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Why join a club?

Old 02-06-2006, 05:47 PM
  #126  
AEAJR
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If you have a working relationship with the ultra lite club, I would contact them and ask that this behavior stop. If they continue, I would photograph the incidents and contact the FAA about this dangerous behavior.

Such behavior is not consistent with safe piloting and should not be tolerated.

I am not a rat or someone trying to get others in trouble, but this borders on criminal.

If I see a guy doing 70 in a 55, I don't necessarily do anything about it. If I see a guy doing 60 in a 55, weaving in and out of cars and creating a danger to one and all, I dial 911 and report it for my sake and the sake of others on the road.

None of this has anything to do with height limits around airports, but I can see you have a problem. I am just offering a suggested approach to fixing it.
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Old 02-06-2006, 11:44 PM
  #127  
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Heres a question....I have a Firebird FF on order, and I"m wondering if clubs accept RTF planes
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Old 02-06-2006, 11:49 PM
  #128  
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Firebird FF???

RTF planes? Depends on the club.

Our club has lots of RTF flyers. I would imagine that most clubs will accept RTFs.

Some have restrictions on what kinds of planes they fly, or that are allowed on their field.

Our club doesn't accept glow or gas planes. And non-glider electrics have to be under 60" wing span and typically under 12 oz wing loadings. This is based on the property owner's restrictions. We either comply or we lose the field.

Your Firebird would be welcome at our field. We would not recommend it as a first plane, but you could join. We have had Firebirds, fighterbirds, Commanders, Aerobirds, T-Hawks, Easy Stars, and lots of other RTFs.
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Old 02-07-2006, 12:02 AM
  #129  
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Sorry...should have said Firebird Freedom. Thanks for the info..I hope my Canadian club accepts them..
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Old 02-07-2006, 01:50 AM
  #130  
rahtware
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Originally Posted by DickCorby View Post
... and trying to help each other have a good time. Which is what this hobby is suppsed to be all about.

Isn’t that what I said???

As far as the other “junk” (in lieu of the actual word I wanted to use) don't project your biases on my situation until we sit down over a cup-O-Joe and go over my actual circumstances.

I guess the fact that the closest "official" club to me is over an hour away should alleviate your worries about me interfering with guys who, you imply have more right to fly then I because they, have paid their dues... And that if the AMA pulled its head out of its.... rule book, it would notice that there is a whole segment of this hobby that is being under represented.

I would love to join back up with the AMA... and maybe even with a club, but I refuse to subsidize other guys because they choose to put something in the air that has potential for great danger (thus raising the cost of insurance for me) and, I refuse to belong to clubs that judge the members by the size of their.... plane!

OBTW, if this isn't the place to "go over" this then why post on the open forum instead of contacting me privately?
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Old 02-07-2006, 02:22 AM
  #131  
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The AMA covers all aspects of the hobby. There are certain restrictions concerning some airplanes that usually involve highly technical skills to fly such as jets that are powered by very expensive motors and require a demonstrated skill to be covered insurance wise.

The cost of your hobby or model is not the issue. It never has been. The location of where you fly is not the issue. It is not the AMA that requires certain things for coverage. The AMA is simply an insurance policy for you, not a club, to ensure that if anything happens that you are covered.

Of course when you entered into you contract with your insurance company you have certain exculsions. Those exclusions are not ever talked about until they effect you personally.

Joining a club is not based on the equipment but the club and what it has to offer. Whoever started that we shouldn't have to be a club member because our plane didn't cost what the other cost is well I don't know. I personally don't think that that is an argument for not complying to rules or protecting yourself from Mrs or Mr. Jo Blow who sues you for little Anny losing an eye or Rover killed by a projectile flying through the air.

Those who think differently don't identify themselves in their equipment and walk away if something goes awry.

That is as simple as I know how to put it. In a society that wants something for nothing. Expecting others to take up the slack that they are not willing to take up themselves.

Makes those that do take up thier own slack wonder why they go through all the trouble.

Peace Said, had to vent.
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Old 02-07-2006, 03:26 AM
  #132  
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Larry,
I was anti AMA for the first several years of flying that I did. We live in a totally rural area, and I felt it was a total waste of money paying the AMA to fly. I've got my own runway, fly over my own land, am surrounded by several thousand acres of farm land, and had no need for insurance. Then I made two discoveries. one was Flyins, the other was when I traveled if I wanted to fly, I needed an AMA card at most any field that I asked to fly at as well as several city parks.

The AMA is really trying to cater to the death to slimers crowd. I wish they would have a no mag membership option but the past year has had several excellent article in the AMA mag on lectrics.

