repaired is at the factory. And, something like this is likely beyond repair.
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Old 02-28-2009, 08:36 PM
  #78  
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I'm an A/C contractor and have dealt with everything from boxcar sized chillers to water coolers and I'm not messing around with teeny components. When it comes down to component sized levels I just get a new circuit board! (or new ESC in this case)Just another burnt offering to the RC Gods And I live in the lightening capitol of the world so I've seen my fair share of zapped systems too. Almost got hit a couple of times myself. Not fun when you feel the hair on your arms standing on end and see Jacobs lights dancing around metal components. I'd rather not be a victim of Zeus anytime soon...
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Old 02-28-2009, 08:44 PM
  #79  
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EDFRules
Yeah, been there done that. My past job took me to just about every state in the USA and around the world 5 times.

Worst I ever saw was some idiot power line man checking a 14.4 KV three phase system with a little pencil sized indicator to see if it was live. It was. He'd been doing it for years. THAT was one guy I backed away from! These guys usually use something called a HotStick insulated for a 100 KV (100,000 Volts AC) or so to verify line voltages.
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Old 02-28-2009, 09:47 PM
  #80  
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I've meet a couple of real geniuses too. Got a chiller call and met the resident mechanic, shook hands and noticed he had black fingernails. When I asked why he took me into the chiller room and showed me a charred outline of himself on the wall(like Wile E. Coyote) and explained how he was checking the voltage(6600v) with a wiggey. Fortunately for him it exploded and blew him across the room! He said he'll leave that up to the pro's next time. New a few electricians that used to hit live wires with their screwdrivers to trip the circuit breaker making it easier to trace in the box=good plan.
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Old 02-28-2009, 10:11 PM
  #81  
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Eh, guys (and gals), can I make a confession?









When I took the cowl off, the rubbing noise of the motor stopped, and the motor spund freely. I did take the motor apart, but everything is unscaved inside, and the magnets are all where they should be, and stuck to the housing firmly. Yep, I think I've been a bit stupid. I cut the hole in the cowl a tad bigger then the motor diameter. But with the mounting I used, the motor can pivot a bit, and move slightly out of centre. I just opened up the cowl opening a bit more, and refitted the lot...

I sincencerely hope this has really been the problem, I rather have you lot laughing at me then have my flying stuff broken.

You may now laugh...

Hugo
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Old 02-28-2009, 10:14 PM
  #82  
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LOL, well, thats good to hear that your motor didn't fall apart.... makes it easyier to fix... I'm sure we've all thought the worst about something before we fully checked it out...

SK

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Old 02-28-2009, 10:38 PM
  #83  
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Nothing to really laugh about there Hugo. As long as it was an easy fix then it's OK. We've all had our fair share of issues like that. Glad you found it and it wasn't an expensive fix. Now watching a guy week after week come back with an untrimmed plane, swerving all over the sky(really scary) and landing(controlled crash is more like it)then throwing plane back in car and refusing help trimming his plane-now that's funny hahahaha!
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Old 02-28-2009, 10:51 PM
  #84  
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Flying a 3DHS 87" Extra 300 SHP, Hacker A60-18L/Spin 99/Xoar 25 x 12 prop. The packs were to see if it could be done on a GS 3D plane. They'll sport fly and IMAC but for 3D they sucked. Too much weight. Went with 12s lipo and all was right. Would have been nice with the charge times but was not meant to be. Batteries were fine when the ESC blew. They powered the motor fine after getting a new ESC. Any voltage around 50v and 80amps is welding power! I joke with my friend in a few years we're going to need Allen Bradley circuit breakers to power up our planes!
Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
EDFRules
Ouch! 14S2P A123's??? Man oh man, you would never want to accidentally short that thing out. These A123 batteries will win! What are you running, a electric jet??

I did accidentally short out a Dewalt pack last year, it sounded like my 180 Amp welder. Burned a hole right through the side of one of the cells. Ruined that cell. BUT, NO FIRE! Not even much smoke. Still flying the remaining 9 cells.