Just my duex centavos....
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Old 02-07-2006, 05:51 AM
  #133  
rahtware
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Originally Posted by Don Sims View Post
Larry,
I was anti AMA for the first several years of flying that I did. We live in a totally rural area, and I felt it was a total waste of money paying the AMA to fly. I've got my own runway, fly over my own land, am surrounded by several thousand acres of farm land, and had no need for insurance. Then I made two discoveries. one was Flyins, the other was when I traveled if I wanted to fly, I needed an AMA card at most any field that I asked to fly at as well as several city parks.

The AMA is really trying to cater to the death to slimers crowd. I wish they would have a no mag membership option but the past year has had several excellent article in the AMA mag on lectrics.

Just my duex centavos....
That suggestion has been made from before I joined in the 80s... And actually, I like the Mag. My problem is with, as you mentioned, the AMA/fuel “friendship.” And it just isn't fuelies, but the BIIIIIIIGG ARF fuelies.

Debbie, I'm not talking about the big jets as that group of fliers still has a high percentage of guys that are responsible... My problem is more with the guys that show up at the field with the giant RTF, 1/3 scale, multi thousand dollar, but no time or talent invested, first time flying RUDDY beginner... Or worse yet the same guy after he learns to actually fly the darn thing (or forth one) and then “knows more then”, anyone with less of a plane… and treats them as less of a flyer/person!

Heck, I almost got run over by a C-Eagle, with a chain saw in the nose… that was being flown, by a rank beginner… and the club “AMA” instructor! And, they (and the rest of the big plane flyers) were more worried about the darn plane then those of us who had to jump out of the way… and the car that it hit! So, yes I would rather fly my 10 oz Pico T-Moth in a school yard after hours then put up with all the garbage that has become “organized” RC.
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Old 02-07-2006, 06:37 AM
  #134  
Geoff_Gino
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Another 2 cents worth.

Count yourselves lucky, those of you who belong to the AMA. From what I can gather, and I stand corrected, if you are a AMA member it would seem that your insurance covers you for Public Liability no matter where you fly.

Not so in South Africa. You need to be a fully paid up member, flying from a registered field, belong to a registered club and have a certificate of compentency from the controlling authority, namely SAMAA which costs us about $70-00 per year.
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Old 02-07-2006, 02:16 PM
  #135  
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Originally Posted by rahtware View Post
That suggestion has been made from before I joined in the 80s... And actually, I like the Mag. My problem is with, as you mentioned, the AMA/fuel “friendship.” And it just isn't fuelies, but the BIIIIIIIGG ARF fuelies.
I must belong to a different AMA. I have only been flying for 3 years so maybe it was different WAY BACK THEN!

The magazine is chock full of articles on electrics. My club doesn't even fly fuel planes. There are several Electric clubs in my area that "allow" fuel and some that are only electric.

It seems that many people confuse the attituedes of the local club with the attitudes of the AMA as a whole. Local clubs are the front line arm of the AMA, but like any other association, each club has its own character.

If you don't like the clubs in your area, start your own. It is actually quite easy.

However I understand that clubs are not for everyone.
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Old 02-16-2006, 01:35 AM
  #136  
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[quote=helo-watt;39437]Well guys (and girls, Deb) all that banter about clubs was really informative. There are two clubs in my area that I know of. Both are rather "clicky, and neither of them is very receptive to the thought of us electric flyers bringing our "toy airplanes" around. I went to the clubs on two occasions: Once with help for helis, and once for help with planes. I tried to join both times. Once I was met with the response, "We don't do electrics here. Come back when you have a real plane."


real plane?
http://www.farfromglory.com/b52.htm

Tell them
I would but you'll need a bigger runway..................
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Old 02-16-2006, 01:52 AM
  #137  
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I am not sure where you live or how much flat ideal spots you may have but I would go find a spot and start my own club. This is one thing I can guarentee....... the entire club does not feel that way and there are probably some there that wish other would just "get over it" and progress.

That mentality is well outdated. Especially with motors that perform every bit as good as any of the glow out there. I will and would put up an E-Flite 46 against a ThunderTiger Pro 46 same plane and test the theory. I think, if it's predominatly a male club, you will find that noise is what make young people happy and old people cranky.

At least that is the case around here. And the older I get the more I appreciate that.

I'm bad. But if I can fly my electric on Sunday's without complaint, performing as well or perhaps even better than my counterpart glow sitting waiting until 1 pm to start up them I will be the one smiling.

Of course my opinion has gotten me into a lot of trouble but I usually don't back down to trouble.

Progress or be left behind. Clubs that prescribe to glow only will be left behind. The increasing cost of fuel and shipping will start to eat away at those and when the battery cost start to come down for reliable batteries then so will the electric acceptance grow. It's checks and balances.