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Old 03-01-2009, 12:01 AM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by EDFrules View Post
Now watching a guy week after week come back with an untrimmed plane, swerving all over the sky(really scary) and landing(controlled crash is more like it)then throwing plane back in car and refusing help trimming his plane-now that's funny hahahaha!
Wow, I didn't know everyone had seen that guy...LOL

Seriousely... I saw a guy with an easystar throwing it and crashing about 15ft away, then picking it up and doing it all over again till he was about 1/4 mile away, then doing it the same all the way back... my first question to the guys was... has anyone tryed to help him... the reply was... Everyone has... Some people Just refuse to listen... So apparently that wasn't even the first time the guy was there doing it.... (wish I had a video) that was seriousely funny....

SK

Last edited by ministeve2003; 05-25-2009 at 06:50 AM.
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Old 03-01-2009, 01:21 AM
  #86  
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Hugo
Much better laughing with you, than crying with you!
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Old 05-21-2009, 04:13 PM
  #87  
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Well, a lot has happened since my last post. The Turnigy did start spitting out magnets, and damaged the rotor while doing so. Bummed out I bought a Hacker A50-16S. Beautiful motor, APC 16x10 prop and no-limit power. But, it did add 150 grams to the nose. I pushed the 6S packs back as far as they would go, but still I needed lead on the tail.

But, I already wanted to go back to 5S for another project, so making this 5S would save weight and restore balance without the lead. So I did that. First class diapointment... The plane didn't get any speed. Would 3D nicely but no more beautiful large moves which require a bit of air speed. This motor is clearly 6S. Hmmm, now what?

Well, fortuntately I crashed the plane, fuse in half, a little while ago. Pilot error 100%, I must confess, but it was time to put the plane on the worktable. Time to
a) add a battery tray and hatch and
b) try another motor. I read a lot about Hyperion and Scorpion, and I went for the motor they produced together, a Hyperion ZS 4020 12-turn, with a 15x8 prop. This prop was also on the Turnigy, which did 7k rpm with it. The ZS should do about 8k, so speed would not be a problem. Here's some pics of the build:





























I've since flown the plane a few times. It is now 2550 grams, 230 less the in the Hacker 6S configuration, and flies great. Hover at 1/2 throttle, about 8 minutes rough flying or over 10 minutes if you behave, on the 5S 4000mAh packs. The motor does 50A, 933W max. The hatch is great, I now assemble the plane in the parking lot and it doesn't come apart until I leave, many hours later.

A bit scared after the crash, I did my first windy-weather landings again, today. Because the weight is down, it's a bit touchy landing crosswind, but we have a grass field so I choose to land straight into the wind. No problem, made 6 flights and went home happy.

Hugo

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Old 05-21-2009, 07:20 PM
  #88  
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Hugo
But, I already wanted to go back to 5S for another project, so making this 5S would save weight and restore balance without the lead. So I did that. First class diapointment... The plane didn't get any speed. Would 3D nicely but no more beautiful large moves which require a bit of air speed. This motor is clearly 6S. Hmmm, now what?

What prop did you use on the Hacker? I'm running my Hacker A50-16S on 6S2P A123 cells in a Hanger 9 Showtime 50. The "How fast is it" gadget shows that it flys at about 75 MPH full throttle, using a APC-E 16X12 prop.

That Hacker needs to pull about 55-60 Amps on the ground.
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Old 05-21-2009, 08:20 PM
  #89  
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Yeah, I know, I stuck with the 16x10. I should have got up in pitch. But I also didn't like the weigth, and it was overpowered, if such a thing exists. You know, this plane is called the X50, but actually it's the S40 with a different color scheme. It's really a 40-size plane, the 50-size Hacker wasn't a good match. I'm really happy with the Hyp now, and I might sell the Hacker or keep it on the shelf for another project, later.

Hugo
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Old 05-22-2009, 10:36 AM
  #90  
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Looks good Hugo. I hated cutting into mine but I don't do wing removals for battery changes either. Gotta do what ya' gotta do. Since Hyperion has partnered with Scorpion now, I think I might try out a 4025 on my next 6s sized project. Looks like they're on the right track now. Would not have considered using another one based on previous experiences.
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Old 05-24-2009, 11:55 PM
  #91  
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What happened to the Funtana with the green covering on the top. It didn't look like the plane in the video?

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Old 05-25-2009, 06:23 AM
  #92  
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Haha! When I took the blue off of the wings, I saw the lines of the plane were much more beautifull without the colour on. So I took the green off of the fuse again, too. This weekend it stood next to a normal blue coloured brother, I 'm happy with my choice.

Hugo
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