Whew. Vented. Sorry.

It's sad when your in such a diversified hobby and you have such close minded people.

Don't let it stop you. Build your own club and you will be absolutly amazed at the response you will get. Human Nature needs companionship and commradry. Clubs and common interests are how we fullfill that need.
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Old 02-16-2006, 04:17 AM
  #138  
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Bravo well said.....
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Old 02-16-2006, 04:28 AM
  #139  
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Well some people are narrow minded no matter what kind of sport you are into. It seems that the farther north you go the colder the shoulder you get turned in your direction. Guess it goes with the teritory. So start your own club where you fly. I am sure that there are others near you that are having the same problem. Mine is somewhat reversed. I have been flying glow power for several years and now coverting some of my planes to electric. My problem is at my age I seem to have a disconnect between mind and fingers. I cannot get the throw of the planes down and then get to the throttle in time to keep the smaller ones flying. So I have started with the 40 size glow planes I own and am converting them to electric. Eventually i will get the 1/4 scales done also. Planes are a lot quieter and I like no longer using the greasy kids stuff.
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Old 02-23-2006, 09:39 PM
  #140  
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Why join a club?

My Reasons :

#1 Fly anytime of the day on any day of the week.... I remember the first days when trying to find a place to fly after work with soccer in action and then working around sprinkler systems in the early mornings :o .... Or here comes a car, or whoops, someone is strolling in your flight area .... Club flying has the park flying scene beat (does depend on the club though)!

#2 No obstructions in sight. No trees, houses, fences, power poles, etc.

#3 Frequency control in operation.

#4 Help is available as well as a nice bunch of guys and gals.

#5 Area set aside for really small flyers and Heli and 3D type flying. Otherwise your free to mix it up with the glow flyers.

BTW, our club doesn't care 'what' you fly or what it's powered by. Even rockets are welcome during non flying times... We enjoy them all... Just come out and fly. For the first timers who bring say a firebird out for the first time, we help him with it, get 'em flying . No questions asked. Explain the rules to him of course. None of this "Sorry, you can't fly cause you don't have AMA" ... Of course if the person keeps coming out we incourage him to join AMA and the club, as AMA is required by the property owners to really fly out here, but for the small electrics we are a bit lienent in the beginning! Why discourge that first time pilot! Only $25 per year ($35 for me as I have 3 kids) . AMA is only $58 + $3 ($1 per kid) for my family. Not bad at all in my mind. Thinking about joining the 'Y' at $58 per MONTH in comparison....
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Old 04-26-2006, 01:25 AM
  #141  
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Hello guys and gals!

Wow, I found this thread in my search for build tips for a GWS Tiger Moth. After the wonderful read, I felt I had to add my current experience.

The day after Christmas (yes, just 4 short months ago) I bought a Firebird Commander II. I had seen some parkflyers at the park near my house, so I figured I'd join the electric revolution and get back into R/C after a 20 year absence. My hanger now consists of 11 planes!

So I discovered that there was a small group of "regulars" who showed up at this park every weekend. Pretty soon I started flying with them on a regular basis too. Well, the revolution is in full swing, because it seems we gain a new flyer every weekend. There are now over 20 "regulars" who show up every weekend, with about another 10 who are only occassional flyers.

As you can imagine, that many flyers operating at an uncontrolled location was starting to get a little dangerous. Forget about frequency control, our biggest problem is not having a secure flight line. Not to mention those of us (myself included) who bring our kids with us once in a while.

So, over the past several weeks, we have been getting ourselves organized into an AMA chartered club. We should be submitting our final paperwork to the AMA next week. We are also very fortunate to have Wes De Cou living in the Phoenix area. Wes is the western flying site assistance rep, and has gotten us going in the right direction for this club. He will also be assisting us in securing a dedicated flying site.

We are the Arizona WingNutz (www.azwingnutz.org), and we are an electric only club. There are plenty of clubs around that cater to slimers and gliders, so nobody here is missing out. We are working with the city government to acquire some park land for our use as a dedicated flying site, completed with paved runway and covered pavillion.

It will be nice having a controlled flightline, frequency control and AMA insurance. Not to mention a site that we do not have to share with soccer/football/baseball/cricket players or sprinkler systems. The response from the "regulars" for starting this club was overwhelming.

We plan on working with the LHS's (there are about 7 on this side of town alone) by having them point new flyers in our direction for assistance if they want it. Our club will be more fun than formal, we will not require attendance at monthly meetings, we have our own web forum, and the guys are all amicable people. Our dues are only $20 with no initiation fee, but we do require AMA membership.

I have enjoyed the occasion flying session when I was alone at the park. Especially if I am trying to trim out a new plane, or just need open airspace to throw my P-51 around in. But I must say that I enjoy flying with the gang much more. I have gained wisdom and knowledge much faster from the "old timers" than I could have by going it alone. I am so looking forward to getting this club off the ground! So much so that they named me President because of my enthusiasm! :p
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Old 04-26-2006, 01:48 AM
  #142  
pilotpete2
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Ed,
Sounds like you belong to the same AMA I do, they are really trying, but there is so much to cover.

RClark,
Your clubs sound a bit like mine, the dues, 20 bucks, the benefits, priceless
Regards,
Pete
AMA 305002
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Old 04-26-2006, 02:38 AM
  #143  
DickCorby
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Originally Posted by John Seidelman View Post
The only drawback to joining a club like the AMA is The Price. You can buy another plane for that kind of money. And fly free!
The AMA is researching having a Park Flyer Rate for those that don't want to pay for full membership.
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Old 04-26-2006, 04:49 AM
  #144  
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crxmanpat vbmenu_register("postmenu_65953", true);

Great story! Good luck with the new club!
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Old 04-26-2006, 05:46 AM
  #145  
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Originally Posted by crxmanpat View Post
I am so looking forward to getting this club off the ground! So much so that they named me President because of my enthusiasm! :p
And cause noone else was dumb enough... er... "enthusiastic enough" to do it.

As Pat said, our reasons for forming the AZ WingNutz are primarily safety, liability protection, and for fun. There's something to be said for simply being a part of something like this - some people may think that's not really a good reason, but it's certainly valid for me.

Brian

edited to add: just read the first couple posts in this thread... now I have to read the rest of it. There goes tomorrow's productivity...
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Old 04-26-2006, 05:49 AM
  #146  
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I just clicked to the end of this thread and apologize if I missed this, but what does the AMA insurance cover beyond your own liabillity insurance? I'm a newbie, just asking? Thanks , jim
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Old 04-26-2006, 06:54 AM
  #147  
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Originally Posted by bsoder View Post
And cause noone else was dumb enough... er... "enthusiastic enough" to do it.
Brian
Thank you Mr Secretary

Jim, depending on where you are flying, the AMA liability insurance will either be primary (usually in the case of flying at an AMA sanctioned field), or secondary (flying at a public park for example, and it would be secondary to other insurance, such as homeowners).

If you go back in the thread, Debbie Hicks (debhicks) provided some good links to the AMA pages dealing with insurance. I guess what it boils down to is it's better to have too much coverage than not enough. And $58 a year is a pretty cheap insurance policy if you ask me.
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Old 04-26-2006, 04:13 PM
  #148  
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Originally Posted by crxmanpat View Post
Thank you Mr Secretary
Hey, that's Mr. Secretary & Treasurer to you, bub.

Jim, depending on where you are flying, the AMA liability insurance will either be primary (usually in the case of flying at an AMA sanctioned field), or secondary (flying at a public park for example, and it would be secondary to other insurance, such as homeowners).
I've heard that some homeowners insurance won't cover an RC accident. Don't know how true that is tho.
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Old 04-26-2006, 07:10 PM
  #149  
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Depends on the policy. Some people have claimed that their homeowner's doesn't cover R/C activities off-premises. I don't think mine does from reading the policy.

AMA insurance is ALWAYS secondary to any other insurance you may have that covers R/C activities. That's why AMA membership isn't $100 a year, or more.
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Old 05-29-2006, 04:45 AM
  #150  
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Default Good club here

I jumped into this hobby like many I would guess... caught the bug and bought an RTF Firebird Freedom. Promptly put it up 35 feet in a tree. It took 5 days and about a dozen trips through the woods just to find it, and another half day to retrieve it from the tree. Luckily, no rain during that time. After this I decided to : 1. Get a slower plane to train with, (acquired a Slo-V and we are getting along quite well)...the Freedom is safely in it's box, waiting for my skills to improve enough to be comfortable with 30 mph or so speeds. 2. Find a bigger place to fly, and 3. Get some help. Step 3 should have been first.

I was introduced to our local club by a friend who had mentioned he was an RC flyer to me on an earlier occasion. The first Sunday I went out to the local field to watch, one of the guys hooked up a buddy box and let me fly his nitro trainer...I had never met this guy before in my life. So far they have all been extremely nice, trying to help in any way possible, even though most of them fly big, gas planes. They don't seem to have any problems with RTF's, even the 27 mhz. variety. They have a pretty good size field leased, and for a measly $50 a year I have access to it any time I want to go out and fly.

They do require AMA membership, but I don't have a problem with this requirement. The insurance is a good deal, and you get the magazine sub as well. I would strongly recommend checking into a local club when you get started in this hobby, if you are at all serious about it.
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